why did they remove the marine unit?

[the Wahoo boy]

I think it's Moderator Action: <sinp> imo. The marines used different equipment from regular infantry...


PS. Does the mechanized infantry have allot better stats than the regular infantry? or is it simply faster?

 

[Schuesseled]

They didn't remove it, they simply didn't put it in......

And yes mech infantry is superior to regular infantry, although i will imagine that you will still be building regualr infantry in the modern era, simply because all modern units require resources. (as far as we know)

 

[Polobo]

Because the amphibious promotion is now a first-tier promotion; and units cannot attack as they come onto shore/dis-embark (that I've seen).

 

[Bad Brett]

Because the amphibious promotion is now a first-tier promotion; and units cannot attack as they come onto shore/dis-embark (that I've seen).

You just stated why marines SHOULD be in the game.

 

[Schuesseled]

I can see a reason to have the marine in the game, bonus fighting over rivers, can attack from embarkation, it'd be a cool unit. Great for flanking.

 

[KrikkitTwo]

I don't see why units couldn't attack while dis-embarking simply with a large penalty (especially with 1 upt)

Also... Gunships can move in coastal waters without embarking and so they caould probably sail int coastal water, dis-embark on the water, and then attack without penalty.

ie Gunships are the new Marines
(although an amphibious promotion might be there as well)

 

[mjs0]

Also... Gunships can move in coastal waters without embarking and so they caould probably sail int coastal water, dis-embark on the water, and then attack without penalty.

ASIDE:
I wonder how gunships can be transported to another continent if they don't embark when moving onto coastal waters.
Maybe they embark (xform into boats) when moving from coastal to ocean tiles.

(Oh my, can you imagine the realism complaints about that sort of mechanic!)

 

[Ricci]

ASIDE:
I wonder how gunships can be transported to another continent if they don't embark when moving onto coastal waters.
Maybe they embark (xform into boats) when moving from coastal to ocean tiles.

(Oh my, can you imagine the realism complaints about that sort of mechanic!)

What I wonder is if an invading army will be inevitably underpowered compared to a pure continental army, as each unit must consume a promotion to cross water, or there is any other way to get units to another landmass???

 

[mjs0]

What I wonder is if an invading army will be inevitably underpowered compared to a pure continental army, as each unit must consume a promotion to cross water, or there is any other way to get units to another landmass???

As I understand every unit gets free embarkation promotions for coastal and ocean tiles at Optics and Navigation respectively.
So, they only consume a promotion if they want the ability early.

 

[IdleEnergy]

What I wonder is if an invading army will be inevitably underpowered compared to a pure continental army, as each unit must consume a promotion to cross water, or there is any other way to get units to another landmass???

Only in the earlier eras. Once you get to a certain tech level you are able to freely enter water tiles without a special promotion.

So yes, in the ancient era an invading army will have to be under-powered.

 

[Zhahz]

Too many notes.

(name that movie!)

I wouldn't be surprised to see some things get added via expansion or DLC, but, IMO, you don't need a ton of different units that are roughly the same but have built-in promotion type abilities.

That is, a marine is little more than an infantry setup for amphibious assault, something you could pretty much accomplish with an infantry coming out of a city with military buildings (seemed like in the demo Greg said his best city was putting out samurai with 30xp, which equated to 2 promotions upon creation).

Keeping it down to basic units makes the promotion system stronger - since you can't just spend a few extra hammers to essentially shortcut the system and create units with built-in promotions.

 

[Schuesseled]

ASIDE:
I wonder how gunships can be transported to another continent if they don't embark when moving onto coastal waters.
Maybe they embark (xform into boats) when moving from coastal to ocean tiles.

(Oh my, can you imagine the realism complaints about that sort of mechanic!)

I would imagine that clicking onto the coast will turn you into a boat, however if you click on a landmass on the other side, you'll simply fly right over.

 

[Minmaster]

can you say "expansion"?

 

[Volar]

Anything involving the Marines causes a lot of confusion for those of us in the USA. Simply because the USMC has evolved past what everyone considered a Marine to be. Everyone else thinks, specialized amphibious landing force. Which our version does that. On the other hand they also have 500,000 personnel and heavy armor. We tend to think of them more along the lines of shock troops.

Now, there's really no need for it. Only thing I can see an in game marine unit being able to do, is perhaps no movement penalty for embarking. Maybe being able to cross an ocean and land if it's say, the english channel in distance.

 

[the Wahoo boy]

Too many notes.

(name that movie!)

I wouldn't be surprised to see some things get added via expansion or DLC, but, IMO, you don't need a ton of different units that are roughly the same but have built-in promotion type abilities.

That is, a marine is little more than an infantry setup for amphibious assault, something you could pretty much accomplish with an infantry coming out of a city with military buildings (seemed like in the demo Greg said his best city was putting out samurai with 30xp, which equated to 2 promotions upon creation).

Keeping it down to basic units makes the promotion system stronger - since you can't just spend a few extra hammers to essentially shortcut the system and create units with built-in promotions.

It was said here that units can not attack an enemy on a land tile from a water tile. With the entire frontline system, this makes a difference. For example a sea power will have a hard job taking out another sea power (just put units all along ur coastline or something - sounds allot, but it really isn't that much, judging from the 2h video podcast).

 

[Schuesseled]

you can shoot blocking units with proper naval units

 

[Polobo]

It was said here that units can not attack an enemy on a land tile from a water tile.

It was said but definately not confirmed. I think it would entail a significant penalty and/or require the amphibious promotion.

I actually hope they do allow sea-borne attacks since dis-embarking would finish ones turn and you'd be stuck on the coast waiting to be attacked.

 

[Elenhil]

Too many notes.
(name that movie!)

Amadeus

Still, I gonna miss amphibious assaults..

 

[Wuddel]

Livestream part 2 20:11

So this was an already pretty experienced Samurai unit.

But at 21:02 he briefly selects the freshly produced Samurai, showing off the same icon. So I guess amphibious is not so high up anymore in the promotion tree.

 

[Dict4t0rCiv]

I hope to add a marine unit before Firaxis gets a chance to charge for one with an expansion - I'll still buy their expansions. Maybe not a Marine since the amphibious promotion doesn't function the same as in Civ 4 but some kind of modern infantry - maybe a special forces type unit that's more expensive but starts with extra promotions, some kind of modern infantry besides the paratrooper. Just need a good skin from a good modder.