Will the Chu-Ko-Nu be affected by G&K

[YouMust]

In Civ V as China I would always conquer cities with the Chu-Ko-Nu. Will it's effectiveness decrease with the combat changes in G&K?

 

[Louis XXIV]

It depends. If anything, it might increase since you can upgrade them to Gatling guns and machine guns.

 

[AriochIV]

Archery units already have a 25% penalty against Cities; I don't see any reason to change that.

 

[Deggial]

On the other hand, it is reported that siege engines will be crucial to conquer walled cities in G&K. So, they might have re-balanced city strength or archery penalty against cities.
With the information we have so far, it is not possible to predict the tactical consequences.

As the new damage calculation will lead to lower minimal damage, I see a reasonable possibility of Chu-Ko-Nu being less usefull in sieges, though.

 

[Verified_Confection_Being]

They will most likely be less effective thanks to the health improvements in G&K, and rightfully so. Archers despite their arsenal are not suited to taking cities.

 

[Montov]

And with the addition of the composite crossbow, it is likely the regular crossbow is moved to a later tech.

 

[apocalypse105]

China allready had a massive nerve in psot patches I thinx they are well balanced now.

They aren't the strongest civ out there but they are good

 

[bcaiko]

Do we think either the Longbowman or the Chu-Ko-Nu could be moved from replacing the Crossbowman to replacing the Composite Bowman?

 

[vcutag]

Any word on whether the "attack twice per turn" upgrade will stay with the unit when it upgrades to gatling/machine gun?

 

[Eagle Pursuit]

IIRC, it did stay after upgrade, but it didn't effect the melee units that the CKN currently upgrades to.

 

[elprofesor]

I haven't tried myself, but I've read posts by many people claiming that they hoarded CKNs just to have a "fake-blitz" on upgrade.

 

[AriochIV]

And with the addition of the composite crossbow, it is likely the regular crossbow is moved to a later tech.

Crossbowman is still in Machinery, but all post-Classical techs are "later" due to the fact that Classical era is now 2 tiers.

Do we think either the Longbowman or the Chu-Ko-Nu could be moved from replacing the Crossbowman to replacing the Composite Bowman?

No. Both the Longbowman and Chu-Ko-Nu are Medieval units, whereas teh Composite Bowman is Classical era.

 

[MadDjinn]

In Civ V as China I would always conquer cities with the Chu-Ko-Nu. Will it's effectiveness decrease with the combat changes in G&K?

given the likelihood of the minimum damage being dropped below 10%, CKN will eventually be less useful vs. cities.


but right away, at the point Xbows are in power, they'll likely do fine given that they have 2 attacks/turn. Of course, they still have to get in range of the cities, so that mitigates it a bit.

 

[Buccaneer]

"fake-blitz"?

 

[elprofesor]

Off the top of my memory (although lately it's been known to fail me a lot), logistics allows two attacks per turn, while blitz allows as many attacks per turn as you have movement points.

 

[Ajuga]

Off the top of my memory (although lately it's been known to fail me a lot), logistics allows two attacks per turn, while blitz allows as many attacks per turn as you have movement points.

Almost, logistics allow one additional attack per turn (but it boils down to the same result).

 

[Arkangelus]

China will actually change quite a lot, it seems. The CKN upgrading into Gattling Guns with Logistics is impressive enough, but it seems also Great Generals and their use has changed a lot too - China will have more of them to steal land with, and with general GG proximity bonuses reduced theirs will stand out more.

Would it be fair to call all of these changes improvements to their overall play?

 

[CivilizedPlayer]

and with general GG proximity bonuses reduced theirs will stand out more.

I never heard about this. What do you mean by reduced?

And a more on topic point: GaK is going to make siege weapons crucial to capturing cities, as someone already mentioned. Cho-Ku-Nos are still going to be useful against other units, but probably not against cities. They're making catapults resource-free now, so getting early game siege weapons will be a lot easier.

 

[elprofesor]

I don't know about the combat strength bonus reduction (I may have read +15% somewhere?), but now using a GG to build a citadel also gets you a "free" culture bomb. Which is twice as nice, since it makes citadels more useful, makes culture bombs tied to a military need (as it should, since it has diplomatic consequences), and means that GAs one time bonus has been changed!