Why no Black Male Leaders?

[joeycitation]

Cancel Amina for being a supporter of the African slave trade to America, restore Askia. I love Askia by the way because of how he frequently shows up in Civ 5 with the entire world burning behind him and he's like "Sup ur cool, let's be friends."

edit: Quoted the wrong section of your post initially, was primarily responding to this portion "Zazzau was literally was one of the biggest slavers and probably a lot of black American men today can thank Amina for how their ancestors were brought across the Atlantic."

Oh come on lol. Any civilization game is full of leaders/polities that have the blood of thousands to millions on their hands, and often entire cultures and regions of the world. The standard is clearly time and cultural relevance of the atrocities, and while that's inevitably inconsistent in its application if you get into it, that's the reality of a popular video game choosing broadly non-controversial options for a popular audience. Peter and Catherine the Great ruled an empire of majority enserfed peasants, conducted imperialism in central asia and colonization in Siberia and Alaska. By most neutral historical considerations they would be considered far more bloody rulers than Lenin, but nonetheless it is obvious that the former are less controversial choices for the game due to length of time and the more visceral contemporary political and cultural relevance of the legacy of the USSR. This is the first Civ game where the US leaders did not preside over colonization and/or slavery in some capacity.

The Spanish Empire and Queen Isabella are currently in the game, contemporaries of Amina of Zazzau. I haven't seen people say they shouldn't be in the game because of the immense horrors involved in Iberian conquest of the Americas or the construction of the Carribean sugar colonies that were some of the most absurdly brutal slave societies in recorded history. Napolean attempted to invade Haiti to reinstate slavery during their revolution, and yet that is rarely mentioned as a mark on his name compared to what, allegedly being short and mostly succeeding at conquering Europe for a time?

The reality is that these things do not really factor into civ games choice of leaders/civs because if they did, the game couldn't really exist as it does. Leaders/civs have boundaries based on what is unlikely to be politically controversial with a popular audience, regardless of whether or not that controversy is based on a measured and consistent transhistorical evaluation of leaders/states history. And I get it! I'm part of that audience. I will have plenty of fun playing as Isabella of Spain and would be extremely uncomfortable and very suspicious if somehow Franco was a modern Spanish leader, despite the former being deeply involved in what I'd say is inarguably a more bloody and grim part of history.

So I just really, really do not believe the routine of indignation at Amina of Zazzau's involvement in the trans-Saharan slave trade. If people like Napolean and Catherine the Great and George Washington are uncontroversial leadere, it's not whitewashing the horrors of that slavery or of military conquest in general to say that it's pretty obvious any controversy around her is because she's an African woman (besides maybe a spare Igbo nationalist civ fan somewhere that just doesn't like the Hausa in general, lol).

Anyway as far as positive suggestions in line with the thread topic,

-- Toussaint Louverture top of my list
-- Kwame Nkrumah for reasons I layed out in earlier post in thread
-- Zara Yacob I would actually prefer to see over the return of Haile Selassie, just for some variety in Ethiopian leaders and he's an interesting figure
-- Shaka I WOULD agree is almost obligatory as a classic civ leader, but to be fair this game has swerved well away from other classic civ leaders so I hesitate
-- Olaudah Equiano as a wildcard recommendation since the doors open in terms of non-heads of state leaders (would love to see Frederick Douglass as well but we are already at max American leader capacity for years)

 

[Alexander's Hetaroi]

I think if Buganda doesn't get a leader (fairly likely), Shaka's odds are quite good. There aren't any other Sub-Saharan leaders who are strong contenders, let alone modern African militaristic leaders. Amina is probably the closest, and she was still differentiated as an "economic" leader. I especially think that certain leaders and civs would benefit from a seventh "defensive" typing, which Shaka would be a prime candidate for if/when it happens.

Shaka seems to me the prime candidate to appear. They now could bring him in without making a whole Zulu civ as well.

Toussaint Louverture (I feel his odds went down a bit after Harriet Tubman)

Toussaint would be cool, but I agree that odds are down the more French speaking and Revolutionary leaders we get. Plus, we're getting Simon Bolivar.

 

[Ryansinbela]

Toussaint can’t lose his chance now

 

[Pangea]

I hate to be that Guy, but Data shows most people prefer to play as their Sex, & I'm sure if Data was drawn, it would be the same for Race. Is it that Black Men are a Small Demo for Civ Games? And even with that, I'm not asking for a majority or equal amount of Black Male Leaders, but none?!!!

Then based on the Veteran Sleuths who typically accurately predict the upcoming unrevealed content, the upcoming DLC will not have any Black Male Leaders either. Again if Black Men are a small Demo, I'll let it go, but I'm hard pressed to believe Black Females are a Bigger demographic.

This is not a criticism against Firaxis, & I understand most people in this site may not care, but it is very disappointing to me.

I appreciate your posting this. I pre-ordered this wrongly assuming the product took seriously its title! How can you choose to make and sell a product that accurately teaches us anything about the history of human civilization that does not include African male leaders?

I own Civ7; it’s installed, but I’ve not experienced it yet as there is NOT the story of one black or African male leader portrayed.

Hopefully the development team is listening and adds black male leaders to the experience. Thanks for Harriett Tubman, but please try to be more creative.

Firaxis Games and published by 2K. You should know better 2K.

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