1. We have added a Gift Upgrades feature that allows you to gift an account upgrade to another member, just in time for the holiday season. You can see the gift option when going to the Account Upgrades screen, or on any user profile screen.
    Dismiss Notice

Winning without defensive units

Discussion in 'Civ3 - Strategy & Tips' started by ZubieMaster, Sep 25, 2005.

  1. DaveMcW

    DaveMcW Chieftain

    Joined:
    Oct 8, 2002
    Messages:
    6,489
    Armies :D

    I do admit that catapults can be used offensively on Sid. But that's not because they are good at offense, it's because the AI knows how to doesn't know how to kill them.
     
  2. vmxa

    vmxa Chieftain

    Joined:
    Feb 9, 2004
    Messages:
    13,701
    Location:
    Oviedo, Fl
    I play lots of Sid games and never used RoP at all. There are many ways to wage war on Sid. Is it islands or contients or pangea. The main way is to use armies as the AI won't have them and won't attack them (for the most part). Even the patrol flag will not really trigger attacks on armies (full health).
     
  3. Fried Egg

    Fried Egg Chieftain

    Joined:
    Jul 19, 2005
    Messages:
    341
    I think this whole comparison between swordsmen and spearmen is kind of silly. They both defend the same but swordsmen have much better attack.

    Later on in the game when the corresponding attack and defence units do not share the same defence rating, the logic of building no defensive units will fall down flat.
     
  4. ZubieMaster

    ZubieMaster Chieftain

    Joined:
    Mar 11, 2004
    Messages:
    102
    [820AD]



    War is raging all around, but my troops have reached Osaka with their eyes on the prize (the Great Library). I set out from China (via ROP) with 21 swords, 24 horses and 26 cats. Once again alliances are proving crucial. With Germany and France hitting Japan hard, he was unable to concentrate on my stack. I lost 3 swords on the way. A good example of not needing defenders to escort stacks; swords do just fine (and of course so do allies). Of course, in a perfect world my stack would be covered by a sword army by now, but such is my leader luck...

    Osaka and the GL -- and tech parity -- are mine on the next turn. After holding the requisite one turn my stack heads home to upgrade to knights, leaving Osaka to be recaptured before I got education, meaning I can take it again later for another tech boost.

    [1060AD]



    It's two hundred years later. After upgrading to knights, I swept thru and destroyed insignificant China in the blink of an eye. My "defenseless" military: 15 swords, 27 cats, 33 knights -- and 26 more horses waiting to upgrade.

    Germany has been fighting hard against Japan this whole time, so I've declared on them, they'll be easy pickins'. The plan is simply to hold at the natural barrier of mountains north of Chengdu while my SOD -- now covered by that long-overdue sword army -- sweeps up thru Beijing. Ultimately I will put fortified knights on those northern mountains.

    I've put up markets in my core, ducts for added unit support, courts where needed, harbors for pop growth. I've peeled settlers or workers when growth stalls in a city. Economy is +175gpt at no research, even with paying off Joan to stay allied. I ended up allying Toku as well just in case he had thoughts of declaring on me.

    [1150AD]



    Germany's put up a good fight but since I'm not wasting any time building pikes, I've gained to 53 knights while systematically destroying them, soon to be moving on their core. I've also got 2 armies which can provide all the defense a stack needs. I'm strong compared to Germany already and they are a Republic (not for long with WW). New cities are getting a library (rushed) then a courthouse since corruption is so bad.

    [1280AD]



    Now at 77 knights and 37 cats, 11 swords (mostly in armies) and 2 elite horses (leader fishing). About to march on Berlin...

    [1415AD]



    The war with Germany is over, Bismark is exiled to an island OCC. I'm at 120 knights, 63 cats, 3 sword armies -- and of course zero pikes or muskets. In a little over 300 years of war that destroyed Germany, I more than doubled my military at the same time yet again. I have 6560 gold and am making 429gpt.

    With no more war, France & Japan are going to run away even more tech-wise and get rifles and cav soon. I have a choice: go for Japan and get the GL again, or go after the stronger Joan. I decide on Joan, and my units begin the long trek down from the German peninsula. I really begin to bolster my southern border w/ France. This will be the biggest test since I will finally be putting my outdated no-defense army against the tech leader...
     
  5. Fried Egg

    Fried Egg Chieftain

    Joined:
    Jul 19, 2005
    Messages:
    341
    Again with Knights and Pikemen; they share the same defensive value. You are defending (when necessary) as well with knights as you could be with pikemen. Although Knights are more than twice as expensive to build (you can't have upgraded all 120 knights from horsemen).

    The true test of your strategy will come when you are being attacked by cavalry are are defending with knights. Although perhaps sheer numbers will carry the day for you...but that's not really the point, is it?
     
  6. ZubieMaster

    ZubieMaster Chieftain

    Joined:
    Mar 11, 2004
    Messages:
    102
    I think you're right, the most dangerous time is when the AI gets Cav and you're sitting there with defense 3 knights. However, like you said the sheer numbers of units will prevail (especially in this game). And I think that is somewhat the point -- if I only had half that number of knights because the other half of my military was pikes, I would be in a worse position to deal with the AI cav. I want to attack and eliminate his cav, not try to absorb its attacks and let them limp back home to heal. Also remember these points:

    - My defense 3 knights aren't going to be sitting on plains just waiting to be slaughtered, they are going to be using the terrain. A vet knight on mountain defending versus a vet cav is 50/50. If it has time to fortify, the *knight* will beat the attacking cav over half the time.

    - If the AI bypasses the mountains and enters my territory, then they will be eliminated by attacking knights and cats, which comes back to having sheer numbers because I did not waste builds on pikes...

    - By this stage in the game SODs will not have exposed knights, they will be covered by armies. And you will have massed the great equalizer -- arty (cats, soon to be cannon).

    - This phase of the game shouldn't last long. Since you have chiv you are just a few techs away from getting cannon and cav yourself, even if you have to self-research.

    - Coming around the bend is nationalism. But don't build the rifles -- draft them! What else are you gonna do with the cities stuck at size 12? By this stage I have peeled off settlers and my entire workforce is captured anyway, so unless you draft those cities are wasting potential growth.
     

Share This Page