Discussion in 'Civ5 - General Discussions' started by glaciermi, Aug 9, 2013.
FOR THE GLORY OF SATAN! j/k
I wouldn't. That chariot archer already went down the wrong path to be a useful tank. I'll just let it shoot stuff until it's totally obsolete, then I'll gift it to a CS or just delete it for gold.
If you're Arabia or Mongolia. No other reason. The lack of a viable upgrade path for mounted ranged units is one of the worst. fracking. things. about Civ V.
To be fair, it would be pretty freaking terrifying if you got to keep your Keshiks with all of their promotions for the entirety of the game.
This is why I think the Chariot Archer and all its variations should upgrade to the Crossbowman. I also experienced this dilemma once, and it was pretty bitter...
Whilst it's far more viable than upgrading a chariot archer, I also really don't like upgrading my crossbowmen. I think, in some circumstances, the loss of range is just too big.
Some way around:
Unfortunetly they are all other alternatives like elephants and stuff, and if you are interested in this nations repeat. :-(
Just get march on it before upgrading, and it will be useful and eventually get the other promos. I actually do it on purpose with one or two CA, just get two promos and next one is march. Yes the knight s a bit softer at first but just baby it along and march helps with that.
Easy, just don't get Barrage/Accuracy past level 1, go for Cover instead, and then Medic if you still get promotions. When you have Cover 2 and upgrade into a Knight, on the Knight's next promotion you'll be able to pick March even if you don't have Drill/Shock. Enjoy your Cover II + March Knights, even one of them can probably take on half a dozen xbows alone.
I kept a few chariot archers around as Egypt well into the rennesance for barbarian patrol/ worker protection. Then you gift them to city state to stay allied a little bit more.
If you have the +1 +2 for a garrison tenet, you can keep them as garrisons in far off reaches of the empire until the end of the game.
It was either G+K or a G+K patch which totally ruined some upgrade paths...
By the same token, why would I upgrade a pike to a lance??? Anti-mounted to, um, MOUNTED ?
The Keshik as it is now wouldn't be on the mounted upgrade path anyway since it's a knight variant - that would always upgrade to a tank. Ranged mounted units really do need an upgrade path, along the lines Chariot Archer (uniques: War Elephant, renamed Hun Horse Archer, War Chariot) > Horse Archer (uniques: Cataphract - gets defensive terrain bonus - Keshik) > Carabinier (unique: Hakkapellita)> Dragoon or Cavalry (Dragoons didn't fight from horseback, but as ranged soldiers with high mobility they could be treated that way as an abstraction) > some form of light ranged tank.
It's still anti-mounted, just anti-mounted with higher mobility. Lancers aren't too bad, it's the fact that they're the end of their useful upgrade path that's problematic. Sure, an anti-tank gun is to a tank what a pike is to a horse, but somehow it lacks the utility.
There are some serious upgrade problems.
Chariot archers should upgrade to Crossbows
Keshiks/Camel Archers should upgrade to Gatling Guns
also AT guns should share promotions with Helicopters ( mobility or ambush)
Pikes should upgrade to Muskets or Rifles
Knights should upgrade to Lancers which should upgrade to Cavalry
Pretty sure the basic promos carry over (open terrain, etc).
Topic came up a while ago and seems that knights keep the ranged promo graphics, but in the combat preview screen, it still adds the increased combat damage.
Huh? Where's the contradiction here. Lancers are still anti-mounted. You'd upgrade because you're essentially getting a stronger pikeman with extra movement. Where's the downside in that?
Oh, or you're Spain and wants to found a city with it.
I actually did this for my civ5 copy. Ancient Era range cavalry(chariot archer, horse archer, war chariot, indian elephant) become crossbowman in Medieval. Medieval range cavalry(camel and keshik) become gatling gun in Industrial. Things seem to work great and balance(no Chariot Archer can upgrade to Keshik).
My upgraded heavily upgraded keshiks got turned into cavalry and when I went to attack, it said "+50% for attacking rough terrain". I did the math and the combat strength was correct. When I attacked, it did exactly as much damage as it predicted.
So, did they make it so that the open/rough terrain promotions carry over finally? I'm assuming I wouldn't have gotten the bonuses if I was defending. Still, if that's correct, it's still a lot better than no effects at all.
To be even fairer, many times, they do. ;-) (Since many Keshik games end in early Industrial.)
You wouldn't. Just another awkward quirk of the Civ 5 unit tree, right up there with the slow Pikeman upgrading to the mounted Lancer, which upgrades to the slow Anti-Tank Gun, which upgrades to the fast Helicopter Gunship.
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