Exactly. A war means massive cuts in government spending which is what got us back on track. We need to pretend we are in a World War and adjust our government spending to that level
Will Obama be a one term Democrat President like Carter was ?
- Thread starter kiwitt
- Start date
TopGearFanatic
Duke of St. Louis
Fair enough.
Ahovking
Cyber Nations
Obama Will be a one term President simple
Moderator Action: A little Reminder: The OP designated this thread as RD, so please keep your discussion civil and on topic. Thank you, Grisu
Mitt Romney looks the most competent from outside the USA but, how much difference will him being a draft dodger and a Mormon make in the primary when it starts to get dirty ?
Will enough Republicans from outside the Mormon church believe that Salt Lake City will be pulling the strings to ruin Romney's chances ?
Will enough Republicans from outside the Mormon church believe that Salt Lake City will be pulling the strings to ruin Romney's chances ?
Ziggy Stardust
Absolutely Sane
This election is win-win.
Obama wins, claims that he'll destroy America ... again. His first term saw some pretty loony commentators coming out of the woodwork, one can only imagine the heights of the ridiculousness that will sprout forth out of Repub, Fox and ilk.
Republican wins, we'll see a 180 in a lot of political pundits. I wonder when the economy hasn't recovered in 2013 who's recession they'll say this is. The hypocrisy on display here and from the usual suspects will be delicious.
One thing's for sure, whoever wins ...
Obama wins, claims that he'll destroy America ... again. His first term saw some pretty loony commentators coming out of the woodwork, one can only imagine the heights of the ridiculousness that will sprout forth out of Repub, Fox and ilk.
Republican wins, we'll see a 180 in a lot of political pundits. I wonder when the economy hasn't recovered in 2013 who's recession they'll say this is. The hypocrisy on display here and from the usual suspects will be delicious.
One thing's for sure, whoever wins ...
Exactly. I'd even agree that Obama's performance, on the whole, probably doesn't merit relection. He hasn't been an effective leader and salesman of the polices he ran on. However, he isn't running against "generic GOP candidate A", he is running against Mitt Romney (a flawed candidate) and a bunch of crazy and stupid people.
Yeah, but you don't need 50% to win an election. Bill Clinton never won 50% of the vote. The magic presidential approval rating isn't 51%, its closer to the 48% range, since other candidates steal 1-3% of the total electorate vote. When your presidential approval rating sinks into the mid to low 40s, thats when you need to worry.
It's worth noting that however dismal his ratings are though, they're still better than virtually any other politician who is actually making choices at the moment. Voters hate EVERYBODY right now.
At any rate, I think a significant reason that his raw approval rating is dropping is because liberals are pretty pissed at him too. There is no way Obama can win an election without VERY strong activity from his base supporters.
No American believes Romney is a draft dodger, and very few people are worried about "Salt Lake" pulling the strings in the government. You keep acting like Romney is the first Mormon we've ever elected to anything...the leader of the US Senate is a Mormon, along with close to a dozen members of Congress, and dozens of statehouse members across the country. We've had Mormon cabinet officials, Mormon governors, Mormon ambassadors, hell, prob a third of the FBI is Mormon. etc...voters aren't worried that Thomas Monson is going to be secretly pulling the strings of govt. If he wanted to, he already would!
The people who are pissed at Mormons now aren't people who would vote for Mitt anyway. They're Liberals. Most Republicans got over their Mormon hate in 2008.
GoodGame
Red, White, & Blue, baby!
- Joined
- Dec 17, 2004
- Messages
- 13,725
Obama diverges in that many of his military expeditions are inherited, and are generally successful during his term. In some ways Obama is like Nixon also (not the misuse of power)----they promised to end the war and normalize international relations.
I'd say Obama has more going than Carter, but he could still end up a 1-termer when Nov 4 2012 rolls around: http://www.rasmussenreports.com/pub...ministration/daily_presidential_tracking_poll.
Romney came in a distant second, still ahead of Huckabee (3rd) in the GOP primaries, but I think there's still a split in the religious wing of the GOP. I wonder how it would have been if McCain wasn't running and it was Huckabee vs. Romney in 2008.
I'd say Obama has more going than Carter, but he could still end up a 1-termer when Nov 4 2012 rolls around: http://www.rasmussenreports.com/pub...ministration/daily_presidential_tracking_poll.
Downtown said:
Romney came in a distant second, still ahead of Huckabee (3rd) in the GOP primaries, but I think there's still a split in the religious wing of the GOP. I wonder how it would have been if McCain wasn't running and it was Huckabee vs. Romney in 2008.
kochman
Deity
- Joined
- Jun 8, 2009
- Messages
- 10,818
Agreed, his best hope is that the opponent is worse than him... that's what got him elected to begin with, right? It's always the "lesser of two"...
There is no Ross Perot to skew the election this time like there was both times Clinton won with under 50%...
Yes, he does well compared to other incumbents, however, that isn't enough to win. Being in is counting against you right now... so the outsider is at the advantage in the end.
"Liberals" and blacks are the only two groups that remain strong in their support for him, according to polls.
Ummm... he's in 3 major conflicts... Iraq, Afghanistan and Libya.
Iraq was "won" based on the "Surge", that is widely acknowledged. It is safer to be in Iraq than Detroit, practically speaking.
Afghanistan is a FAR CRY from a success!
Libya... not fairing too well there either.
GhostWriter16
Deity
I think a lot of the Tea Party is a bit anti-Mormon as well.
Personally, I don't see why him being Mormon is a big deal, I'm much more concerned about the whole Romneycare thing, plus Romney flip-flopping on abortion.
Then again, Mccain was a bit of a liar as well.
I'm so sick of the Republican Party (And the Democrat Party for that matter.) We need a real Libertarian candidate.
Nah, 2008 Obama was a particularly gifted politician that a lot of people voted FOR instead of against McCain. He beat Clinton too, who certainly wasn't a slouch of a candidate. The McCain camp only really imploded after selecting Palin.
Depending on the state shakeout, you don't really need one.
And this is a major problem, especially since blacks (as a group), can't really be counted on to vote in strength. Obama won virtually every single demographic last year (even rich people!), and needs a strong showing (in votes and activity) from people under 30, latinos, the educated, women, labor, and "liberals". If even one of those groups is lukewarm, he isn't going to be able to make up the difference in white suburbanites.
GoodGame
Red, White, & Blue, baby!
- Joined
- Dec 17, 2004
- Messages
- 13,725
Afghan is a success in the damage done to the Al Qaeda/Taliban network. Definitely not a failure overall.
kochman
Deity
- Joined
- Jun 8, 2009
- Messages
- 10,818
If you say so...
To me, it was a waste of resources to begin with, and doubling down with it only makes our eventual failure there a harder pill to swallow.
GhostWriter16
Deity
True, but DT is still right, usually 1-3% of people vote independent. Didn't something like 10% or more vote for Perot?
I don't agree that you "Don't need to worry" if you have 48% though. I'd say if you have 48% of the vote, your chance to win is iffy. I think you need 51% to be totally secure. But winning with 48% is possible.
NickyJ
Retired Narrator
Perot got 18% of the vote in '92.
Dan Quayle should have kicked him off the ballot.
GhostWriter16
Deity
Why do "The Educated" vote Liberal more???
Because they are more likely to approach politics from an intelligent angle.
EDIT: I apologize, I was trying to make light here and create some discussion about the claim that educated people vote liberal more. It spawned discussion later on, but apparently not everyone was on the ball of this being a tongue-in-cheek remark.
JollyRoger said:
Moderator Action: Please don't imply that conservatives are not intelligent
Please read the forum rules: http://forums.civfanatics.com/showthread.php?t=422889
GhostWriter16
Deity
I was hoping for a more in-depth answer...
The basic idea behind the statement is that liberalism emphasizes liberty and rights as core values. As the loss of these values often is the result of popularism that grows from fear, it should be natural that people who are less likely to be afraid of things they don't understand would also be more prone to liberalism. I would consider it intuitive to correlate the acceptance of lack of understanding with intellect.
