YOU'RE FIRED!

[Berzerker]

That was Donald Trump's advice for owners of NFL teams regarding politically discontent players - fire the 'SOBS' who disrespect the flag and anthem. Bending the knee has taken on a different meaning, it isn't a sign of subservience as in Game of Thrones, its a refusal to honor symbols representing the country...

Now I dont believe the flag and anthem represent our sins - to me they represent ideals I associate with freedom - so I have no desire to 'disrespect' them. But I dont get upset when others do because symbols are open to interpretation - if I believe the flag is stained with past or current injustices my desire is not disrespect but removing the stains.

We wont have free speech if politicians can tell us who needs to be fired for expressing views based on a different interpretation. On the other hand Trump enjoys the right to speak too, so why cant he express his disgust? Well, he cant... Not in this case, not the way he did. He's the top cop in the country charged with enforcing the laws and free speech requires the absence of coercion or constraint, he cant be the source of the coercion.

Now maybe if Trump had given owners friendly advice they risk attendance by allowing player protests he'd avoid becoming a source, but he shouldn't even be getting involved. Just enforce the laws, dont tell us who needs to be fired. That aint yer job.

Instead Trump creates a coercive environment when he tells people who they should fire for speaking their minds. The people receiving his 'advice' understand refusing it comes with a risk - in much the same way school children refusing to recite the Pledge of Allegiance understand upsetting the powers that be might lead to retaliation.

http://www.cnn.com/2017/09/22/politics/donald-trump-alabama-nfl/index.html

I think the issue has become moot, after yesterday's unification of the NFL players with owners and coaches there are far too many people 'in need' of being fired. You see, Trump aint a team player - he doesn't understand being part of a team.

"I don't get all choked up about yellow ribbons and American flags. I consider them to be symbols and I leave symbols to the symbol minded. " - George Carlin

"President should not be telling the Washington Redskins to change their name - our country has far bigger problems! FOCUS on them, not nonsense." - Donald Trump, Oct 2013

 

[civver_764]

I would take this seriously if I didn't see the same people whining about this cheering on the fact that people lost their jobs for attending the Charlottesville rally.

Also I'm not sure what "risk" there is. As far as I'm aware Trump doesn't have any control over the NFL.

 

[TheMeInTeam]

The anthem thing has way too much weight/attention assigned to it by basically everybody. ESPN reports on it with a front-page blurb more consistently than injuries to non-star players...kind of turns the original issue into a background consideration as the foreground is an epeening farce. I guess people couldn't resist.

Trump and Google seem to be on different sides of the same "wrong think" coin. Can't say I respect it no matter who does it.

 

[JollyRoger]

Trump failed twice at getting a NFL franchise. He was the reason the USFL went down like a Clinton intern.

 

[Perfection]

Also I'm not sure what "risk" there is. As far as I'm aware Trump doesn't have any control over the NFL.

He's the president of the United States of America. A position that wields a wide variety of far reaching powers that can impact the NFL.

 

[Mechanicalsalvation]

I think its fine and even expectable from Trump to address this issue. He isnt only a commander in chief but in a way a speaker and issue presenter/manager in chief.
This problem is of a general behavioural code character and it deserves the attention for even while it may not be acute it set the psychological frame on what field the large and more important battles are going to be fought. Its good sign imo that Trump isnt ignoring the issue.

 

[civver_764]

He's the president of the United States of America. A position that wields a wide variety of far reaching powers that can impact the NFL.

He's not threatening to use his presidential powers against the NFL though, just offering his opinion.

 

[Broken_Erika]

He just thought it would sound good at the Alabama rally. Plus he needed a distraction from the "Health Care" bill train-wreck in the senate.

 

[Mechanicalsalvation]

He just thought it would sound good at the Alabama rally. Plus he needed a distraction from the "Health Care" bill train-wreck in the senate.

Just like he just thought it would sound good to be potus Trump? An accidental genius I suppose...

 

[TheMeInTeam]

Trump failed twice at getting a NFL franchise. He was the reason the USFL went down like a Clinton intern.

Oh I don't know. NFL alternatives have consistently sunk like stones in the US, no matter how amusing it was to see "he hate me" on the back of Rod Smart's jersey.

 

[stinkubus]

I would take this seriously if I didn't see the same people whining about this cheering on the fact that people lost their jobs for attending the Charlottesville rally.

Also I'm not sure what "risk" there is. As far as I'm aware Trump doesn't have any control over the NFL.

Employment in the US, for almost everyone, is at will. It is at the discretion of the employer. If an employer decides to fire someone who was caught on video beating another man with a lead pipe at the rally in Charlottesville that's their prerogative, just as it would be an NFL team's prerogative to cut a player for protesting during the anthem. They simply haven't chosen to do so.

 

[Oerdin]

I just won't give the NFL any of my money and I am happy the citizens of my city said no to NFL blackmail and sent the Chargers packing. Thanks but we can use that $1.5 billion for better things.

 

[JollyRoger]

Oh I don't know. NFL alternatives have consistently sunk like stones in the US, no matter how amusing it was to see "he hate me" on the back of Rod Smart's jersey.

The AFL made it and the USFL would have if Trump hadn't bullied the league into moving to a Fall schedule.

 

[TheMeInTeam]

The AFL made it and the USFL would have if Trump hadn't bullied the league into moving to a Fall schedule.

NFL vs AFL wasn't the same situation as XFL/USFL vs NFL. I agree putting it in fall was nonsense, but I'm not so confident that a spring league would suddenly succeed.

 

[Zelig]

I would take this seriously if I didn't see the same people whining about this cheering on the fact that people lost their jobs for attending the Charlottesville rally.

Ah yes, the cognitive dissonance that people face by being against Nazism.

 

[Perfection]

He's not threatening to use his presidential powers against the NFL though, just offering his opinion.

If an NFL team decided to fire players, there would likely be legal recourse involving the US Department of Labor which falls under Trump's purview. When Trump states his opinion he is not being clear if that's just his BS opinion or if that's official executive branch policy regarding a potential legal situation in which they will be constitutionally obligated to weigh in on. Leaving it ambiguous is unacceptable.

When you're the President, you should watch your damn mouth.

 

[El_Machinae]

“People that are taking a knee are not saying anything negative about the military, they’re not saying anything negative about the flag, they’re just trying to protest that there are some injustices in America,” Villanueva said.

...

Villanueva, a graduate from West Point, served three tours in Afghanistan and became an Army Ranger before joining the NFL in 2014, according to the Philadelphia Eagles, who first drafted him.

Interesting that a three tour vet can more easily articulate the underlying issue than Trump. Trump is selling something, and he assumes that his base wants what he's selling.

 

[Mechanicalsalvation]

If an NFL team decided to fire players, there would likely be legal recourse involving the US Department of Labor which falls under Trump's purview. When Trump states his opinion he is not being clear if that's just his BS opinion or if that's official executive branch policy regarding a potential legal situation in which they will be constitutionally obligated to weigh in on. Leaving it ambiguous is unacceptable.

When you're the President, you should watch your damn mouth.

That sounds to me like BS. Being a potus doesnt mean you are just a piece in bureaucratic machinery without right for your opinion even though I understand thats were you like to have the present president.

 

[stinkubus]

NFL contracts are typically structured in such a way that players can be cut (read: fired) at any time with the team only owing them a fraction of their promised salary. Teams won't begin cutting players en masse because they would cripple their future to field competitive rosters in the future because cut players' pay still counts against the NFL salary cap. I cannot forsee how the US Dept of Labor would be involved. NFL players are unionized, and in America your union contract supersedes federal labor laws.

 

[Patine]

Unlike many nations, the U.S. Constitution does not state, protect, honour, or even acknowledge a flag, national anthem, motto, national animal or other such symbols, or state or imply that such symbolry are Constitutionally needed or desired. Thus, the U.S. has among the least ground among nations to stand on to forcibly protect these symbols and persecute any who they view as disrecting them, from the point of view of the "sacred document of governance," the U.S. Constitution.