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Who would be interested in DoC RAND?

Discussion in 'Rhye's and Fall - Dawn of Civilization' started by Leoreth, Aug 3, 2016.

  1. Leoreth

    Leoreth 心の怪盗団 Moderator

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    I don't know if you have seen the recent question about RAND for DoC in one of the discussion threads, but it actually made me seriously think about doing this for the first time. So I skimmed the RAND code to find out how that would work. Stuff I found out:

    - it uses a modified version of the Terra.py script from BtS that is made to look more like an RFC map
    - code for dynamically choosing starting locations (among other factors, based on the proximity to similar civs)
    - randomizable starting dates with appropriate techs (!)
    - dynamically chosen barbarian spawns and independent cities
    - a rudimentary CNM for context sensitive city names
    - different UHV conditions that do not rely on specific map regions

    So basically everything that relies on map knowledge. (Edit: Rhye's readme on RAND attached, in case people want to know more about it.)

    A naive merge is unfortunately impossible because DoC has already diverged so far from RFC, and I don't really want to include more of Rhye's code here, so there'll be mostly manual work involved. There are also parts that can be copied as a whole (like the map script) with the downside that I know very little about map scripts.

    But there are also advantages because some aspects here intersect with stuff I want to do anyway. For example, RAND only spawns a selection of civs based on map size, and I want to implement some order of priority which civs can or should exist anyway. And dynamically determining techs for (re)spawns has already been discussed for DoC, so I can maybe work from the RAND code here and later reuse it.

    But first I'd like to know how many people care about this?

    Spoiler Important note for people who do not care about this :
    There's no need to tell me about it.

    I know what I should focus on first, and I'm going to do that. This is just an open-ended discussion, and I'm not really interested in that sort of comment.
     

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  2. need my speed

    need my speed Rex Omnium Imperarium

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    Aye, I would like this very much. Truth to be told, I've been going through a phase where the same old Earth maps (be it DoC or not) seem to play out as more of the same. But even if I wasn't, I'd still very much like this idea.
     
  3. Leoreth

    Leoreth 心の怪盗団 Moderator

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    Oh right, one thing I forgot to mention was that I would probably roll this out as part of the main mod (so you can either choose to play the normal map as a scenario or the random one) and start including them from higher to lower likeness, maybe even with a likeness level above RAND's very high, where minor differences exist in coast shape, terrain distribution and resource placement.
     
  4. Force44

    Force44 Prince

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    I rarely play random maps myself.

    And if I do I usually play a couple of games on the same map. I just really like to find out what happens when I do something different.

    So I guess I would rarely play the option.

    I do think it is a valuable addition to the mod overall.
    It provides contrast to the scenarios with the worldmap.
    And the exercise of fitting civilizations into a random map might yield some further differentiating attributes for the civilizations themselves.
     
  5. Panopticon

    Panopticon Utilitarian

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    Would play.
     
  6. KeeperOT7Keys

    KeeperOT7Keys did nothing wrong

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    I didn't play the RAND because after discovering this modmod I lost interest in the RFC, but I would really like to see a RAND version of this modmod
     
  7. need my speed

    need my speed Rex Omnium Imperarium

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    Coincidentally, while Googling on images of resources (I didn't trust all the bNoRiverSide values being 1), I stumbled upon images of RAND, and thought that it was a pity DOC didn't have a random mode.

    And now look at this thread. :p
     
  8. DarkLunaPhantom

    DarkLunaPhantom Prince Supporter

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    I would play this. Every time I play RFC or DoC I think about how knowing resource/spawn/terrain in advance influences player actions in a way I don't really like.
     
  9. Power_of_Beer

    Power_of_Beer Prince

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    Would play. I really liked the concept back in vanilla RFC and played quite a few games of RAND. However the maps had some issues, for example:
    - overabundance of certain resources (like england having four fur resources next to each other)
    - at the same time, certain civs (especially the ones that start in dry areas, like Egypt and Arabia) often had a complete lack of food resources
    - generally the terrain types were often poorly arranged

    This often threw the balance out of the window. But with a new script this might of course be overcome.
     
  10. Leoreth

    Leoreth 心の怪盗団 Moderator

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    I think the way resource placement works right now is that the normal script is run and then it is corrected for "realism" (e.g. no Horses in America). I don't know how good I'm going to be at improving on that, but I think some civ-specific starting location adjustment (e.g. flood plains and stone and marble for Egypt) to make everyone's start more balanced should be possible, at least for high likeness maps.
     
  11. ezzlar

    ezzlar Emperor

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    I would try. But wouldn't like. Less time for you for the ordinary DoC.
     
  12. Leoreth

    Leoreth 心の怪盗団 Moderator

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    Thanks for the feedback, just to put this into context: I won't even touch this before the major features that are already on the agenda (including the whole untying from slots thing) are completed.
     
  13. MedicInDisquise

    MedicInDisquise Chieftain

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    Considering I first suggested it, I would enjoy a modmod or the option to play DoC Rand. Of course, like everyone else, I would rather more work on the main mod before starting on this option!
     
  14. Ani Taneen

    Ani Taneen Warlord

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    I would LOVE this!!!

    Especially the fact that some civs can respawn as modern versions; I feel that the civ spawning will need a bit of a refresher. Which brings me to the greatest thing about the RAND, this would be an amazing playground to test a civil war mechanic.
     
  15. qunee

    qunee Chieftain

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    It is a great idea. I would definately play.
     
  16. Leoreth

    Leoreth 心の怪盗団 Moderator

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    Another realization that I just had: some of the work I did to make modding stability etc. maps more dynamic and easier to modify should make this also vastly easier than it would have been otherwise.
     
  17. Malchar

    Malchar Prince

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    It sounds awesome. One of my favorite things about civ is exploring a new map and making plans dynamically based on what I find. The original DoC is great too, but you lose something when you already know what the map looks like.
     
  18. Aharon

    Aharon Chieftain

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    I would probably play it.
     
  19. mrrandomplayer

    mrrandomplayer Hopeless Situation Warrior

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    I would play it a ton, I would be super hyped for this.
     
  20. jekke

    jekke Warlord

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    Me.
    Loved playing the rand RFC long time ago.
     

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