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Worst Leaders of 2012 - Extras

Discussion in 'Strategy Forum' started by Thalassicus, Dec 21, 2012.

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Worst Leaders

Poll closed Jan 20, 2013.
  1. Harald - Vikings

    4 vote(s)
    21.1%
  2. Attilla - Huns

    6 vote(s)
    31.6%
  3. Boudica - Celts

    5 vote(s)
    26.3%
  4. Dido - Carthage

    4 vote(s)
    21.1%
  5. Gustavus - Sweden

    13 vote(s)
    68.4%
  6. Haile - Ethiopia

    6 vote(s)
    31.6%
  7. Isabella - Spain

    8 vote(s)
    42.1%
  8. Kamehameha - Polynesia

    4 vote(s)
    21.1%
  9. Maria - Austria

    3 vote(s)
    15.8%
  10. Nebuchadnezzar - Babylon

    0 vote(s)
    0.0%
  11. Pacal - Mayans

    1 vote(s)
    5.3%
  12. Pachacuti - Incas

    0 vote(s)
    0.0%
  13. Sejong - Korea

    0 vote(s)
    0.0%
  14. Theodora - Byzantium

    7 vote(s)
    36.8%
  15. William - Netherlands

    9 vote(s)
    47.4%
  16. I do not have any paid extras

    0 vote(s)
    0.0%
Multiple votes are allowed.
  1. Thalassicus

    Thalassicus Bytes and Nibblers

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    Which leaders should I focus on improving?

    Set aside your overall preferences like war or peace, tall or wide. Vote for a leader like Ramhkamhaeng if you think he is not fun for games allying with citystates, compared to other leaders with citystate bonuses. :)

    Vote for as many as you want, then click here to vote for leaders who do not need paid extras.
     
  2. jacktannery

    jacktannery Prince

    Joined:
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    Messages:
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    Location:
    Dublin
    Attilla - Huns This is my favourite civ in Vanilla, but in some versions of GEM I tried playing them and the battering ram was heavily nerfed. The whole point of Atilla is conquering a few cities at the very very early part of the game, and if it takes five battering ra\ms and three archers and a swordsman to conquer a city (which it does) then there is no point in playing Atilla. I want to be able to conquer two cities at the start of the game with two battering rams and a warrior.
    Boudica - Celts Their UB comes very late, so I never see it. Their UA is a bit dull. Its quite a passive civ, that does not encourage me to do anything different than I usually do.
    Kamehameha - Polynesia Everybody loves Polynesia except me. I don't like seeing the entire map too early because it ruins the mystery of the game for me, so I hate their UA.
    Theodora - Byzantium I tried doing things with her boat UU at the start of the game, but it just isn't powerful or supported enough to achieve anything at that point in the game. Her UA is deeply uninteresting to me.
     
  3. Thalassicus

    Thalassicus Bytes and Nibblers

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    Gem buffs battering rams with +25% defense, and the other strength/cost/ability numbers should be unchanged in comparison to the unit it replaces. Any reductions in its stats are not intended. Which of its numbers look incorrect?
     
  4. jacktannery

    jacktannery Prince

    Joined:
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    Messages:
    446
    Location:
    Dublin
    I never look at the numbers. The FEEL of the unit has changed, presumably with the extra hp on cities and/or the improvements to walls to make the AI build them early and/or the improved city bombard ability. I love all these GEM changes individually but when I first tried the Huns with GEM they were nowhere near as good as they are in vanilla.

    I wrote about it here http://forums.civfanatics.com/showpost.php?p=11843976&postcount=160 (land armies, post 160) in september and we discussed it in the next few posts.
     
  5. mystikx21

    mystikx21 Deity

    Joined:
    Feb 18, 2006
    Messages:
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    Location:
    ohio
    I'd agree the Celts UB should be changed.

    I don't think the Huns' rams debate resolved in any way, but I remembered having it. I've been experimenting with slightly lower HP bonuses and slightly higher defence bonuses on wall-buildings to see if that helps. Hard to tell.

    I like Polynesia. ;)

    Byzantium and Carthage could use some minor tweaks, but I think the Byzantine UA is better now that the beliefs are improved.

    Dutch, Swedes, Ethiopia have a lot of either weak UAs or no useful synergies that leave each with a lack of civ feel.

    Spain's UA sounded better in the other thread than the natural wonders one, which was unique but pretty weak.
     
  6. Thalassicus

    Thalassicus Bytes and Nibblers

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    Oh, I see now! A good night's rest helps. :crazyeye:

    I reduced the ease for all players to perform ancient rushes two years ago in Vem. It was an I-win situation for most human players at the time. This was a nerf to everyone, not the Huns specifically, since they were not around yet. I intend the Huns as one of the few civs capable of an ancient era rush. I just haven't had time to balance the new G&K leaders properly yet. This is my plan for the upcoming weeks, hence the poll. :)
     
  7. mitsho

    mitsho Deity

    Joined:
    Nov 3, 2003
    Messages:
    7,355
    Location:
    Europe, more or less
    I agree.

    I agree as well. ;)

    But that did still include the natural wonders as that was: Double Rewards from conquering City States and Double Yields on Natural Wonders.

    And I like later uniques in general, even if the gameplay effect of the Celtic one seems minor/passive/boring.
     
  8. mystikx21

    mystikx21 Deity

    Joined:
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    ohio
    I think we could find somewhere else to park a late opera house (French Salon UB, etc?). I don't object to its existence as a late unique so much as that it has little connection to the Celts that makes much sense.

    I don't mind if Spain has an exploration/conquerer feel. I do think the exploration UA was pretty weak on its own.
     

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