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Where to settle the 4th city?

Discussion in 'Civ4 - Strategy & Tips' started by guermantes, Jan 18, 2016.

  1. guermantes

    guermantes Emperor wannabe

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    I am trying my first game on Emperor.
    I built my 4th settler in order to claim the gold and flood plains to the South. But I hesitate; should I block Isabella to the North first even though a city up there will be less profitable? I am basically considering settling either of the two blue circles. (Iron may pop anywhere)

     
  2. lymond

    lymond Rise Up! (Phoenix Style!) Hall of Fame Staff

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    why are you teching IW?

    cow/gold looks fine..it can help with cottages.

    I'd be teching HBR and go kill england

    2 pop whip that worker in Prague

    edit: oh is that a settler down there near cows? what is it doing?

    I would not build any more settlers for now and just focus on teching to HBR and killing peoples

    you have a pretty good start..not sure about your teching situation, but the map seems nice
     
  3. Gumbolt

    Gumbolt Phoenix Rising

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    The banana spot is terrible. Apart from blocking the Ai what purpose does it serve?? You already have horse here. I prefer the cow and flood plains down south.

    Sooner or later the Spanish will attack you. She is a warmonger by nature. I would be thinking how to take down English or Spanish here. You might consider gifting Spanish a useless city to get Isabella to pleased.

    As for IW as current tech. Waste of time. Better to head for construction and take down 1-2 Ai for their land. You will fast be blocked in here. You have copper to attack with axes. The Ai are pretty close to make this work.

    Not sure you have enough workers here. Cottages on flood plains and that gold will really kick start your economy.

    Have you switched to slavery yet?? Don't be afraid to whip here.
     
  4. guermantes

    guermantes Emperor wannabe

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    IW has become somewhat of a habit, probably because I mistakenly thought it lead to MC and forges. And I usually skip HR until it's time to elepult. Never done very well with horse archers, maybe I should try them now while heading towards Construction.

    If you refer to my cows it's a spawnbuster (time to move Eastwards), if you refer to Churchill's cows, it's just a barb archer.

    Good idea gifting to Isabella to get her on my good side while warring to the West. Will try!
     
  5. lymond

    lymond Rise Up! (Phoenix Style!) Hall of Fame Staff

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    eastward? Settle right there next to the cow..on the fp or 1W of cow

    The time to elepult is when you have HBR..sooner the better. But HAs are highly effective on this level, but not if you are messing around with teching IW.

    you should almost never tech IW yourself.

    screw Izzy..kill her! take her holy city and religion

    advice:

    1) make better tech choices
    2) be more proactive
    3) whip
    4) accumulate gold at 0% research early while expanding to fund full research
     
  6. guermantes

    guermantes Emperor wannabe

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    I'll try to better myself. :hatsoff: Thanks!
     
  7. InovA

    InovA Immortal

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    Could you clarify a bit on this one for me?

    Do you mean it is better to have 1 turn with 0% and 5 turns with 100% than to have 6 turns with ~70%?

    Or do you mean to, after getting 3 or so cities, set research to 0% until you have ~6 cities that all have library finished or something?

    In a case like this would you still want to beeline alpha before setting to 0% or get priesthood for oracle first, etc.?
     
  8. lymond

    lymond Rise Up! (Phoenix Style!) Hall of Fame Staff

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    I expect you to crush Deity a week from today, good sir! :D
     
  9. lymond

    lymond Rise Up! (Phoenix Style!) Hall of Fame Staff

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    In some ways this is a more complex mechanic to explain. It's called binary research.

    It's also a bit relative to the difficulty level you play, as maintenance costs go up substantially on higher difficulties, so it becomes more important.

    Generally speaking, while at 1 city (starting capital) you will be able to research at 100% without running a deficit.

    Typical play is to get worker techs (food/BW) and then tech to writing. Around this point you will likely settle your first city, or even second.

    The point is that once you settle your first new city you will start running deficit research. Unless you are playing lucky huts and hit gold or attacked someone and pillaged a bit, you will likely start losing your bank rather quickly. At this point, it is better to run 0% until you can fund the next tech you want at 100%.

    Also, a common play is to do this upon hitting writing. Run 0% until your first library or two is up (not all cities need libraries necessarily, but certainly build them where it makes sense). This way you are funding research prior to getting the beaker multipliers in place.

    Other things to consider is that at 0% you still research at a rate of 1bpt..that is your default. Due to rounding and other stuff it is better to go 0% than running X% during the early stages. Furthermore, you also may get bonuses on techs during this time from meeting other AIs and their discovery of techs.

    Also, simply there is the factor of funding early expansion. You want to create a balance between expansion (or conquest), economy, and researching the things you need to take the next step one way or another.

    Later on, you will have more beaker multipliers in place so that you want to keep your slider at 100% as much as you can, or even at X%. You will have more options to acquire gold as well to fund this research. But early on a real balance is required so that you can comfortably expand or conquer. All this becomes much more critical as you move up levels.

    Hope that helps.. kinda hard to explain. Others are better at it.

    So to answer your questions:

    Yes, it is better to fund research in the early game. This doesn't preclude alpha beeline or oracle attempt. You are funding whatever you tech. I start doing this the moment I start hitting deficit research...and at the point I'm building libraries.

    The point here is that many less experienced players base the health of their economy on the slider continuing to drop % points. Judge your economy by a) gold you earn at 0% research b) beakers per turn at 100%. What is happening at 70% or 50% or 30% is irrelevant.
     
  10. Pangaea

    Pangaea Rock N Roller

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    Excellent overview by lymond, and I hope many anonymous readers pay attention too.

    One more point I'd like to add, is that by running research at 0% until you can fully fund the next tech you want, also has a benefit for tech trades. Lets say you start teching (at 0%) Alpha. Then you notice that some other AI has got Alpha. At this point it's kind of pointless for you to continue teching on Alpha, as you can get it in trade, so when you have accumulated enough gold to fully research another tech, you can choose for instance Aesthetics instead, and thereby use that tech to get Alpha "for free".

    The higher the level you play, the more beakers you need to give away (you won't get 1:1 trades), but it's a very good habit to internalise.
     
  11. dutchfire

    dutchfire Moderator Moderator

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    I seem to recall that AI factor in how many beakers you've invested in a tech when trading
     
  12. Pangaea

    Pangaea Rock N Roller

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    Yeah, they do that too, which means if you can't get a trade going, teching a little bit of the tech you want yourself first will usually smooth things over (as long as the AI isn't teching the "trade away" tech themselves of course).
     
  13. futurehermit

    futurehermit Chieftain

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    With copper between you and England, England should be smarting from your axes already
     

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