Discussion in 'Off-Topic' started by RomaGypsy, Nov 18, 2016.
Eh? "Rabid fudge memes"? Are we still on birds, here?
We are! Elitist birds...
Gabbard is a weird one. She's been pro-Assad, she has refused to condemn Bannon, hasn't supported gun control, and has voted on tightening up refugee programs. She's a populist, including her staunch opposition to the TPP, but she's also a conservative as a democrat on a variety of issues.
That's another thing about the class of people, democrats and republicans, rust belt folks, that gave Trump the election. They are largely hunters, they are the gun owners who don't choose to lose their rights.
I bet they would surrender the privilege to attend a Trump rally.
I bet they went to the Trump rally so they wouldn't lose their rights. "Privilege" my arse...
Read Heller. It is a privilege. Try to attend a Trump rally while maintaining the so-called right.
"Although we do not undertake an exhaustive historical analysis today of the full scope of the Second Amendment, nothing in our opinion should be taken to cast doubt on longstanding prohibitions on the possession of firearms by felons and the mentally ill, or laws forbidding the carrying of firearms in sensitive places such as schools and government buildings, or laws imposing conditions and qualifications on the commercial sale of arms."
"[a]ssuming that Heller is not disqualified from the exercise of Second Amendment rights, the District must permit him to register his handgun and must issue him a license to carry it in the home."
Has gun control legislation actually impacted on the accessibility of hunting weapons in these states? Is it likely to do so in the future?
It seems like the sorts of regulations which impact on hunters are specifically directed at hunters: on when and where they can hunt, on what they can hunt, and on what they can use to do it with. I haven't seen either candidate- any candidate, for that matter, express any particular interest in that topic.
Some nut is getting a gun so Joe Sixpack has to give up his hunting rifle? Are you serious? Since he lost his job when the plant shut down Joe has been feeding his family venison and turnips, so he voted Trump, and btw he's the reason Trump won. Now you want to take away his rifle. Good luck with that.
I saw that she has a few positions like this, and they make me think she's somewhat more likely to go over well in the Midwest than the median Hawaiian liberal would. These are mostly points in her favor from an electability standpoint. And, FWIW, I agree with her that Assad is preferable to the "moderate Syrian rebels", although mostly I'd rather stay out of that conflict entirely and make the Russians and Iranians shoulder all the costs.
Roughly 6% of Americans hunt. About 12-15m. Hardly a plurality. Let's not get too drunk on our election narratives here.
How many votes did Trump win by in the rust belt?
We don't know. Do you? Results are available by county or state, but not very large, ill-defined regions like "Rust Belt".
I was making a point. Votes are tabulated by whatever, and contribute to the state. The rural areas overcame the cities. The city folk don't hunt, they aren't effected by plant closings, they just don't get it. As further proof I offer this: Trump won the election.
In order to win Trump had to win blue states, or states that contain a lot of democrats. Those democrats are the ones who elected Obama, but this time they elected Trump, you tell me why.
Hint: Its not because they all suddenly became racists.
How about because those states ALSO contain plenty of racists. They didn't turn out to vote for McCain, because he was too dignified to run a racist campaign. They didn't turn out to vote for Romney either. But Steve Bannon helped Trump get them turned out, by appealing to them directly with a return of open and accepted bigotry...and here we are.
Whatever works for you Tims. I'm telling you this: If folks watch the industries that employ them close, are reduced to hunting to feed their families, and want to keep their guns and get their jobs back, they will vote for a short green space alien if it promises they can work and keep the rifles they are taking out hunting. Don't know how I can make it more clear than that.
Well, I got curious, I did some maths for you:
State - Clinton - Trump
Minnesota - 1.37 - 1.32
Wisconsin - 1.38 - 1.41
Illinois - 2.98 - 2.12
Indiana - 1.02 - 1.54
Michigan - 2.26 - 2.28
Ohio - 2.32 - 2.78
West Virginia - 0.19 - 0.49
Pennsylvania - 2.84 - 2.9
Total - 14.36 - 14.84
It's not exact. Large parts of some states are rural rather than Rust Belt, and parts of the Rust Belt extent into other states, like New York, but this seemed like a good rough tally.
The result? Trump wins the Rust Belt by less than half a million. Clinton got more votes than that in Kentucky alone, and she lost Kentucky pretty badly, so it's not a huge figure. Trump didn't win by a landslide, even in the Rust Belt, even in the Rust Belt defined so loosely as to encompass large swathes of rural and small town American that were always going to vote solidly Republican. He won the right voters in the right places, and that's hard to chalk up to something as simple as anxious hunters.
Your human geography seems a little ropey, here. Cities, which are industrial, are not negatively impacted by industrial decline, but rural areas, which are non-industrial, are. Did you think that all the way through? I know there's been a recurring theme in this election of identifying industry specifically with a certain kind of burned out smallish town, but those smallish towns were never rural, and they were never the only places to be affected by declining industrial employment, they just had very little else to fall back on. I think you're letting the already shaky identification of industry with trucker hats run away with your imagination.
I mean, I grew up in the Scottish equivalent of the Rust Belt- which is, in demographic terms, another way of saying "in Scotland", but specifically in the sort of smaller post-industrial town you're talking about- and I never considered it a rural environment, because using "rural" to describe a town with a five-figure population, a multiplex and a shopping mall, however modest each of these may be, is stretching definitions to breaking point.
Not only a little green alien, but a little green alien who has sex with animals and abuses women, and THAT is the only way I can explain how Donald freakin Trump won the election.
Yet the question remains Traitorfish, why did democrats vote for Obama and then Trump in blue states? If my explanations don't work, you tell me.
Separate names with a comma.