Will religion eventually collapse?

[LesCanadiens]

So you think that if I lost all my money, I would instantly run to a church?



What about all the people who are secular and poor right now?

Your logic is seriously warped, if you don't mind me scoffing...!
You think that people will not try and better their situation?
They will merely give up and go rushing to the nearest dogma?

I think I need not really comment...Your 'reasoning' does a
pretty good enough job of making itself look ludicrous...!

PS
It seems the most religious are those who also have free time and money
to sit and pontificate to others about how atheists are a scourge, etc...!

....

Maybe you didn't read what I wrote. I said that it probably wouldn't happen over night, but eventually the successive generations that grow up in a materially poor will successively turn to religion more and more as a form of spiritual relief. Eventually, after the Western countries are poor, there will be little to no atheism left as all the athiests have died and everyone in the new generations becomes religious.

Also, "it seems" = unfounded rumour, hearsay, and reliance on personal anecdotes. Not exactly the behaviour of an enlightened atheist. Take a look at the least religious countries; they're all in the West where standards of living are the highest. Go to poorer countries and they are universally more religious. Or, look at the evidence.

You need to spend less time attacking others with different viewpoints and more time actually reading and understanding them. Otherwise you're just a big troll.

 

[Globex]

Also, "it seems" = unfounded rumour, hearsay, and reliance on personal anecdotes. Not exactly the behaviour of an enlightened atheist. Take a look at the least religious countries; they're all in the West where standards of living are the highest. Go to poorer countries and they are universally more religious. Or, look at the evidence.

I've been looking for something like this for a long time. Thanks for the link.

 

[SnowlyWhite]

the evidence is that if people becoming richer doesn't determine them to build even more churches

and I'd say it makes sense - if you have 1, I don't see the point to build another... why would you? To go to one 1 week and to the other next week? US scoring high also makes sense given there are apparently way more believes then average over there.

leaving aside kuwait is listed with half of it's GDP and there are western countries with higher GDP then US yet US is listed like having the highest...

 

[CurtSibling]

Maybe you didn't read what I wrote. I said that it probably wouldn't happen over night, but eventually the successive generations that grow up in a materially poor will successively turn to religion more and more as a form of spiritual relief. Eventually, after the Western countries are poor, there will be little to no atheism left as all the athiests have died and everyone in the new generations becomes religious.

Here we see a classic religious relish in suffering that borders on the weird.

You are hallucinating this idea that Western modern people have no idea
how to protect themselves in times of trouble. And that the current bad
economic trends are permanent...It shows you have little understanding
of the way money works, the way societies work, and you have little
knowledge of the powerful wealth infrastructure of Western civilisation...

Perhaps people sitting in 2nd rate nations like India or Africa have no
inkling to get a better life, but in the West we have institutions and
an entrepreneurial nature that will not allow us to fall. You are of the
idea that businessmen and banks are going to sit a watch the West
collapse? Sorry, but you are totally wrong on this one, Les!

And do you think religion is going to get a better and better repution
in the future? Educated people know that many world problems stem
from warped application of religious dogma, so that will never change.

Also, "it seems" = unfounded rumour, hearsay, and reliance on personal anecdotes. Not exactly the behaviour of an enlightened atheist. Take a look at the least religious countries; they're all in the West where standards of living are the highest. Go to poorer countries and they are universally more religious. Or, look at the evidence.

Your condemnation is worthless, wafer thin, and false.

Do you really think I do not know that poorer nations turn to gods for
help? That is not only to do with money, but EDUCATION! People who
can think for themselves tend to reject the hocus-pocus of blind faith
and incorporate spiritual life with real life. And atheism is a product of
a society that allows free thought, not just standard of living...

You basically say there are no poor atheists...Which is total rubbish.

Free thinking is what causes atheism, not wealth...You miss the obvious.

You need to spend less time attacking others with different viewpoints and more time actually reading and understanding them. Otherwise you're just a big troll.

Yawn!
Another tired old tactic here!

When religious posters cannot handle his argument sinking without trace,
he resorts to calling the atheist a troll...Seen it all a MILLION times before.

I never trolled. I don't have to respect ideas I think are wrong.
That's why you won't see me backing nazism or communism either.

I have time for your words, but you have to make sense.

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[CurtSibling]

The fact that you are unable to save yourself through deeds. It is Jesus's mercy alone that saves us. All other relgions either have some "ultimate enlightenment" you are suppose to realize if you work on it. Or your deeds are what defines your afterlife as far as I know. In Christianity you cannot save yourself. That is the entire purpose of Jesus's sacrifice. It is only by His grace that you will be saved.

You seem to think you know what lies beyond death...
How many zombies were involved in writing the bible?

So it would seem to one who seeks earthly rewards instead of heavenly ones.

When someone proves the truth of such rewards, they will become worth working for.

....

 

[King Flevance]

You seem to think you know what lies beyond death...
How many zombies were involved in writing the bible?

I don't have any idea what you mean by that.

When someone proves the truth of such rewards, they will become worth working for.

And its very possible when proof is provided it is too late. Our chance to "work for it" (have faith) is now, not then.

 

[CurtSibling]

I don't have any idea what you mean by that.

No-one has died and came back to tell us what lie beyond death, except the zombies in movies.

You can say Jesus did, but in my view, he was merely an invented character to build a religion around.

And its very possible when proof is provided it is too late. Our chance to "work for it" (have faith) is now, not then.

Sorry, I have moved beyond such simplistic nations at age 10.

...

 

[King Flevance]

No-one has died and came back to tell us what lie beyond death, except the zombies in movies.

You can say Jesus did, but in my view, he was merely an invented character to build a religion around.

Jesus told us what lie beyond death before he died. He just came back and said "See?". The bolded part has me wondering if you are one of the people who think Jesus is an entirely made up charactor.

Sorry, I have moved beyond such simplistic nations at age 10.

Why do you insist life be complicated?

 

[SnowlyWhite]

complication and common sense have little to do with each other...

 

[Huayna Capac357]

We do know that Jesus existed. It's not like God; you can't really be an ajesusist...

 

[Abaddon]

We do know that Jesus existed.

Er, no! You believe he existed.


Also, "Religion" will not eventually collapse, be it Pagan beliefs, Norse Gods or the Greeks, humans have religion.

Just don't expect the religions around us today to presist.

 

[Huayna Capac357]

Well, there are records that he was alive. And also it's unlikely that so many people (the writers of like the 6 trillion gospels) would independentely invent someone. It is continually unlikely that a religion based on a made up person spread so quickly.

 

[Abaddon]

I would think you could find records for anyone existing anywhere if you wanted. An there is a significant difference between a man called jesus being around, deciding he is the son of god, and him actually being the son of god.

 

[CurtSibling]

Jesus told us what lie beyond death before he died. He just came back and said "See?". The bolded part has me wondering if you are one of the people who think Jesus is an entirely made up charactor.

I am one of those people!

To me, Jesus is an ancient world fan-fic character, invented to lend
weight to a new religion, copied from a dozen preceding near-East
religions...If you want to believe he told you what is beyond death,
that is fine - Just don't refer to your idol as 'ours'...He is 'yours'.

Why do you insist life be complicated?

My brain insists! I cannot squander this wonderous electro-chemical organ in
my skull and pretend the cosmos is full of fairy tales and inflexible absolutes.

...

 

[Huayna Capac357]

But they were literally saying there was no man named Jesus. I'm not disputing you, I'm saying that Jesus existed as a man and it is up to you to decide if He was God.

 

[CurtSibling]

We do know that Jesus existed. It's not like God; you can't really be an ajesusist...

Actually we don't.

For an empire that had records on everyone and their donkey, the Romans
had a strange lack of evidence for this alarmingly important prophet, Jesus.

The only letters talking about him were penned by men who started the fanclub.

...

 

[Abaddon]

I'll field that direction of discussion to Curt, in comparision I am not armed enough

 

[CurtSibling]

It's just my view - I fully expect the faithful to cling to what they have been taught.

 

[Huayna Capac357]

Fine, then Jesus didn't exist and I'm just a degenerate. I'll just stop talking now.

 

[CurtSibling]

BTW -Abaddon - Just curious...
Were you THE Slozenger, from Counterglow?

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