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Worst Civ?

Discussion in 'Civ3 - General Discussions' started by SinisterDeath, Jun 27, 2003.

?

Which of these civs are the worst to play?

  1. Aztecs

    15 vote(s)
    10.3%
  2. Iroquois

    16 vote(s)
    11.0%
  3. French

    10 vote(s)
    6.9%
  4. Amercians

    30 vote(s)
    20.7%
  5. Germans

    7 vote(s)
    4.8%
  6. Indians

    12 vote(s)
    8.3%
  7. English

    79 vote(s)
    54.5%
  8. Chinese

    4 vote(s)
    2.8%
  9. Russians

    13 vote(s)
    9.0%
  10. All of the above suck equally...

    7 vote(s)
    4.8%
Multiple votes are allowed.
  1. Junzi Nicuzn

    Junzi Nicuzn Gaijin Samurai

    Joined:
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    Location:
    Orlando, Florida
    anarres

    1) I didn't mean you sucked if you didn't like a culture, I meant you sucked if you couldn't win with any culture, even (I'm starting to believe they really are) the crappy English. If you read my first post you'll see that I say I don't like the Russians (ugly leader), so by your logic I would have been saying I suck. Sorry for the misunderstanding.

    2) Thanks for the idea, I might use that (giving you credit for the idea). And thats what I'm trying to do. One of the things I want to do is balance out the civy traits. :thumbsup:

    Oh, and I could be wrong about this, but I thought the Hwacha (Korea's UU) was the only bombard unit that could kill enemy units. I thought they had the lethal land bombard trait. Someone correct me if I'm wrong
     
  2. sabo

    sabo My Ancestors were Vikings

    Joined:
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    I'm surpised to see so many people pick Americans, sure their UU sucks but that's a minor part of the game. Their expansionist and industrial traits can't be beat!
     
  3. The Last Conformist

    The Last Conformist Irresistibly Attractive

    Joined:
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    Location:
    Not on your side
    No, the Hwach'a does not have Lethal Bombard. It had in a beta, but it, as one might've expected, turned out to unbalancingly powerful.

    Edit: Supplied missed word
     
  4. anarres

    anarres anarchist revolutionary

    Joined:
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    Junzi Nicuzn,

    I make a point of playing with all the civs, although against other humans that are very good I will choose a decent civ if they choose a decent one. Playing England / Korea against China/Persia/Ottos is scary, especially if they are a human.

    One of my latest PBEM's was as England, I wiped out India (human opponenet) nicely. :)

    Regarding the expansionist mod I suggested, I thought about this a while ago, but never got round to it. I would be very interested to hear how it re-balances the traits.
     
  5. Penguin Glory

    Penguin Glory Aquatic Pigeon

    Joined:
    Jun 10, 2003
    Messages:
    126
    Location:
    Miami Beach
    The, English, definetely.
     
  6. Junzi Nicuzn

    Junzi Nicuzn Gaijin Samurai

    Joined:
    Jun 29, 2003
    Messages:
    624
    Location:
    Orlando, Florida
    anarres

    If you wiped out a human opponet with England, then you now have the ultimate taunt

    And if you did anything good military-wise with England (because I agree with the fact that England and Korea suck for military conquests), you obviously do not suck

    Unfortunately, for the Mod I've hit a problem, I'm not sure how (or if its possible) to edit the civy traits beyond the settler-for-scout replacement. It may be beyond my abilities to balance the civy traits.
     
  7. bru

    bru Prince

    Joined:
    Dec 7, 2001
    Messages:
    390
    Location:
    Victoria Canada
    I have the hardest time when playing England, so I would vote for them!!
     
  8. trumpeteer

    trumpeteer Player of Trumpet

    Joined:
    May 16, 2003
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    449
    Location:
    Hell
    The English, for the UU. Like someone said, the Longbow should be their UU.
     
  9. SinisterDeath

    SinisterDeath Pure Quality

    Joined:
    Mar 26, 2003
    Messages:
    408
    Location:
    London, Ontario
    Annarres

    If I don't know anything about using the expansionist trait, then perhaps you could tell me. All I know is that they get an extra scout, and I'd much rather be religious (cheap temples etc.) or industrious (extra worker + faster roads/mines/irrigation etc.) then expansionist.

    Do you have any reasons to like expansionism? Seems like most people in this thread I started seem to think it's useless as well. What are the benefits?
     
  10. superslug

    superslug Still hatin' on Khan Moderator Hall of Fame Staff

    Joined:
    Jan 5, 2003
    Messages:
    11,371
    Location:
    The Farm
    I will not speak for Anarres, but I can point at how Expansionism can be useful. You're right that you start with a Scout, but you also start with the ability to make cheap Scouts. Also, whenever you raid a goody hut, you will not unleash barbarians!

    How is this helpful? It's increasingly helpful on larger maps and higher difficulty levels. On a deity, huge, pangaea game, the Expansionist trait has the possibility of keeping you up with the AI for the Ancient times. Raid the huts fast enough, and you might just stay on the forefront of tech for a few turns. Getting Settlers out of the huts is just as good, since the AI gets a more than healthy start.

    Granted, after that, expansionism does nothing, but there's NO substitute for a good start.

    EDIT: Having pointed out all that, for general gameplay, I agree, Expansionism is the worst of the six traits.
     
  11. ScorpiusAP

    ScorpiusAP Chieftain

    Joined:
    Sep 6, 2002
    Messages:
    82
    I defiantly think that all the civs have strong points, and have their very own winning strattegies. However, that doens't mean that its harder all around with some and easier with others.

    England, in my opinion is the most difficult civ.
     
  12. Portuguese

    Portuguese Vassalising Spain

    Joined:
    Jun 20, 2002
    Messages:
    2,848
    Location:
    Oporto, Portugal (duh)
    English are a complete waste!
    Americans are very bad too.

    I dislike their UU and traits...
     
  13. Paalikles

    Paalikles Emperor

    Joined:
    Nov 28, 2001
    Messages:
    1,536
    @expansionist trait/scout:
    The good use of this trait, a point that SEVERAL players have already pointed out in SEVERAL threads - be expansionistic on a pangaea map - build a few explorers and watch as they pop huts without fearing for their life (no barbs) - then see as they might find the occational ANCIENT tech -> could do some serious boost to research (which on higher diff can be quite important to a player that is outresearched by the AI)
    And, you will have the scout finding other civs - which decrease time needed to research - the more you know the cheaper it gets :)
    Take a look at what the more experienced players do with their games - they play every civ, every condition, and even set special conditions for themselves (like one city challenge, 5 city challenge, always war, peacemonger - all variants on a "normal" game of civ)
    Like being stated by MANY posts before - the civ that's worst in your humble opinion might be the best in my humble opinion, but that's just because I might be playing civ in a different way than you are. that being said - I think it is interesting to read what people think about the civs they are playing or have played - I have not yet played all of the vanilla ones myself, and dont have ptw (yet?) - but when I want a challenge I try to keep in mind what people at cfc have said about strenghts and weaknesses of the civs...

    just my 2 paalians worth

    EDIT: by writing explorers I do mean scouts. The explorer is best used to mess up the ai - pillage, blockade and such - as it comes at an age where you know most of the map/all the map anyway ;)
     
  14. JonathanValjean

    JonathanValjean Porschephile

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    Charlottesville, VA, USA
    I went with the English. Their UU is nearly useless, and their trait combination isn't anything to write home about.
     
  15. Beanzy

    Beanzy Prince

    Joined:
    Dec 31, 2002
    Messages:
    329
    Out of those choices... England, without a doubt. Horrible UU, and mediocre traits (Personally, I often do value the Expansionistic and Commercial traits highly, but only when one is couple with Industrious/Relgious. Alone, I feel they are not that great, but when used in conjunction with the almighty Industrious trait, they can be pretty good.)
     
  16. SinisterDeath

    SinisterDeath Pure Quality

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    Mar 26, 2003
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    408
    Location:
    London, Ontario
    Well, I tried the English, and I must say, that while I had a big bank roll, at the end of the game, due to the commercial trait..I didn't care for them. Paliklas was spot on. However I still think all around, that both the Americans, and the English are very weak. I also don't care for scouts because even if I pop out 3 angry barbs, my warrior can usually take care of them. And this is playing on regent.
     
  17. MacPhisto

    MacPhisto Chieftain

    Joined:
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    Location:
    Columbus, Ohio
    It all depends on context.

    If you're playing a small map with lots of islands, the English or the Americans would be very very weak. Play the Aztecs on a Tiny map, and with those Jags (I have the right Civ, right?) you'd wipe everyone out in two seconds.

    I played a game on Huge Pangea with the Americans, I litterly goody-hutted my entire way through the ancient age and well into the middle ages. It was uber-fast! I think I researched 1, maybe 2 techs on my own. Plus, I had more modern wars... so the F15 was fairly handy in dealing with enemy airforces (plus the extra bombing was nice). Not as bad as the Man-O-War I suspect... but we shall see.

    I've yet to try the English, it sounds like it would be a rough go. :) But, yah might get lucky.
     
  18. Doc Tsiolkovski

    Doc Tsiolkovski Deity

    Joined:
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    Köln, Cologne, Colonia. Finally.
    Koreans, no doubt.
    Their trait combo is nothing but a duplication from the Greeks, and who would argue which UU is better :rolleyes: ? Second last would be Mongols; out of the vanilla Civs, I think Russia has the worst combo (though the UU is mediocre, not crappy, and in OCC, they are top).
    EXP + SCI simply doesn't work together, what's the use in finding techs, when you already can research faster?

    All other Civs have different trait combinations, or at least different UU in terms of era.

    If you don't look at the UU, then some combinations you'd never tried otherwise can be really good; I learned that in DyP, where they managed to fix nearly all the crappy UUs, so you'll not deterred from playing Americans. They are really good, despite I never used their Modern Age UU. So, basically, every combo can be interesting, so try them all!
    I just see no reason why I should play with a Civ with a crappy UU who's traits are already used by another Civ with Hoplites.
     
  19. budweiser

    budweiser King of the Beers

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    I am playing a standard, continent, Monarch game with England right now. My enemies were Celts, Scandanavia, Spain, Babylon, Persia, Ottomans, and Zulu. I started on my own island.

    As of last night the game became a foregone conclusion. I will win. I have always been number one on the history graph. Its 1455 or so I just got tanks, everyone else who is still alive is stuck on inf and is 2 or 3 techs behind me. I have 100 units in my army and I am running a 300 gpt surplus. I just built Hoover and I have a lock on every other wonder from here on out. The only bad thing about england I will say, is that I did not get any use from the UU. Other than that they are fine. You just need to know how to work any civ and you can win.

    All through Civ I, and Civ II, England was my favorite, its nice to know that they can still get it done in Civ III.
     
  20. Evincar

    Evincar Iron works is a legend!!

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    Location:
    Guadalajara, Spain
    English: Quite bad traits (actually the worst combo IMO) and incredibly pesim UU

    Americans: Bad traits too, and another obscenely bad UU

    How could it be worse??
     

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