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Worst Civ?

Discussion in 'Civ3 - General Discussions' started by walletta, Feb 24, 2015.

  1. _ghost_

    _ghost_ Warlord

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    the editor programm u get to make custom scenarios
     
  2. ThinkTank

    ThinkTank RL Addict

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    Instead of looking in the edior you can also look here: http://www.civfanatics.com/civ3/infocenter/#levels
     
  3. Lanzelot

    Lanzelot Moderator Moderator

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    That info is outdated (applies to Civ3 Vanilla only). I have seen an up-to-date list for C3C once, which also includes the values for Demigod and Sid and which has more details on the "Other Effects", like the number of units for which the AI doesn't need to pay upkeep, the combat bonus/malus against barbarian units, the AI-to-AI trade rate or the diplomacy/attitude bonus/malus for Human-to-AI interaction, etc.

    But I can't find a link to that list now... :(
     
  4. tjs282

    tjs282 Socially distancing since 1975

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    Or see this post for the C3C AI bonuses...

    EDIT: Crossposted with Lanzelot again! :D Took me a while to find that info (at least, in a neatly presented form).
     
  5. Lanzelot

    Lanzelot Moderator Moderator

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    Thanks a lot, that's the one I was looking for!
     
  6. walletta

    walletta King

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    Thanks folks. You guys are a mine of information.
     
  7. TBgamer14

    TBgamer14 Chieftain

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    The worst civilization in my opinion is the mongols, i can never really progress with them
     
  8. timerover51

    timerover51 Deity

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    I like very large maps, like 300 X 240 with lots of water, so I prefer the Sea-Faring civilizations. Those kind of maps limit the non-seafarers quite a bit. I like Spain for the short Anarchy period and the Conquistador for Explorer. Not sure if I have a "Worst" civilization, but not a fan of the Aztecs at all.
     
  9. marijan

    marijan Chieftain

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    I found it most difficult to advance with carthaginians and hittites, so I guess they would be worst on my list.
     
  10. Rickard1977

    Rickard1977 Chieftain

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    I would say Germans, because they often start on bad ground with no rivers..
     
  11. Lanzelot

    Lanzelot Moderator Moderator

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    That must be "personal bad luck"... I'm pretty sure there is absolutely no correlation between the nationality of a Civ and the start location they get! (Except for, of course, that seafaring nations always start on the coast.)
     
  12. tjs282

    tjs282 Socially distancing since 1975

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    While I'm well aware that the plural of 'anecdotes' is not 'data' ;) our German Settler in ABLES-SG started in the Desert, surrounded by Floodplains, Desert, Plains, Hills and Jungle... :mischief:

    Also, I recently started two 'all-Random' games (Small map, but random landform/ %ocean/ climate/ age, Random Civ + opponents, Emp, no Culturally linked starts) on two separate machines. Not only did I get the Aztecs assigned as my Civ in both games, my starting position was also similar (high southern latitudes), the Sumerians were my nearest neighbours on my continent, and the Byzzies were also present elsewhere on the map. (FTR, the other three AICivs were: [Game1] the Zulus, Hittites and Inca, and [Game2] the Celts, Vikings and Arabs)

    My stats are pretty rusty, but it seems like the odds of getting any specific combination of 3 civs (out of 6) on a map should be pretty small, yes? And that happened twice...
     
  13. Lanzelot

    Lanzelot Moderator Moderator

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    Yes, 3 or 4 floodplains...! That was an excellent start position, wasn't it. (Which proves my point... ;))

    By the way: "probability" is a very strange animal. It is not uncommon, that in a small sample (and even 100 is still "small" in the world of probability and statistics) even events with a low probability happen from time to time. And there is always the factor of "selective memory". Human beings tend to remember bad things very well and forget the good things.
    In order to get to a halfway significant conclusion, you would need to start a couple thousand games and then see, whether the Germans indeed get a bad start position more often than the Romans or Babylonians do.

    Well, I got curious now, so I looked at a couple of SGs, which had featured the Germans:
    • Our Acronym game: ok, not your dream position with lots of wheat and cows, but certainly better than average, because of the 4 floodplains, 2 oasis, 1 sugar and a long river. Actually a pretty strong start position, we only misplayed it badly... :mischief:
    • CommandoBob's "Germans in tutus": lots of rivers and two wheat (not for the capital, but for the next town, which isn't bad either). Quite powerful.
    • TheOverseer714's "SG for newbees": similar to CommandoBob's, only a bit more cramped. But still a river, BGs and 2 wheat for the first town. (Could have been for the capital, if we would have had more luck with our initial settler move...) Again above average.
    So that's already 3 out of 3 with "better than average"! :D And in all three games no re-roll -- the first position that came out of the RNG was taken!
     
  14. Theov

    Theov Deity

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    Look either they programmed certain surroundings matching with Civs or Traits, or they didn't.
    And apart from Seafaring civs (always??) starting on a coast; there doesn't seem to have been such programming.
     
  15. Quintillus

    Quintillus Archiving Civ3 Content Supporter

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    I'd vote Civ5, but of the civs in Civ3... I used to lean Spanish. But the Conquistador can be a good pillaging machine, especially if you get it early. America and Germany are considerations with the late UUs, but have at least one strong trait. I've never been a fan of the Aztecs with the expensive Jaguar Warrior as a unique unit, although in PTW when they cost 10 shields, it's more compelling. They're the only civ who can still build the regular unit their UU replaces, due to cost.

    Babylon I like, as the religious + scientific = cheap culture and early city buildup, and the Bowman is an all-purpose unique unit. Zululand is all right, too - Impi + Horseman is a good combo, and the movement of Impi can save you when you need one more unit to finish off a redlined enemy.

    The difference between weakest and strongest, overall, is fairly minor, though. And the situations where it's bigger is often where the map favors particular civs rather than disfavoring others - such as an archipelago map favoring the Byzantines.
     
  16. Lord AJ

    Lord AJ The Quartermaster

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    Generate a map in the editor, choose your difficulty and play it with debug mode ticked on and you'll be able to see everything that the AI has. That's it.
     
  17. walletta

    walletta King

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    'Debug mode'? What is this please? Where do I find it?
     
  18. Lord AJ

    Lord AJ The Quartermaster

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    After you generate a map, hit Alt+Enter and in the scenario properties window you'll see a tick box with debug mode written. Just check that box and play that map.
     
  19. Theov

    Theov Deity

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    if you open a BIQ in the editor, you can select 'bug mode' in the scenario properties (?) tab.
    If you open the game then (and the scenario) then you can play around with it.
    It's mostly to see if everything actually works.
     
  20. walletta

    walletta King

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    Not for the first time, I do wonder whether we are playing the same game … :crazyeye:

    Thanks guys.
     

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