Which female leaders would you want for various civilizations?

TheSpaceCowboy

TheSpaceCowboy

The Gangster of Love
Joined
Jul 14, 2013
Messages
556
I’ve never been of the persuasion that Civilization needs an equal amount of male and female leaders, nor a believer of the idea now in vogue that demographic representation is a first order value, but seeing as Firaxis probably leans towards those mindsets, and given that female leaders certainly add an aesthetic variety to the game, it’s an interesting thought experiment to ask which prominent females from history* would be fitting leaders* of their respective civilizations in the game.

There’s no need to limit your answer to only announced or likely civs, nor to omit civs with leaders already announced, nor to exclude female leaders for civilizations which would be better led by a male countryman.

*Or pseudo-history, legends, or mythology. The actual historical record can at times be scant regarding females
**leader strictly in the game mechanic sense, not necessarily a political leader per se.

I’ll get things started (in alphabetical order):
  • America - Jackie Kennedy
  • Anglo-Saxons - Lady Godiva
  • Argentina - Eva Perón
  • Britons - Boudica, Guinevere
  • Byzantium - Saint Helena, Theodora
  • Carthage - Dido
  • Egypt - Cleopatra, Nefertiti
  • England - Elizabeth I, Victoria
  • France - Joan of Arc, Marie Antionette
  • Germany - Gudrun
  • Greece - Helen, Hippolyta
  • Hawaii - Liliʻuokalani
  • Israel - Ruth
  • Norway - Lagertha
  • Persians - Esther
  • Powhatan - Pocahontas
  • Rome - Lucretia, Rhea Silvia
  • Russia - Anastasia
  • Shoshone - Sacagawea
  • Spain - Isabelle
 
Spain: Urraca
Malay: Siti Wan Kembang
Denmark: Margrethe I
England: Aethelflaed, Florence Nightingale
China: Hua Mulan, Ching Shih
Iroquois: Molly Brant
India: Lalleshwari, Lakshmibai
Byzantium: Anna Komnenos
Ottomans: Hurrem Sultan
Hittites: Puduhepa
Mongolia: Mandukhai, Töregene
France: Émilie du Châtelet
Italy: Matilda di Canossa
Greece: Laskarina Bouboulina,
Persia: Nur Jahan
Taino: Anacaona


There are many, but the above list is a start. :-)
 
Remember, everyone, leaders do not need to be tied to a civilization anymore.
 
Yeah, Eleanor's inclusion arguably came one cycle too soon. Evenso, I could imagine her making a return in Civ7, since I do believe she's popular enough with the Civ6 players to warrant it.
 
Maria Theresa
Eva Peron
Isabella
Catherine the Great
Elizabeth I
Margaret I
Dihya
Sayyida al Hurra
Lord Lakely said:
Persia: Nur Jahan
Click to expand...
She was Persian, but she was the wife of a Mughal Emperor. Though she would make a good associated leader for both.
 
Olleus said:
Oh, I didn't even realise she was in Civ6 lol
Click to expand...
Yeah, she was the first ever leader that could lead two different civs, England and France. In fact, I'm pretty sure she's one of the main reason Civ 7 is coming with the Normans.
 
Celts (Brigantes) - Cartimandua
A leader that builds a network of alliances but is also prepared to backstab her allies (well her husband lol) could be a unique niche in terms of gameplay. Like Boudica, you can certainly argue that in the end she “lost” though.
Also random info - I first learnt about her when I travelled to a few ruins in northern England from her time period.
 
I absolutely forgot Cartimandua existed until this moment; Yeah, I think she'd be a great alternative to Boudicca for a female Celtic leader. (though my personal choice for a celtic leader is Diviviacus because a druid would be a perfect fit for Civ7's leader mould)
 
I agree with the OP's original disclaimer: there's no need to scrap the barrel for female leaders.
Use female leaders when they were actually prominent leading and defining figures for their respective civilizations (the duo of English queens is a perfect example), but otherwise, as much as we may deplore it now, men were for the most part cast in that role.
Instead of presenting a revisionist version of History so that the past should conform to present sensibilities, use game mechanisms.
Use the tech tree and social policies to improve your civ when introducing gender equality, while having the player need to defend those advances (diplo penalties with more socially backwards civs?). And make those options available earlier than in real History.
(And in all honesty, I would simply do away with the whole "Leader" concept).

It's like the casting of Black actors for Elves in Rings of Power: there, they can be members of the master race too. Job done about promoting inclusion.
Except... not. It's the stupid, lazy, and ineffective way of going about it.
Show on the contrary that the Elves "master race" is the one on the decline. That the Human's cauldron of different cultures is what makes their actual superiority to the stagnating Elves.
Show, don't tell.

Edit:
Thinking about it, what Firaxis could have done is go for an asymetrical setup: make all the historical leaders AI-only, while place the player firmly in alt-history territory.
Have the leader selection for the player those leaders who failed to take a prominent role: be it a lost battle, a failed revolution, or social rules stacked against them.
Then you could really have a varied and eclectic selection of what-ifs.

Eleanor for instance would be great in that scenario.
She was imo a stupid choice in Civ VI: she was Queen of France for the briefest time, and was sidelined by her husband as Queen of England. She can't be held as a figurehead for either.
But she certainly was quite the badass lady! I can't figure how come we still haven't had a TV series about her with the kind of life she's had (from a very young Duchess of Aquitaine, arguably more powerful than her suzerain, to the Crusades, to Queen of both kingdoms, and as an old lady, she still saddled up to negociate the ransom for her son!).
She would be perfect as an alt-history leader.
 
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Newcomers
-Anna Comnena: Rome; Byzantium
-Anita Garibaldi: Brazil; Italy
-Mary Stuart: Scotland; Britain
-Anacaona: Taino

Comebacks:
-Eleanor: Normans;France; Britain
-Dido: Carthage
-Tamar: Georgia; URSS(maybe?)
-Old angry lady Wilhelmina for meme value
 
TheSpaceCowboy said:
I’ve never been of the persuasion that Civilization needs an equal amount of male and female leaders, nor a believer of the idea now in vogue that demographic representation is a first order value, but seeing as Firaxis probably leans towards those mindsets, and given that female leaders certainly add an aesthetic variety to the game, it’s an interesting thought experiment to ask which prominent females from history* would be fitting leaders* of their respective civilizations in the game.

There’s no need to limit your answer to only announced or likely civs, nor to omit civs with leaders already announced, nor to exclude female leaders for civilizations which would be better led by a male countryman.

*Or pseudo-history, legends, or mythology. The actual historical record can at times be scant regarding females
**leader strictly in the game mechanic sense, not necessarily a political leader per se.

I’ll get things started (in alphabetical order):
  • America - Jackie Kennedy
  • Anglo-Saxons - Lady Godiva
  • Argentina - Eva Perón
  • Britons - Boudica, Guinevere
  • Byzantium - Saint Helena, Theodora
  • Carthage - Dido
  • Egypt - Cleopatra, Nefertiti
  • England - Elizabeth I, Victoria
  • France - Joan of Arc, Marie Antionette
  • Germany - Gudrun
  • Greece - Helen, Hippolyta
  • Hawaii - Liliʻuokalani
  • Israel - Ruth
  • Norway - Lagertha
  • Persians - Esther
  • Powhatan - Pocahontas
  • Rome - Lucretia, Rhea Silvia
  • Russia - Anastasia
  • Shoshone - Sacagawea
  • Spain - Isabelle
Click to expand...
I see what you’re up to.
 
Thrasybulos said:
I agree with the OP's original disclaimer: there's no need to scrap the barrel for female leaders.
Use female leaders when they were actually prominent leading and defining figures for their respective civilizations (the duo of English queens is a perfect example), but otherwise, as much as we may deplore it now, men were for the most part cast in that role.
Instead of presenting a revisionist version of History so that the past should conform to present sensibilities, use game mechanisms.
Use the tech tree and social policies to improve your civ when introducing gender equality, while having the player need to defend those advances (diplo penalties with more socially backwards civs?). And make those options available earlier than in real History.
(And in all honesty, I would simply do away with the whole "Leader" concept).

It's like the casting of Black actors for Elves in Rings of Power: there, they can be members of the master race too. Job done about promoting inclusion.
Except... not. It's the stupid, lazy, and ineffective way of going about it.
Show on the contrary that the Elves "master race" is the one on the decline. That the Human's cauldron of different cultures is what makes their actual superiority to the stagnating Elves.
Show, don't tell.

Edit:
Thinking about it, what Firaxis could have done is go for an asymetrical setup: make all the historical leaders AI-only, while place the player firmly in alt-history territory.
Have the leader selection for the player those leaders who failed to take a prominent role: be it a lost battle, a failed revolution, or social rules stacked against them.
Then you could really have a varied and eclectic selection of what-ifs.

Eleanor for instance would be great in that scenario.
She was imo a stupid choice in Civ VI: she was Queen of France for the briefest time, and was sidelined by her husband as Queen of England. She can't be held as a figurehead for either.
But she certainly was quite the badass lady! I can't figure how come we still haven't had a TV series about her with the kind of life she's had (from a very young Duchess of Aquitaine, arguably more powerful than her suzerain, to the Crusades, to Queen of both kingdoms, and as an old lady, she still saddled up to negociate the ransom for her son!).
She would be perfect as an alt-history leader.
Click to expand...
Having non political leader is fine
It allows more variety and prevent having always the same women, while showing influential people weren't only the head of state
 
Latona, for Italy and Greece?
But also Hecate, Core, Persefone, Euridice, Helen.

Hypatia was a great scientist, leader yes, it depends on what these leaders then actually do...
I'd take all of them in various positions if I could, and would play with Greece-Greece-Italy
 
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TheSpaceCowboy said:
I’ll get things started (in alphabetical order):
  • America - Jackie Kennedy
  • Rome - Lucretia, Rhea Silvia
Click to expand...
Lucretia Borgia???? That is an interesting one....

I'm more for a Jackie Kennedy type, but wow, you picked up some of the most beautiful and elegant women of their respective times, that's for sure...
 
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