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Why even bother having a trading system in this game?

Discussion in 'Civ6 - Strategy & Tips' started by Bad Wolf, Feb 20, 2018.

  1. Bad Wolf

    Bad Wolf Chieftain

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    Considering even a friendly AI never offers or accepts a reasonable trade (i.e.: 2 of my luxuries for 1 of theirs, which is a total no-brainer as it's literally twice as beneficial to them as it is to me), it's just more of a nuisance than anything. You have to deal with various AIs demanding totally unreasonable or extortionate trades from you every other turn (all of your luxuries and strategics for, say, 17 gold, does that sound fair?) and OBVIOUSLY the answer is no, why even bother asking?

    This, more than anything else, is my biggest issue with this game. I keep assuming they're going to patch it but they never do, which leads me to assume that it's working as designed, and if that's the case, words cannot properly convey my incredulity.

    So - is there something I'm missing? Is there some trick to this? I've only played a few games of Civ VI to the end so maybe I'm missing something...
     
  2. Athmos

    Athmos Chieftain

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    The fairness of the deals you get proposed or accepted depends on your relationship with the AI. If you have friendly relations, you will get much better deal. If they hate you, you will get absurd demands and extortion rates.
     
  3. Bad Wolf

    Bad Wolf Chieftain

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    This has not been the case in my experience. Even friends, declared friends, and allies aren't willing to trade me a single copy of a luxury resource, of which they have multiple copies, unless I offer them like four of mine plus 50 gold per turn. I'd love to see a screenshot of an AI willing to accept a reasonable deal just to prove it can actually happen, because it's literally never happened for me. Not once.
     
  4. liv

    liv Warlord

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    I think trade became a bit strange. You may say do you want this luxury and they will say no only as a gift but if you ask for money they will give it.
    Early game I sell everything except one luxury to buy monuments or workers or trade routes.
     
  5. Bad Wolf

    Bad Wolf Chieftain

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    Yeah early game you can get a bit of gold for sure. But late-game, when you actually need the amenities, they simply won't play ball under any circumstances, and it's really frustrating. The AIs in both Civ IV and Civ V were actually willing to entertain trading luxuries with you sometimes, now it never happens.
     
  6. gilbertlew

    gilbertlew Chieftain

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    You are correct as I have not seen many 1:1 Lux trades with the AI. Sometimes, the AI will accept 1 Lux with 1 strategic resource for 1 of their Lux. The best I personally have done was 1 Lux + 1 art for 3 of their Luxs. My spy stole the art and did not need it so I use it for trade.
     
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  7. Bad Wolf

    Bad Wolf Chieftain

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    Yeah I'm pretty sure the absolute best I've ever managed was trading one of my strategics plus two of my luxuries (I think it was uranium? not to Gandhi! lol) for one of their luxuries. And I've literally never seen the AI be willing to part with a strategic, even if they have more than two copies of it.
     
  8. Eliminator_Sr

    Eliminator_Sr Chieftain

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    I agree - I generally ignore it. I think it does tie highly to diplomacy which is also very flawed. It is super annoying though to constantly click through their insulting offers. I've had them offer me outrageous deals like 1 lux for 2 of mine, a strategic resource, and 50+ gpt. This is definitely one of the most annoying aspect of the game for me.
     
    Bad Wolf likes this.
  9. orasis

    orasis Chieftain

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    Well yeah, they know you need them... why would they give you what you need? The AI wants to win the game too.
     
    Cedbird77 likes this.
  10. Bad Wolf

    Bad Wolf Chieftain

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    Could have fooled me... :p
     
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  11. N7 Commander John

    N7 Commander John Chieftain

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    From what I remember reading in the patch notes for the R&F Update, the AI will selfishly withhold their goods and sell only for exorbitant prices if you are taking the lead/snowballing, even if you are allies. This is to make it so you will slow down due to lacking amenities and letting them catch up as a result.
     
  12. Bad Wolf

    Bad Wolf Chieftain

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    Ah, I'll have to experiment with that and see if I can get a half-decent deal when I'm at the bottom of the score board.
     
  13. Arms Longfellow

    Arms Longfellow Chieftain

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    Do keep in mind that the Rise & Fall patch changed the way the AI values resources: they will now consider resources that they are already importing. So, for example, if they don't have any domestic diamonds, but they're importing diamonds from another civilization, and you offer them diamonds, they're not going to give you anything for it. This obviously makes sense, but I wish there were a way to easily see what each civ is already importing so I could see at a glance which civs I should offer my resources to. With the current system, I'm forced to do the time consuming process of asking each civ without domestic diamonds if they'd like my diamonds.
     
    Bad Wolf likes this.
  14. halfhalfharp

    halfhalfharp Chieftain

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    Sometimes they will offer 2 great work for my luxury resource, even when they have just denounced me. Its just weird, or did they change the AI trading behaviour to fit their own needs?
     
  15. N7 Commander John

    N7 Commander John Chieftain

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    They might be really low on amenities and desperate.
     
  16. Mrmyx22

    Mrmyx22 Chieftain

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    Well I am using iPad version and I get one for one luxury offers from AI now and then. Got one from Archimedes (a mod civ) about an hour ago.
     
  17. KandAffar

    KandAffar Chieftain

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    Since this is a game, the relevant consideration for a trade isn't whether it is fair. The relevant consideration is whether it will help the player win.

    Selling resources at a discount to a civ that is losing by a substantial margin is a better deal for the player than an equal trade with a close competitor.

    If you could get equal deals with civs that have no prospect of winning, it would make the game too easy. Thus, if they are going to have a trade system, it needs to require more give than get.
     
  18. Aldor

    Aldor Chieftain

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    This is probably also tied to difficulty settings. I play on lower levels currently to get a hang of the new R&F mechanics, and I often see good deals (1 lux of mine for 1 lux + some gold from them, etc). May also be tied to the current era you're playing in.
     
  19. MrRadar

    MrRadar Chieftain

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    My first R@F game, Emperor difficulty:

    Freddy isn't exactly fond of me:
    Spoiler :

    ...yet he can be reasonable when it comes to trade:
    Spoiler :


    Tomyris hasn't denounced me, but neither is she very friendly at the moment:
    Spoiler :

    ...but I wouldn't call this trade unfair to me:
    Spoiler :


    Most often, AI will come to you with nonsense deals, so just refuse them or rearrange them according to your needs. Sometimes they do offer something sensible. I see no big problem here, because it is you who should be going out and seeking the best deals with the AI in the first place.

    AI will no longer pay for luxes it already has. And I've seen friendly or allied AI offering very little for a unique lux, and almost fully hostile AI sometimes accepting quite nice trades. Let's write it off to some quirks of the global market ;)
    Don't get frustrated, it isn't worth it. Better try to explore the game more and know it better.

    Oh, and almost forgot - have you been warmongering? If you start going about bonking people's heads, trading usually becomes problematic.
     
  20. bonafide11

    bonafide11 Worker

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    I get so annoyed by having the AI constantly offer me terrible deals and trying to trade for my Great Works for 1GPT. I wish I could just tell them to leave me alone and turn it off.
     

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