[WIP] South East Asian Civilisations Project

[senshidenshi]

What do you think about other suggestions?

I'm having serious trouble liking either of the Vietnamese War themes suggested; as the first one isn't very Vietnamese and the second one is awful to listen to.

 

[Krajzen]

Yeah, Civ5 original music for civs was composed by proffesionals - it is really difficult for amateur to find perfect themes for not - so - mainstream nations in the Internet if:

a) It has to be short
b) It can't be to monotonous
c) Nor too dynamic/epic
d) It can't be modern because it sounds immersion - breaking
e) It shouldn't have loud vocal
f) ...all of these points make finding PEACE music difficult but WAR music is even worse - it not only has to fulfill all these requirements but also sound 'badass' (and in the same time being b and c )
g) Additional problem - I guess Cambodia (despite being poor) has rich resources of 'reconstruction of traditional music' or something like that but I can't find it BECAUSE I DON'T KNOW KHMER LANGUAGE

So, to sum up, whole process relies on seeking for the perfect theme for non - English speaking nation while using English searching engines. Good luck

It also depends on which exact civilisation is being made. Africa has surprisingly rich traditions of music, hell even Indians from North America have lots of their cool whistling music (you know what I am talking about, right? ) but finding music for medieval South East Asian countries is daunting task

Oh, and there is yet another problem, e) - some cultures have musich which seems to be very alien for Europeans. I mean, as you noticed, this Vietnamese Court War Music - I listen to that, listen, and I cannot understand how human being can enjoy such awful monotonous squaling (and usually I love East Asian culture!)

What do you think about leader choices?

 

[TPangolin]

That peace theme sounds exactly like the Yellow Sea theme song from the Samurai Invasion scenario (which is better).

I suggest looking for music from Shogun Total War or Asian Dynastie AoE II expansion.

 

[Krajzen]

OK.

So, war:

Yoisa
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CXFLi_LDwhs&list=PL7F38E372B470537B

Tsunami - I really like this one
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=U_uDJlqj0rQ&list=PL7F38E372B470537B

Good Death - also cool
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lHGUdWjoS44&list=PL7F38E372B470537B

Oyoiyoi
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EVrNq-2okG0&list=PL7F38E372B470537B



EDIT

OK, I was bored in school so I have created these ideas for Unique Features of other South East Asian Civilisations.


ANGKOR - KHMER EMPIRE

Spoiler :

UI - Baray [artificial source of fresh water]. Available on Engineering. Can be built on flat grassland without resources and cannot be adjacent to another Baray. Provides +3 food and fresh water to adjacent tiles, also +2 culture after Archeology. Is destroyed rather than pillaged.
UU - Ballista Elephant, either ranged version of Knight or heavy version of Trebuchet. Has big bonus towards melee strenght (useful for both versions) and has no movement penalties for difficult terrain.

UA - and here I have plethora of ideas...

- When World Wonder is built can start We Love The King Day or Golden Age; internal trade routes provide bonus to wonder production

- Trade routes generate points towards WLTKD and Glden Ages

- Great Works and Wonders provide bonus to Golden Ages generaion; Golden Age immediately starts also WLTKD in all cities (last till the end of GA)

- WLTKD provides +20% wonder production bonus. Culture accumulates towards WLTKD.

SRIVIVAYA - SUMATRAN EMPIRE

Spoiler :

UA - +1 faith from plantations and minor gold boost after building them. Can build civilian units and warships for faith.
UU - generic name Sumatran Junk Ship, replaces Galleas, double sight range, can sell goods to foreign cities [gold boost for both civs + spread state religion to this city]
UB - generic name Stupa, expensive version of temple, +2 gold. Each time trade route arrives to city with Stupa, receive faith and culture boost.

MALAYSIA - MALAYAN EMPIRE

Spoiler :

UA - Science from trade routes tripled, +1 to gold from coasts and +1 production from sea resources if city sends or receives trade route.
UU - Cetbang Cannon, +1 to range when inside the city or on the coast. Generates culture.
UB - generic name, replaces Mint, when built randomly chooses and starts providing on of these resources: Jewelry, Porcelain, Pepper, Muscat, Cloves or UniqueMalayanResource

SINGAPORE - REPUBLIC OF SINGAPORE
Leader: Lee Kuan Yew

Spoiler :

UA - cannot found nor annex cities. Each two buildings in the capital increase gold of trade routes incoming and sent from it by 1 and production of city by 1. Each first foreign trade route sent to the capital in particular era increases its population by 1.
UU - generic name Investor, when sent to civ and perform Investitions mission, provides instant boost of % research and income of this nation.
UI - generic name Trade Outpost - when built in the CS territory provides gold and slowly increases influence over it, if influence surpasses 100 - CS is immediately annexed by Singapore. If other civilisation become ally of CS before 100 cap, Singapore influence in this city state falls to 0 and starts accumulating again if CS has no allies/is ally of Singapore.

LAN XANG - LAOTAN EMPIRE

Spoiler :

UA: Land of Million Elephants. Can recruit all elephant unique units* and use production or gold to create religious buildings and units since Theology.
UU: Laotan Musketman - Bonus strenght per happiness/gold/faith/followers of state religion in capital.
UB: White Elephant Stable - aand I have no ideas for this one


* - African Forest Elephant, Indian War Elephant, Naresuan Elephant, Khmer Ballista Elephant

Please review

 

[Skaz881]

OOOOOOOOOO, I did a research paper on Srivajaya and Pagan a few years ago, nice to see it getting a place in the Civ 5 universe.

 

[senshidenshi]

Umm... why wasn't I run through the name/purpose change...?

 

[Krajzen]

Umm... why wasn't I run through the name/purpose change...?

Hm... I thought you wanna make South East Asian Civs and we have even started discussing about Khmer here I thought that thread name [Vietnamese Civilization] is inappropriate

You would like to change it/replace me here/something? No problem

Good news:

http://forums.civfanatics.com/showpost.php?p=13148645&postcount=469

 

[senshidenshi]

Well, um, I was sort of planning on releasing a SEACS thread on "New Civilizations" after we finished Nam...

 

[Krajzen]

Haha OK no problem So this will remain as SEACS thread only for development time

Which civs were you going to create?

 

[senshidenshi]

Finishing what knightmare had started:

• Vietnam
• Khmer
• Laos
• Burma
• Malaysia

My personal ideas:

• Singapore
• Siam Split (Ayutthaya and Sukhothai, maybe Thailand as well?)
• A bunch of scenarios (Maybe SEACS could change to South East Asian Civilizations and Scenarios?)
• Some more unknown civs, like the Tagalog and Pyu

 

[Krajzen]

Finishing what knightmare had started:

• Vietnam
• Khmer
• Laos
• Burma
• Malaysia

I like these nations Although I am not sure about Burma, because there is already excellent Burmese Civilisation Mod made by Pouakai Team
Well, from what I know it concentrates on Pagan Empire period so if you really wanna create Burma we should give it rather the flavour of Second Burmese Empire
On the other hand when I see the extent of this empire I am so impressed... Yeah, we can make it

Spoiler :

My personal ideas:

• Singapore

• 
  
  Definitely - modern economic superpower
  
  

  [*]Siam Split (Ayutthaya and Sukhothai, maybe Thailand as well?)

  
  Personally I am not sure if I have enough ideas for splitting all these nations :0 we will see.
  
  

  [*]A bunch of scenarios (Maybe SEACS could change to South East Asian Civilizations and Scenarios?)

  
  I can definitely help with maps/scenarios
  
  Currently I am going to create general East Asian TSL map (I am awaiting mainly on Vietnam ), late I can work on specific SEA scenario
  
  

  [*]Some more unknown civs, like the Tagalog and Pyu

  
  Personally I would highly recommend two historical great empires of this region:
  
  - Srivivaya
  
  Spoiler :

  
  
  
  - Funan, first great empire of Indochina
  
  Spoiler :

  

 

[Krajzen]

By the way, you don't even imagine how obscure Laotan History is... Way, way more obscure than history of Vietnam which is also far from being widely known To be honest I never had such big problems with finding big amounts of information about any civilisation, except from some obscure African tropical kingdoms or extremely old cultures

I am going to compile text for Civilopedia -> History of Laos, City List and Spy Names so later I will do easier things

EDIT
Finally I have found some long sources about Lan Xang! I will write here about the greatest Laotan leaders and let you decide which should be chosen

 

[senshidenshi]

I was thinking Sourigna Vongsa, but if you could find any better ones, that would be greatly appreciated

 

[Krajzen]

Yeah, Vongsa also was nice. Although I am not sure about including him because...

'In his golden age of Lan Xang, the wealth was primarily spent on religion, rather than on equipping the army with European weapons. It was one of the crucial reasons why the kingdom declined afterward.'

 

[Krajzen]

Hey Senshidenshi, is Truong personality already done?

TRUONG SISTERS

Spoiler :

PERSONALITIES
Victory Competitiviness - 5
Wonder Competitiviness - 5
City State Competitiviness - 3
Boldness - 6
Diplo Balance - 5
Warmonger Hate - 4
Denounce Willingness - 5
Friendship Willingness - 6
Loyalty - 8
Neediness - 3
Forgiveness - 3
Chattiness - 4
Meanness - 7

CIV BIASES
War - 5
Hostile - 5
Deceptive - 4
Guarded - 7
Afraid - 2
Friendly - 6
Neutral - 5

CITY STATES
Ignore - 7
Friendly - 6
Protective - 4
Conquest - 4

FLAVORS
Offense - 5
Defense - 8
City Defense - 8
Military Training - 6
Recon - 4
Ranged - 5
Mobile - 5
Naval - 5
Naval Recon - 4
Naval Growth - 4
Naval Tile Improvement - 6
Air - 5
Expansion - 5
Growth - 7
Tile Improvement - 5
Infrastructure - 7
Production - 5
Gold - 5
Science - 6
Culture - 7
Happiness - 5
Great People - 7
Wonder - 5
Religion - 4
Diplomacy - 5
Spaceship - 5
Water Connection - 4
Nuke - 6
Use nuke - 6
Espionage - 7
Anti Air - 7
Air Carrier - 5
Land Trade Route - 7
Sea Trade Route - 7
Archaeology - 5
Trade Origin - 5
Trade Destination - 5
Airlift - 5

So, these Truong Sisters:
- don't care very much about victory and religion
- don't care much about diplomacy and city states
- very loyal friends, very unforgiving enemies :0
- don't like chatting and needing things from other civs
- ofter guarded
- never afraid
- most defensive civ ever
- high growth, culture, great people, infrastructure flavors (UA/UB)
- high espionage, anti air

Do you know any way how to set Vietnam AI to follow Honor?

 

[senshidenshi]

We're going to need to overhaul the Social Policy system for the Trungs and the Trungs only. "Lord Trung Sisters" makes no sense, and neither does "Trung Sisters the Great"

Any ideas regarding this?

 

[TPangolin]

We'll have to split the name in this regard. Trung Trac and Trung Nhi (so it can be turned into Ladies, Presidents, Doges etc.).

Provide me a list of all the SP titles (and their respective policies), what it should be changed to (Lord -> Ladies, Chairman-> Chairwomen) and I'll sort it out for you.

 

[Krajzen]

Maybe they should receive no title at all?

 

[senshidenshi]

We'll have to split the name in this regard. Trung Trac and Trung Nhi (so it can be turned into Ladies, Presidents, Doges etc.).

Provide me a list of all the SP titles (and their respective policies), what it should be changed to (Lord -> Ladies, Chairman-> Chairwomen) and I'll sort it out for you.

Tradition: Lord -> Ladies
Liberty: Consul -> Consuls
Honour: the Great (suffix) -> The Great (prefix)
Piety: the Pious (suffix) -> The Pious (prefix)
Patronage: the Enlightened (suffix) -> The Enlightened (prefix)
Aesthetics: Master -> Mistresses
Commerce: Doge -> Doges
Exploration: Captain -> Captains
Rationalism: the Wise (suffix) -> The Wise (prefix)
Freedom: President -> Presidents or Co-Presidents
Order: Chairman -> Chairwomen
Autocracy: the Terrible (suffix) -> The Terrible

I'm thinking of changing Honour's to "The Legendary Sisters," because it sounds a LOT cooler and it incentivises honour even more

 

[Krajzen]

I love Enlightened, Legendary and Terrible, otherwise I have few different suggestions:


Tradition - 'Ladies Truong Sisters' sounds silly...

Truong Queen Sisters of Vietnam

The Majestic Truong Sisters of Vietnam

Liberty - to be honest I have no idea here...

Truong Sisters the Consuls of Vietnam

Truong Sisters the Representants of Vietnam

Piety

The Worshipful Truong Sisters of Vietnam

Aestethics

Magnificent Truong Sisters of Vietnam

Commerce

The Affluent Truong Sisters of Vietnam

Rationalism

The Sagacious Truong Sisters of Vietnam

Exploration

Truong Captain Sisters of Vietnam

Courageous Truong Sisters of Vietnam



The Truong Chairwomen of Vietnamese People's Republic

The Truong Presidents of Republic of Vietnam