Where's Israel?

[Lord Britannia]

I'v been wondering why the past couple Civs (never played Civ2) left out Israel. They were quite the super power in ancient times and are pretty powerful again. Not to mention that King David is one of the most well known kings of all time and arguable one of the best. I mean I could easy see them competing with old rivals like Persia and Babylon. Any thoughts if we might see them in expansions? btw this is my 1st post ever, hi everyone.

 

[Jerrymander]

Including Israel in the game would make it unsellable in Muslim markets.

 

[lietkynes]

don't do this

 

[Lord Britannia]

Including Israel in the game would make it unsellable in Muslim markets.

How is that? That way Palistine could actually beat them, and as many times as they wanted. And if thats your position what about the Jewish market, they've included Arabia and Germany after all.

 

[Olleus]

yes, but Israel is more tolerant of other views than a lot of the arabic world.

Anyway, they dont deserve to be in, Israel was almost constantly under either Egyptian, Babylonian or some other Mesopotamian power's rule for its entire history.

 

[Infiltrator]

Agreed with the above.. Israel hasn't seen autonomy for quite a bit.

 

[Lord Britannia]

yes, but Israel is more tolerant of other views than a lot of the arabic world.

Anyway, they dont deserve to be in, Israel was almost constantly under either Egyptian, Babylonian or some other Mesopotamian power's rule for its entire history.

I recall correctly they were in Call to power, and they stood atleast 200 years, which is about the age of America. Plus as I said, they are a power again.

 

[Azazell]

Israel? Is has a small history ;/ but where is Poland?

 

[Art Grin]

How is that? That way Palistine could actually beat them, and as many times as they wanted. And if thats your position what about the Jewish market, they've included Arabia and Germany after all.

Israel has a population of 7,6 million people.
The Arab nation posses a population of 358 million people.
I think it's easy to see which is the more profitable market.

Another problem is that Israel was independent during the ancient era and modern era, but its under Egyptian, Babylonian, Assyrian, Persian, Greek, Roman/Byzantine, Arab, French(Crusades) or Ottoman rule during the classical, medieval, renaissance and industrial era if speaking in civ terms.

 

[Olleus]

I recall correctly they were in Call to power, and they stood atleast 200 years, which is about the age of America. Plus as I said, they are a power again.

Yes, but 200 years in the modern era is more important than 200 years in the ancient era when it comes to civ. Israel existed for the equivalent of half a dozen turns, America for 150. You're not seriously suggesting that we include every mesopotamian civilization that existed for 200 years? That would more than double the number of civs in game.

Forgot about Call to Power, didn't remember them being in 1 and never got 2.

 

[Lord Britannia]

Israel has a population of 7,6 million people.
The Arab nation posses a population of 358 million people.
I think it's easy to see which is the more profitable market.

Another problem is that Israel was independent during the ancient era and modern era, but its under Egyptian, Babylonian, Assyrian, Persian, Greek, Roman/Byzantine, Arab, French(Crusades) or Ottoman rule during the classical, medieval, renaissance and industrial era if speaking in civ terms.

And Babylon and Persia don't exist at all any more. My point is they've had a big impact on history in their times they atleast deserve a spot on Civ, especially with all the abstract Civs that do get in.

 

[marioflag]

A Jewish civilization would be really welcome and i think it really deserves a place in Civ5 for their influence in history.
Jewish history is a lot more ancient than modern Israel.

 

[Lord Britannia]

A Jewish civilization would be really welcome and i think it really deserves a place in Civ5 for their influence in history.
Jewish history is a lot more ancient than modern Israel.

Thank you! Someone that agrees with me. it was beginning to feel like most of my Civ games where everyone gangsup on me lol

 

[snipperrabbit!!]

What's up with those annoying threads ? Maybe a perma-ban will stop those !

 

[Art Grin]

And Babylon and Persia don't exist at all any more.

I agree that some of the former masters of Israel don't exist anymore, but I have to disappoint you since Persia does exist. It just uses it's native name Iran. Persia was a name derived from what the Greeks called Iran, even during ancient times the Persian called themselves Iranians.

Just as Lord Olleus stated being important for 200 years in modern times is far more an achievement than being important during ancient times.

Edit: Welcome to Civfanaitics.

 

[Tarkhan]

A jewish civ? Yes. Israel? No.

Israel has 50 years of history as a nation. If it were in the game, then I could argue that Canada deserves a place in the civ roster, as it's been independent since 1867.

Civs ought to be added based on how long they've lasted, and their influence on world history. The Americans are young, relative to many of the civs in the game (greece, siam, etc) but have had a large effect on history since becoming a nation. Greece hasn't had a large effect recently, but ancient greece was the biggest civ in the world at one point, during Alexander's campaign.

 

[marioflag]

What's up with those annoying threads ? Maybe a perma-ban will stop those !

I don't see why this thread is annoying, or trolling. If the OP was asking for the inclusion of Celts or Carthage, would it be that different than asking the inclusion of a Jewish civilization?

 

[Art Grin]

I don't see why this thread is annoying, or trolling. If the OP was asking for the inclusion of Celts or Carthage, would it be that different than asking the inclusion of a Jewish civilization?

I agree, as long as we remain polite and don't troll this thread is just fine. I don't understand why immediately hate such thread. We are discussing the inclusion of a civilization which deserves a spot in future civ games, just like Carthage or the Celts.

 

[Tarkhan]

They should respond to it with modding tools.

A lot of civs got cut for Civ5, and I think it'd probably be best for them to get a good game with a few civs in it, than a shoddy game with every civ under the sun as an option.

We can mod in civs, i'm assuming. But we probably won't get those fancy animated leaders that the included civs get.

 

[SalmonSoil]

I think having Jerusaleum as a City state would be the best idea.
In fact I was surprised that it wasn't in the list.