Your Input Wanted - TR Yields bonus for a new Custom Civ

[pineappledan]

I need help determining what would be a "fair" amount of yields to give to a new custom civ who has bonuses to Trade Routes: The Tlingit

Tlingit UA:

• +XX% / from International Trade Routes
• Destination cities for internal Trade Routes receive +Y Food and +Z Production for every Fishing boat and Noow (The Tlingit's UI) within range of the Origin city

Right now the civ is set at:

• +50% to International TRs
• +50% to International TRs
  
• +2 for every Fishing Boat in the Origin City
• +2 for every Noow in the Origin City

All of these yields are Given to the city directly, which means they contribute to Needs and are subject to modifiers from buildings/policies/GAs, etc.

Noows have the same build limitations as Portuguese Feitoria (Coast, no adjacent), but are unlocked in the Classical

I don't really play Portugal or Ottoman, the only other civs with bonuses to TRs, but their bonuses seem much more substantial than this, especially when scaling with era is considered. However, I'm not sure what numbers would be fair, especially for the International TR bonus. Given that Tlingit bonuses are constant city yields, rather than instant yields, they can stand to be a bit weaker,

For Internal TRs, I have found that the UA makes you focus on sending TRs from the city with the most sea resources in your empire. This usually end up being 3-4 in a city. You can pretty consistently get 4 Noow on a single city, +/- 1. So that ends up being 6-8 and 6-10 every turn on Internal TRs. These are final numbers, once the city has fully expanded its borders, however.

I would appreciate some input from players on what numbers sound competitive for these two mechanics.

 

[HungryForFood]

Since science and culture from international trade routes with a major civ is only significant when you are behind in tech and policies, there is probably not a big balance concern there. Instead, you should be focusing on the science and culture when trading with a city state ally. This is probably the limiting factor when balancing, and I'd say 50% sounds fair.

For food and production, I think there has been discussion on the weakness of internal TRs in VP, so best wait and see if it results in a balance change from G. But I'd say the amount you estimate is fairly high for Classical, and tapers off to being negligible in late game. I personally almost never use internal TRs, so my guess might be off.

 

[documental]

The science/culture modifier will bring the values back to what it was pre-nerf (With it being a little lower for culture, as that was reduced more then science).

This doesn't look like it'll require a terrible amount of space for the UA description, so the internal trade routes could use a scalar I think. +1 in Renaissance/Modern. That said I agree with HungryForFood, it may be too potent early on and I worry, despite my ridiculous suggestion, about being able to funnel all that production into a single city.

 

[pineappledan]

For food and production, I think there has been discussion on the weakness of internal TRs in VP, so best wait and see if it results in a balance change from G. But I'd say the amount you estimate is fairly high for Classical, and tapers off to being negligible in late game. I personally almost never use internal TRs, so my guess might be off.

This doesn't look like it'll require a terrible amount of space for the UA description, so the internal trade routes could use a scalar I think. +1 in Renaissance/Modern. That said I agree with HungryForFood, it may be too potent early on and I worry, despite my ridiculous suggestion, about being able to funnel all that production into a single city.

The UI comes in late Classical, and it takes a while to get them up across the empire. By the time I have my network of Noows up, it's Medieval already.

adding scaling to the per Noow/Fish will require a lot of computing, but it's possible...
Alternatively, I had thought about adding some sort of scaling tourism modifier as a late game perk instead