why i quit this stupid game
- Thread starter Cissnei
- Start date
Moriarte
Immortal
- Joined
- May 10, 2012
- Messages
- 2,429
Cissney, you call this a good start? That location looks quite apalling to me. What you want is a salt salt salt start 
.
Check this out:
This is how one of my recent Deity games progressed. I was aiming for domination though. Anyway, strong early army is one thing you always need.
. Check this out:
Spoiler :
Spoiler :
Spoiler :
Spoiler :
Spoiler :
Spoiler :
This is how one of my recent Deity games progressed. I was aiming for domination though. Anyway, strong early army is one thing you always need.
Thank you for posts, sorry i dont understand the screenshots you posted (spain) AT ALL. LOL. I dont wish the game was easy but i dont want to be defeated so early. I didnt have time to watch youtube videos . I read all posts in this thread, sorry if i dont reply
I started new game and used many advices from here (and read other threads too~). Obviously i did bad but i wasnt defeated in 100 turns . It was a fun game until this happen:
I thought they wont attack me because i was friends with them and all their friends are also friends with me but apparently it doesnt matter at alll. i was attacking Celts and when i saw that i turned all my units.. I am not at war with Persia yet
T_T Please tell me i can somehow defend. I cant play now anymore but i want to continue tomorrow and dont wanna ragequit . I know it was my bad for starting in the middle of map too. z But this game i made alot of units and have more science and culture plus made my own religion so it isnt as horrible as last. Please help
Crycry
I started new game and used many advices from here (and read other threads too~). Obviously i did bad but i wasnt defeated in 100 turns . It was a fun game until this happen:
I thought they wont attack me because i was friends with them and all their friends are also friends with me but apparently it doesnt matter at alll. i was attacking Celts and when i saw that i turned all my units.. I am not at war with Persia yet
T_T Please tell me i can somehow defend. I cant play now anymore but i want to continue tomorrow and dont wanna ragequit . I know it was my bad for starting in the middle of map too. z But this game i made alot of units and have more science and culture plus made my own religion so it isnt as horrible as last. Please help
Crycry
Ah, the backstab from Monty. Everyone's favorite AI tactic -- not.
First, ignore your war with the Celts. They aren't going anywhere, and aren't likely to invade soon. Monty is the current threat.
Second, it looks like you are pretty well equipped for defense, with plenty of gold for upgrades. I count 4 crossbows, one wounded comp bow that should be upgraded (get him to safety, upgrade and heal--have him and your pike switch places), a chariot archer that can be upgraded to a knight, 2 swords and 1 pike. I also see a knight (I think) about to come off the construction line in Seoul. If you upgrade your chariot archer to a knight, you should put him in the field (to kill wounded enemy units, particularly siege units; don't have your knight attack fresh units; let your ranged units wound them and then have your knight finish them off, if he can do so safely; remember that your knights can move after attacking, if they haven't used all their movement points -- move in, attack/kill and then retreat to safety; heal one turn and then do it again). Put a crossbow in Busan; the other crossbow can stay on a hill next to the city.
Your swords are a bit weaker than Monty's pikes, and no match for his longsword, but their role is just to protect your crossbows. Are you close to researching Steel? If so, finish that and upgrade your swords to longswords. It will make a big difference.
Third, you may be outnumbered, but the AI is not very effective in using its units. Monty has some siege units, so focus fire them as they approach your cities--don't let them take shots at your cities. Then target his melee units; he can't take any cities with ranged units -- no melee, no conquered city.
Seoul and Busan have pretty good city defense strength, and Jeonju is almost finished with walls, so you're in good shape there. Let Monty get close, so your city's bombardment can assist in defense, and your units stay in friendly territory for better healing.
Fourth, the -9 happiness is a potential problem, since the invaders are likely to pillage some luxury tiles, putting you below -10, triggering production penalties, which you don't need right now. Gold is for upgrades first, but are there any mercantile CSs that you can befriend to get some additional happiness? Even getting it down to -5 would be helpful.
Finally, ask Darius how much he wants to declare war on Monty. He may decline to state a price, but it is worth asking. Do you have any remaining duplicate luxuries than you can sell/trade?
First, ignore your war with the Celts. They aren't going anywhere, and aren't likely to invade soon. Monty is the current threat.
Second, it looks like you are pretty well equipped for defense, with plenty of gold for upgrades. I count 4 crossbows, one wounded comp bow that should be upgraded (get him to safety, upgrade and heal--have him and your pike switch places), a chariot archer that can be upgraded to a knight, 2 swords and 1 pike. I also see a knight (I think) about to come off the construction line in Seoul. If you upgrade your chariot archer to a knight, you should put him in the field (to kill wounded enemy units, particularly siege units; don't have your knight attack fresh units; let your ranged units wound them and then have your knight finish them off, if he can do so safely; remember that your knights can move after attacking, if they haven't used all their movement points -- move in, attack/kill and then retreat to safety; heal one turn and then do it again). Put a crossbow in Busan; the other crossbow can stay on a hill next to the city.
Your swords are a bit weaker than Monty's pikes, and no match for his longsword, but their role is just to protect your crossbows. Are you close to researching Steel? If so, finish that and upgrade your swords to longswords. It will make a big difference.
Third, you may be outnumbered, but the AI is not very effective in using its units. Monty has some siege units, so focus fire them as they approach your cities--don't let them take shots at your cities. Then target his melee units; he can't take any cities with ranged units -- no melee, no conquered city.
Seoul and Busan have pretty good city defense strength, and Jeonju is almost finished with walls, so you're in good shape there. Let Monty get close, so your city's bombardment can assist in defense, and your units stay in friendly territory for better healing.
Fourth, the -9 happiness is a potential problem, since the invaders are likely to pillage some luxury tiles, putting you below -10, triggering production penalties, which you don't need right now. Gold is for upgrades first, but are there any mercantile CSs that you can befriend to get some additional happiness? Even getting it down to -5 would be helpful.
Finally, ask Darius how much he wants to declare war on Monty. He may decline to state a price, but it is worth asking. Do you have any remaining duplicate luxuries than you can sell/trade?
for some combat basics, the big thing to know is that only melee units can take a city. they can have 20 ranged units (catapults, archers, ariplane, etc) all attacking a city but they can never take it unless they have a melee unit. so 1 archer in a city can surprisingly fend off a lot of attacks if you focus your attacks on the swords/pikes/horses kind of units. leave their ranged units until all the melee ones are gone and then focus on them.
in your screenshot you can defend for a while but you need to get your crossbows close by and keep them alive. your chariot archer in your city can help while you also move your units to help them. You can also move that chariot out as its only a 10 str attack, garrison your composite bow and upgrade it. If it gets another promotion use it to heal. It will defend your city better than the chariot and the chariot has some mobility to retreat and heal for a few turns. The large number of pikes near your capital might be something to sacrifice a unit or two on. Try and get your melee units in front of your city between them and have them fortify instead of attack. Their pike vs your defending pike/swords will take a few turns for them to kill one. in that time if you focus fire with your city and crossbow you should be able to take them out. dont be afraid to lose your melee units but keep your ranged ones alive. if they get promotions and need healing use the heals. You also have enough gold to buy 1 crossbow in a city if you get into a pinch.
keep a calm, cool head while your city takes dmg. it can sit on zero health but if they have no melee units to take it you wont lose it. Realizing this helps a lot with the stress of combat if you dont enjoy a military style game.
Several realizations are big helpers. Like that you can take a CS worker and immediately make peace. Workers dont spawn for CSs until around 20-25 so plan on having a unit near a CS close to your capital so you can take it and get it back to your borders safely. But don't take a worker from more than one CS. All CSs will then dislike you. Plus other AI wont like it, particularly ones that have pledged to protect that CS.
And the circumstances as to why 5 civs declared war on you at once can sometimes be hard to figure out. While you are not at war you can try to talk to them. At the intro screen let your mouse hover over the word in the top right (Friendly, Hostile, Guarded, Neutral, etc.) and see why they are that way. It will show you things in red (angry), gray (no longer important) and green (happy) text as the reasons why they do or dont like you. It can help to understand what you did in the past that you may not realize affected their impression of you. It's pretty complex but learning some of those subtle, lesser known reasons can really help prevent a big dogpile war like that.
in your screenshot you can defend for a while but you need to get your crossbows close by and keep them alive. your chariot archer in your city can help while you also move your units to help them. You can also move that chariot out as its only a 10 str attack, garrison your composite bow and upgrade it. If it gets another promotion use it to heal. It will defend your city better than the chariot and the chariot has some mobility to retreat and heal for a few turns. The large number of pikes near your capital might be something to sacrifice a unit or two on. Try and get your melee units in front of your city between them and have them fortify instead of attack. Their pike vs your defending pike/swords will take a few turns for them to kill one. in that time if you focus fire with your city and crossbow you should be able to take them out. dont be afraid to lose your melee units but keep your ranged ones alive. if they get promotions and need healing use the heals. You also have enough gold to buy 1 crossbow in a city if you get into a pinch.
keep a calm, cool head while your city takes dmg. it can sit on zero health but if they have no melee units to take it you wont lose it. Realizing this helps a lot with the stress of combat if you dont enjoy a military style game.
Several realizations are big helpers. Like that you can take a CS worker and immediately make peace. Workers dont spawn for CSs until around 20-25 so plan on having a unit near a CS close to your capital so you can take it and get it back to your borders safely. But don't take a worker from more than one CS. All CSs will then dislike you. Plus other AI wont like it, particularly ones that have pledged to protect that CS.
And the circumstances as to why 5 civs declared war on you at once can sometimes be hard to figure out. While you are not at war you can try to talk to them. At the intro screen let your mouse hover over the word in the top right (Friendly, Hostile, Guarded, Neutral, etc.) and see why they are that way. It will show you things in red (angry), gray (no longer important) and green (happy) text as the reasons why they do or dont like you. It can help to understand what you did in the past that you may not realize affected their impression of you. It's pretty complex but learning some of those subtle, lesser known reasons can really help prevent a big dogpile war like that.
or also what Browd said. while I was writing mine I guess he was writing his, haha.
i give up, i won that battle and then won against celts again (who are at war with 10 civilizations and still had 3 times more units Then me, and they have 4 cities). Then aztecs attacked again (they have 2 more city then me and again had around 10-15 units), i defeated them but they keep sending 2 new units every turn. and now celts attacked again with 10 units zzz
AI just make army, has infinite gold and their units are made in 2-5 turns. They didnt have many workers or resources, i checked by using "reveal all" cheat. Whats the point? I just feel like im being robbed of time. I wish the game wasnt just about defending yourself.
That persian army attacked Celts. And it didnt do anything to them. I wish being on good relation with other civilizations mattered in this game, and friends could actually help.
T_T sadness
I will just read more and try to learn to play and hopefully find time to play later today
AI just make army, has infinite gold and their units are made in 2-5 turns. They didnt have many workers or resources, i checked by using "reveal all" cheat. Whats the point? I just feel like im being robbed of time. I wish the game wasnt just about defending yourself.
That persian army attacked Celts. And it didnt do anything to them. I wish being on good relation with other civilizations mattered in this game, and friends could actually help.
T_T sadness
I will just read more and try to learn to play and hopefully find time to play later today
Try a game where you keep spamming units yourself until you're number one militarily in the demographics screen. Also, you need to explore the map with some scouts more fully. This will give you more CS contacts and something to do with all those units. In turn that will lead to having CS allies which will provide happiness as well as a partner on the battlefield.
When you meet a CS open their screen and pledge to protect. Then when you get messages from the AI saying they extracted tribute ALWAYS tell them "you will pay". There is NO diplo hit. This will increase your chances of being their ally when you destroy a barb camp or connect a resource they want.
When you meet a CS open their screen and pledge to protect. Then when you get messages from the AI saying they extracted tribute ALWAYS tell them "you will pay". There is NO diplo hit. This will increase your chances of being their ally when you destroy a barb camp or connect a resource they want.
The above screenshot is significantly better than the last one posted.
Unfortunately outside of composite bow rushing, it can be difficult to go on the offensive early in the game. It is partially designed that way so it lasts more than just ancient era. If you can hold out until Renaissance and beyond, the AI becomes extremely easy to deal with.
It looks like you are playing on a huge map with added Civs. Why not try something smaller? The games will be quicker which in turn will allow you to play more games to fine-tune your strategy. Starting right in the middle on a huge pangaea is going to be significantly more challenging.
Unfortunately outside of composite bow rushing, it can be difficult to go on the offensive early in the game. It is partially designed that way so it lasts more than just ancient era. If you can hold out until Renaissance and beyond, the AI becomes extremely easy to deal with.
It looks like you are playing on a huge map with added Civs. Why not try something smaller? The games will be quicker which in turn will allow you to play more games to fine-tune your strategy. Starting right in the middle on a huge pangaea is going to be significantly more challenging.
clearbeard
King
2 new units every turn sounds to me like a wonderful source of XP for your troops. Get a half dozen or so ranged units upgraded with barrage 3, logistics, and range. Work on a few siege units to the same point. With a few melee units to act as blockers (preferably fortified on hills or forests) that you promote up to rough 3 plus march, and two or three mounted units to mop up, you should be able to fend off an arbitrarily large invasion force. The AI is rubbish at using the terrain and actually executing their invasions under the 1 unit per tile constraint. Lots of people on here keep advising you to build up a huge military to deal with the cheating AI, but I find a smaller (and hence cheaper to maintain) but highly promoted force superior in all cases. If the AI is building and sending 5-6 units per turn at you, but you're KILLING 5-6 units per turn with no losses of your own, that just means your troops are gaining XP while theirs are fertilizing your fields.
Contrary to popular belief, the AI does not have infinite gold, does pay unit maintenance, and has the same happiness and construction constraints you do. They just get handicaps added to all these values that increase as the difficulty goes up, so it sometimes feels otherwise. The AI will have much larger initial forces than you. But once you've killed them (and it seems you did that, in your current game), their fresh troops will mostly just trickle in and you can deal with them piecemeal.
The other thing to learn how to do better is play the diplomacy game. It's largely a black-box system with little feedback available, but it is remarkably complex and subtle. Sometimes there is a situation where a civ will just decide to attack because you're weak and he's strong (or so he thinks). Montezuma is notorious for that, and has been for as long as there's been Civ. Usually though, you can develop favorable relations with one or two civs, particularly more distant ones, who will pursue their own agendas at the expense of your common neighbors. Get trading luxuries with them, establish embassies, and so forth. Once you've picked your friends, figure out who their friends and enemies are likely to be. Pick on their enemies and defend their friends when you can, and you won't be in the fight all by your lonesome.
That said, if you are diving into huge Pangaea maps, and particularly if you're actually adding players above the default, you're going to have problems. That's probably the hardest map type to play on because of the domino effect of Civ 5 diplomacy. If you do something that one civ doesn't like, or if you are fighting and losing, you're much more likely to have additional civs join the dogpile and come for your blood. Try smaller maps, or a continents or large islands script, and you'll likely have better luck. You'll only have two or three AI's to deal with at a time, and things you do to piss off one won't bring quite as large of a chain reaction down on your head.
JamesCaesar
People-Vulture
Yes..
PreLynMax
Your Lord and Master
Cissney, you call this a good start? That location looks quite apalling to me. What you want is a salt salt salt start
Check this out:
Spoiler :
Spoiler :
Spoiler :
Spoiler :
Spoiler :
Spoiler :
This is how one of my recent Deity games progressed. I was aiming for domination though. Anyway, strong early army is one thing you always need.
I think you should've burned Busan to the ground.
i played again and this time no one never attacked me for over 150 turns. i am neighbor with Siam and India. My position wasnt the best but i started on peninsula. I made alot of archers very early, found my own religion and never even fought =_= Most boring game. Im gonna continue playing it and post screenshotss
Moriarte
Immortal
- Joined
- May 10, 2012
- Messages
- 2,429
In retrospect, yes, probably. While playing the game i thought i should reserve the spot, so noone settles at my back door.
Smokeybear
Emperor
That is just making it harder on yourself. It is more likely to be a short game with you croaking, with twice as many civs in the game as there should be, right in your face from the very start. A little space between you and the other civs is a good thing, in the beginning. The closer they are to you, and the more of them there are close to you, the more likely you are to see exactly what you've seen so far- them wanting to eat you up as early as possible. For any map size, just go with the default number of civs and CS's- at least during your training phase. And do try to get a start on the perimeter of the continent, preferably with some decent mountains and/or bodies of water protecting you on one or more sides. Starting in the middle amongst a mass of other civs should only be for experienced players who already know well how to survive and thrive.
What is the obsession with worrying about being attacked and worrying about having less units than the AI?
This is not Civ 4.
In this game it is normal to successfully defend against hordes of AI, with only a handful of units.
You don't have any practice at fighting wars, so you are getting beat by AI who are easily predicatable.
The AI in this game is laughable. They need numbers.
This is not Civ 4.
In this game it is normal to successfully defend against hordes of AI, with only a handful of units.
You don't have any practice at fighting wars, so you are getting beat by AI who are easily predicatable.
The AI in this game is laughable. They need numbers.
She hasn't learned what 'normal' is yet. It comes through experience. So far she has only won at Prince and it's possible to get thru prince with little or no combat at all. Plus she plays with 22 AI and will easily face way too many units at higher diffs. And she might not have played any Civ 4 before. Not every Civ5 player is a legacy player from previous versions. Try to consider that there are new players or non-military oriented players.
If you don't know what's "normal" due to lack of experience, Prince is a good level to gain experience on. It is the most balanced difficultly. King and above is for players with experience who know how to predict and exploit the limitations of the game design and the AI.
