[R&F] When to build Government Plaza?

h0nk0815

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I watched some of quill18's streams/LPs an he did not prioritize building the GP. In the Cree LP he didn't build it in the Georgia stream he built it after beeing in Tier 2 Government. Even than there was not much to build otherwise he didn't consider building it. So either did he forget something important like the governor titles, legacy cards or adjacency bonusses OR are those things not that important in the early game? I always assumed it would be good to build it early on (eg. Classic).

What do you think? When are you planning to build your GP: early, mid or even late game?
 

Giskler

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Depends on how the game unfolds. Run into another civ right next door? You want it ASAP for the Loyalty pressure. Getting close to changing to Tier 2 government? You want to get that legacy card. Problems getting good adjacency bonuses? Use GP to boost your districts. It's very situational. There are good cases for spending production on other districts in numerous situations.
 

Naktis

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nobody knows yet , its all knew mechanics and quill18 still build tons of towns , conquered a lot , I think he played too spread out which is ok for vanilla game , but I doubt its good for R&F
 

Siptah

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I noticed that, too, in other streams. My understanding as of now (just watching things) is that it won‘t be the first district you build. You‘ll put down a campus or a holy site first in most cases. However, I think it is a neat 2nd district for the capital or first district in the 2nd/3rd city. Waiting until a tier 2 government seems definitely too long. I can envision some strategies to build it and its first building (warlord‘s throne) asap as well. Looking forward to see how it turns out.
 

h0nk0815

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I think it's a bit early to say when to build considering none of us played it yet? I will just put it up when it seems like the best thing to build.

Yes, I know. This is a speculative threat, like there are many others right now. But I believe some experts can judge by the mechanics itself as well as by what is shown in the streams/LPs and give an educated guess. That is what I'm looking for.

Another interesting questions comes to my mind, which can only be answered by playtesting, of course: because quill18 built the GP while he was in Monarchy, he didn't get the tier 1 legacy card. What would happen if he switched back to a tier 1 government? Would he get the respective card? This is a very theoretical question for sure and normally nobody does a government downgrade, but perhaps it could be viable to get a missed legacy card... (e.g. if you have a 1 turn civic on hold and before switching from t2 to t3: monarchy -> autocracy for 1 turn to get the card -> democracy)
 

stealth_nsk

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I think the most effective placement of GP is a bit away from the first city for most effective loyalty pressure. So it will depend a lot on the map size and layout. On Standard Continents, probably 3rd-6th city GP will be map-optimal, but you may need its bonuses earlier...

A lot of things to consider.
 
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Marbozir has been building it quite early in his games. Interesting contrast with Quil's style, but Quill is playing like it's vanilla civ6, and he forgets a lot because he plays fast. Though I like his fast play otherwise I fall asleep watching people doing builder improvements and other routine stuff.

If you plan on building the building for faster settlers, it makes sense to build this ear!y. I think it's meant to be an early build. I'd say 2nd district.
 

Boyan_Sun

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What I'm curious about is if you completed a government building of tier 1 in Monarchy, can you get the legacy card of Monarchy. If so, does it mean that a Tier 3 government (i.e.Democracy) can also get a legacy card from it? It would be very interesting if we could have a communist government with a fascist/democracy legacy card.
 

h0nk0815

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It would be very interesting if we could have a communist government with a fascist/democracy legacy card.

AFAIK this is possible. The legacy card is unlocked at the time you build the tier3 building. And if you are in Democrcy than you get the Democracy card even if you switch to another government later on. This is at least my understandig of the mechanic. I would be glad if someone could verify/falsify this.
 

Giskler

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What I'm curious about is if you completed a government building of tier 1 in Monarchy, can you get the legacy card of Monarchy. If so, does it mean that a Tier 3 government (i.e.Democracy) can also get a legacy card from it? It would be very interesting if we could have a communist government with a fascist/democracy legacy card.

The wording on Tier 1 GP buildings is "Unlocks the Legacy Policy Card for the current Tier 1 government type." So, no it wouldn't give you a Monarchy legacy card.

AFAIK this is possible. The legacy card is unlocked at the time you build the tier3 building. And if you are in Democrcy than you get the Democracy card even if you switch to another government later on. This is at least my understandig of the mechanic. I would be glad if someone could verify/falsify this.
Marbozir built the tier 3 building, but didn't switch government so couldn't verify.
 

drubell

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It could be that you have a game where you don't feel that you won't have a loyalty problem early and you're not interested in the legacy card for a while. Government Plaza takes up a district slot, right? (i.e. not like the Neighborhood/Aqueduct)
 

Giskler

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It could be that you have a game where you don't feel that you won't have a loyalty problem early and you're not interested in the legacy card for a while. Government Plaza takes up a district slot, right? (i.e. not like the Neighborhood/Aqueduct)
It takes up a district slot, yes.
 

Siptah

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It could be that you have a game where you don't feel that you won't have a loyalty problem early and you're not interested in the legacy card for a while. Government Plaza takes up a district slot, right? (i.e. not like the Neighborhood/Aqueduct)
But the first tier buildings are quite good. You‘ll want the colonization or conquest focused ones early in most games. They are quite powerful.
 

leandrombraz

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As a peaceful player, I plan to unlock Magnus for his ability to train settlers to not consume a population, so I might as well use harvest to build the governor district and the Ancestral Hall (50% increased Production towards Settlers. New cities receive a free Builder) as soon as it's available, then spam Settlers like crazy with 100% discount on production (Ancestral Hall + Colonization policy) , without losing population in my capital and getting a free builder in every city. If you can get to the tier 1 government fast, this sounds like a good plan.


I think it really depend on strategy. You might really want that governor title ASAP depend on what you're trying to do and more important, you might really want that tier 1 government building.
 

Siptah

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As a peaceful player, I plan to unlock Magnus for his ability to train settlers to not consume a population, so I might as well use harvest to build the governor district and the Ancestral Hall (50% increased Production towards Settlers. New cities receive a free Builder) as soon as it's available, then spam Settlers like crazy with 100% discount on production (Ancestral Hall + Colonization policy) , without losing population in my capital and getting a free builder in every city. If you can get to the tier 1 government fast, this sounds like a good plan.


I think it really depend on strategy. You might really want that governor title ASAP depend on what you're trying to do and more important, you might really want that tier 1 government building.
This is certainly one of the strategies I want to try as well. However, it doesn‘t mean GP asap. Might still be preferable to get a campus. It depends on your culture output. If you need to wait for the civics to unlock, you might as well build that campus. Needless to say, if you want a religion, the holy site is still first priority.
I guess the strategy works well with Rome and Gorgo due to their early culture advantage. Early culture improvements might help as well.
 

darkace77450

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I'll be building mine either right before or right after my initial settler rush, depending on whether or not I make the Audience Chamber or Ancestral Hall a mainstay in my play style.
 

Phoenix1595

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As a peaceful player, I plan to unlock Magnus for his ability to train settlers to not consume a population, so I might as well use harvest to build the governor district and the Ancestral Hall (50% increased Production towards Settlers. New cities receive a free Builder) as soon as it's available, then spam Settlers like crazy with 100% discount on production (Ancestral Hall + Colonization policy) , without losing population in my capital and getting a free builder in every city. If you can get to the tier 1 government fast, this sounds like a good plan.


I think it really depend on strategy. You might really want that governor title ASAP depend on what you're trying to do and more important, you might really want that tier 1 government building.

This is going to be my initial strategy as well. The free builders and settler discounts of Ancestral Hall are just too good to give up, and setting up an early GP seems to be crucial. I plan to put GP in a 2nd city, though, not my capital.
 
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