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Worst civilization

Discussion in 'Civ4 - General Discussions' started by Fuzzz, Mar 21, 2007.

  1. Fuzzz

    Fuzzz you

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    There's already a thread for the best civilization but what's in your opinion the worst civilization?
     
  2. DigitalBoy

    DigitalBoy Emperor

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    Arabia, but only in Warlords. Vanilla, they're alright.
     
  3. bonafide11

    bonafide11 Worker

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    I might have to say America just because their unit and building are so late that they will almost never make a difference... But Washington's traits have great synergy, and the happiness and health bonuses will make an early impact and will help your cities grow bigger... I've noticed that the AI seems to do a pretty good job with Washington, on the higher difficulties at least (emperor and immortal).

    Otherwise, maybe the Celts, because both their building and unit are directed toward the hills bonus, which is an interesting idea, but really not practical at all. Especially since the building obsoletes with gunpowder (or is it rifling? either way...), which is when the building could actually maybe begin to make much of a difference... But Brennus' traits (charismatic and spiritual) are both good traits though...
     
  4. bonafide11

    bonafide11 Worker

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    I gotta disagree with this though, I think Arabia has a pretty good building and a pretty good unit, and spiritual is great, protective isn't that great, but spiritual + protective are pretty good for cultural victories, especially with the madrassa

     
  5. Horizons

    Horizons Needing fed again!

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    I would say the Aztecs. I only ever played with them once.
     
  6. GoodSarmatian

    GoodSarmatian Jokerfied Western Male

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    I almost never play the Aztecs, but this is because I rely so much on Swordmen in my early wars and I can never remember the city names.
    The UB istn't so good either. It is a bit cheaper than a normal courthouse, but apart from that it's not near as useful as other UBs.
     
  7. DigitalBoy

    DigitalBoy Emperor

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    The madrassa is good, but it would have been amazing with Saladin's old traits. I drool at the thought of a spiritual civ being able to crank out great prophets at their leisure.

    I have mixed feelings about the spiritual trait. It's alright, but if I have a spiritual leader, his/her other trait really has to stand out to keep my interest. Hense, Spiritual + Protective fails my checklist miserably.
     
  8. Fuzzz

    Fuzzz you

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    Germany > late UU, not so very good UB in my opinion)
    the Celts > a UU used for attacking with a defensive promotion and a UB that gives the same promotion to units built in the city...)
    America > Again, late UU, the latest in the game
    Egypt > probably because they owned so much in civ III:d
     
  9. bonafide11

    bonafide11 Worker

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    Are you kidding me? I think the sacrificial alter is my favorite UB. You can whip the hell out of your cities and crank out a ton of units without making the city too unhappy... I love the aztecs, one of my favorite civs. But I am a big fan of the spiritual trait, and aggressive of course.
     
  10. axident

    axident Emperor

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    Celts. UB and UU are among the worst in the game, if not the worst. Charismatic is okay, Spiritual can have its uses, especially with the Mysticism starting tech. But Hunting is crap as a starting tech unless you really feel like spearmen or something, but I would rather have mining, wheel, or agriculture. Hell I might even take fishing over hunting in certain cases.
     
  11. GoodSarmatian

    GoodSarmatian Jokerfied Western Male

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    The Altar is completely useless when you have anotehr labour civic, but this is not such a big problem with Spiritual, but the other downside is that it keeps your cities too small.
    I hate to whip in cities with higher population because it takes too long to replace those slaves.
     
  12. Rycheman

    Rycheman Warlord

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    Celts get my vote. As already pointed out,weak UU and UB, poor starting techs[although Myst ok for early religion].Brennus' traits are his only saving grace.
     
  13. Rusty Edge

    Rusty Edge Deity

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    Yeah, and a UB that goes obsolete.

    Germany & America have UUs &UBs that arrive late in the game.
    Washington & Freddy are excellent leaders, though.

    P.S. Brennus is still the leader in my Hall of Fame. I don't recall the game, guess it was a Celtic warrior rush.
     
  14. Rusty Edge

    Rusty Edge Deity

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    I like hunting for scouts ( the earlier you have a scout, the more useful it is), & isn't hunting a qualifier for archery?
     
  15. Jerrymander

    Jerrymander Epistemologist

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    The Celts are very weak.
    As is Arabia. It was weak in Vanilla, too.

    Personally, I think they nerfed Washington in Warlords. He was legions better in Vanilla, to the point of being nearly broken.
     
  16. Sparta

    Sparta Emperor

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    No offense, but how many of you guys saying the Celts have actually played the Celts? :mischief: (Don't get me wrong - I balked at the UU/UB combo at first as well.)

    Their UU and UB are certainly nothing to write home about, but the trait combination is one of the very best in the game, IMHO, and traits are permanent. Try playing them sometime in a war-heavy, civics-micromanaging style and you will see their true power. :king:

    [Think about it this way - you can cycle into and out of Vassalage and Theocracy in five-turn windows whenever you want, so with a bit of effort toward timing, you can produce (mostly) queued-up +4 XP units all game long with a bit of micromanagement. With Barracks and Stables, and the Charismatic trait yielding three-promo units at a measly 8 XP, this is amazingly powerful, IMO. Furthermore, the Spiritual trait gives the Celts the ability to adapt to any type of situation at any given point in the game. I highly recommend trying them as a civ, if you have the patience for some micromanagement.]

    P.S. Rusty Edge - Brennus should be the leader in everyone's Hall of Fames. ;) (And btw, FWIW, by the time the Dun goes obsolete you should probably already have the game close to in hand anyway IMHO, or at the very least not need a whole lot more Guerrilla troops added to your already massive numbers of them anyway.)
     
  17. ^alon^

    ^alon^ Chieftain

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    well....i guess that india....
    i dont care much for the worker uu ....

    i am more of a warmongrer!
    viva la battle!
     
  18. axident

    axident Emperor

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    Okay I like having a scout too, but if I'm going to have hunting for one tech, the other one better be useful for early growth, like mining or agriculture.

    Archery sucks, I never research that dead end tech and hate it when I pop it out of a hut instead of something more useful. I'd rather take GOLD than archery out of a hut. Reason: I go straight for offense/active defense. I'm not going to sit in my cities while my stuff is getting pillaged, or sit in my cities when there is a neighbor waiting to be conquered by my early axemen.

    I also almost never research HBR as it is a dead-end tech, though I sometimes consider it if it leads to my UU.

    P.S. To those Fast Worker doubters, are you KIDDING me? You START the game with your UU, and it lasts for the WHOLE GAME, and since it can move and work even a hill or forest or jungle tile on the same turn (not to mention dash from one city to faraway one in one turn with roads or railroads), the net effect is that you spend a lot fewer turns moving workers = more turns working the land with the workers = you have to build/capture fewer workers = your cities continue growing and you can use the hammers you save on something else.
     
  19. bassist2119

    bassist2119 Warlord

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    As per Sparta's advice, don't knock it until you've tried it. I just played Frederick, pre-patch mind you, and the assembly plants kick butt even though they come a little late. Assembly line is the most powerful advanced tech you can get while holding off SciMeth, and I recommend doing so. The double speed w/ coal (which you have by this point) is incredible on such a powerful building, I had these improved factories up in two turns in my top 5 production cities, three turns later, they were powered. As both German leaders have traits that favor SE, the assembly plant's practically limitless engineer capability also proved huge.
    As I mentioned in another post, the time that you get a UB is almost as important as what it does. The assembly plant, though, makes for MASSIVE late mid-game boost and fits great with both leaders.

    Regarding the OP, I never developed a taste for Egypt - a UB that obsoletes that early urks me, the UU is alright, but there are much better, especially considering that the Persians is much better and replaces the same unit.

    Regarding the constant attack of the Celts, I was surprised to find that while walls don't actually obsolete (they just don't apply to gunpowder units), Duns actually do obsolete - that kinda stinks. Nonetheless, by the time they do expire, you've got quite a few military units with a free promotion with a charismatic leader - that's not too shabby.
     
  20. bassist2119

    bassist2119 Warlord

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    Gotta disagree. Completely. Hunting means you start with a scout, which I've found on average means you'll hit double the number of huts and get better stuff from them, especially since the AI seems to know where every hut on the map is. Even though it's got the lowest (I think) beaker total, the scout makes up for it... tenfold.
     

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