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Wonder balance and new wonders - post 1.5

Discussion in 'Rhye's and Fall: Europe' started by AbsintheRed, Apr 24, 2017.

  1. The Turk

    The Turk Chieftain

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    Qayrawan needs to be added to the map as part of the map update. Then we can represent the Mosque of Qayrawan. Otherwise it doesn't make sense adding it. As for the rest of the wonders I've never heard of them. And please no "free civic" unlocks. They are lazy and generally break immersion unless properly situated.
     
  2. SanJose

    SanJose Chieftain

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    I thought the following moment in the history of the castle seemed interesting:

    ...The first documented mentioning of Bran Castle is the act issued by Louis I of Hungary on 19 November 1377, giving the Saxons of Kronstadt (Brașov) the privilege to build the stone castle on their own expense and labor force...

    Civ that will first adopt Free Peasantry/Free Labor receives free Bran Castle (сonsider this as Easter eggs).


    The majority of candidates from the list an attempt to find more or less interesting and large architectural buildings in WW's poor areas in RFCE (Valahia,Transylvania,Moldova,Sicily,Crimea,Maghrib)
     
  3. The Turk

    The Turk Chieftain

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    Just to be clear, just because I haven't heard of them is not a rejection of them. Its just a statement of fact. But yes, as you said, we need more in the Balkans and Eastern Europe in general.

    Sicily, the Maghreb + Egypt should be easy to find wonders for, I've already listed some earlier.
     
  4. SanJose

    SanJose Chieftain

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    This castle is known as the Dracula Castle plus excellent views of the castle will add voices for it :)
     
  5. AbsintheRed

    AbsintheRed Chieftain

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    You mean
    Castle of Törcsvár
    Castle of Vajdahunyad
    Black Church of Brassó

    right?

    Neither of these has any connection to Romania/Wallachia :p
    I'm not sure if I will add more Hungarian wonders (we already have 3), but there are plenty to choose from, yes
    Btw, neither of these Castles has any connection to Vlad Tepes/Dracula.

    There are not many possible wonders from Wallachia, Moldavia or the Balkans.
    The Arges Cathedral is very late for a religious building, also rather small and insignificant.
    I have Rila Monastery on my list too, but as a possibility instead of Boyana Church. Won't add 2 similar Bulgarian wonders from the same region.

    Instead of the Giralda I think the Koutoubia Mosque is a much better candidate.
    We have some Cordoban wonders, but Morocco is rather underrepresented.
     
  6. AbsintheRed

    AbsintheRed Chieftain

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    We have it this way for many wonders, why would this be so different? Clearly we can't have all important cities on the map, we have to separate wonders and cities in most cases.
    Anyway, just to be sure: you want to have it instead of Tunis? The 2 cities are way too close otherwise for indy city spawn.
     
  7. Swarbs

    Swarbs Chieftain

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    +1 to this.

    As a short term solution, just removing religion civics from Westminster Abbey would be good. It is very odd and immersion breaking that the final Hungarian UHV is shortcut by a rush to WA to adopt Religious Tolerance in the 1300s.

    I'd say all the wonders that currently give free civic access should be changed to boost specific civics or just give general bonuses. So WA can give +1:) per city under Divine Monarchy, Magna Carta +1:) per city under Feudal Monarchy, move Golden Bull back to Paper (make it the 1356 one) and give it +1:) per city under Constitutional Monarchy, Imperial Diet +5 to state expansion stability. At least as a short term measure, until we can find better bonuses for them.
     
  8. AbsintheRed

    AbsintheRed Chieftain

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    Absolutely agree with both of you on this, I also dislike civic-enabling bonuses in general. I even consider the Westminster Abbey an exploit for the Hungarian UHV. Well, maybe not exploit, but definitely an oversight. Should not be possible to reach it that early.
     
  9. gilgames

    gilgames Priest-King

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    I suggested this weeks ago. Another exploit as arabs/morocco/cordoba to not research education but run appreniceship with golden bull.
    Sidenote arabs mid/late game research is horrible slow.
    +1 apprenticeship seems to fit better with guilds.
     
    The Turk likes this.
  10. The Turk

    The Turk Chieftain

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    Qayarwan is far more important. It was the most important city West of Cairo in terms of administration. And like Cairo, it was a garrison town (for Arab Jund armies) which turned into a proper city in its own right. Tunis only emerged as the port of Qayarwan. And it was Qayarwan that was the capital for the Fatimids (well... on the outskirts in a newly built encampment, since the people of Maliki Qayrawan were hostile to the Ismaili Fatimids.

    If Qayarwan is destroyed by barbs, then Tunis can spawn in its place. But we can push Qayarwan further South, but it is REALLY worth it having both cities.
     
  11. SanJose

    SanJose Chieftain

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    yes, no, yes
     
  12. AbsintheRed

    AbsintheRed Chieftain

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    I remember. I read all comments, even if I can't possible reply to all of them individually :)

    Yeah, I also meant that one. The Hunyadi Castle at the city of Vajdahunyad.
    Sry for the confusion.
    I actually visited this Castle last summer :)
     
  13. El Bogus

    El Bogus Chieftain

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    What do you think about a production bonus to wonders in the provinces where these actually existed? Something like 25 %?
     
  14. AbsintheRed

    AbsintheRed Chieftain

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    I'm not really sure how would that affect gameplay.
    From a technical point of view is not too hard to add, but apart from a couple dll checks it also needs some updates in the schema file for the building xmls, which means all buildings have to be updated, not only the wonders.
    Anyway, won't that result in strange gameplay situations? While I get the notion behind your suggestion, wouldn't it only lead to frustration in most cases?
     
  15. El Bogus

    El Bogus Chieftain

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    Would it not be better if all wonders that require a religion couldn't be built by any civ not following this religion?
     
  16. TheMulattoMaker

    TheMulattoMaker Dictator of RF

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    Isn't that already the case unless you're running RelTol?
     
  17. El Bogus

    El Bogus Chieftain

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    No, only a few wonders do also require the state religion to be as needed.
     
  18. TheMulattoMaker

    TheMulattoMaker Dictator of RF

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    Oh okay, I thought that was a condition for every wonder associated with a religion.
     
  19. Baron03

    Baron03 Baron

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    Noticed that one of these might work as a wonder, and they were built around Greece. Maybe small bonuses: coastal city defense, coastal city trade route increase, and general Great Person points.

    Genoese castle of Mytilene
    Koules Fortress in Heraklion
    The Morosini fountain, Lions Square, Heraklion

    There's probably enough castle wonders though, but Europe is famous for castles.
     
  20. AbsintheRed

    AbsintheRed Chieftain

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    Yeah, more unique wonders have preference.
     

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