Unique Buildings Elimination Thread

[theis81]

The final three are very interesting to me. They are UB equivalents of the Monument, Shrine, and Library, which are generally the first three buildings in my capital and other early cities. For a comparison, I decided to see how they stack up not by comparing them to each other, but comparing them assuming that you build all three standard buildings. For the comparison I will assume an early population of about 6 (for the purposes of the library assigning 3 at a ratio of 1/2). I generally have all three buildings up by turn 30 or earlier.

For any other civ (without UB), the total would be: 2 , 1 , and 3 at an upkeep cost of 3 .

For the Ethiopians (with a Stele replacing the Monument): 2 , 3 , and 3 at an upkeep cost of 3 .

For the Mayans (with a Pyramid replacing the Shrine): 2 , 1 , and 5 at an upkeep cost of 3 .

For the Chinese (with the Papermaker replacing the Library): 2 , 1 , and 3 with no upkeep cost. The extra from the Papermaker essentially pays the upkeep for the other buildings.

To simplify this a bit more, the trade off is 2 , 2 , or 3 .

Based on this, I would vote to the timeless classic, the Papermaker. An engine for your early research and economy available at Writing. It is a tough call, because the extra 2 available early from the Pyramid may have a big impact as well. The early Pantheon and Religion from having the Stele can also be nice. Really tough with three very good buildings.

Nice and interesting way to compare the 3. But you are making a mistake since the pyramid is +2 faith. So the tradeoff is 2 , 2 and 1 , or 3 . Considering that and the fact that sci / gold tradeoff imo is more than 1:1, I would prefer the pyramid. I think paper maker and steele is pretty even, but in the long run I would prefer the extra gold, since faith loses value.

Paper Maker 6
Pyramid 52 (+1)
Stele 16 (-3)

 

[Mesix]

Sure enough...I missed that extra for the Pyramid. Curious being that Maya is the only civ of the 3 that I have played in the past 2 weeks .

 

[Arilian]

Paper Maker 3 (-3)
Pyramid 52
Stele 17 (+1)

Stele = early panheon in deity. In desert start, it gives you a religion, with the desert folklore pantheon.
I am totally unimpressed with PM. I think it is not in the top 10.

 

[maurcus]

Paper Maker 0 (-3) goodbye papermaker you were good just not that good
Pyramid 52
Stele 18 (+1) never lost the first religion with this

 

[Lordleoz]

Pyramid 53 Such early science bonus is significant.
Stele 15 good UB, but worse than pyramid.

 

[Mesix]

...and then there were 2!

 

[Rooftrellen]

Pyramid 54 (+1)
Stele 12 (-3)

Pyramid always feels...meh after the first little bit.

However, it gives +2 science in exchange for -1 faith (bonuses) compared to the Stele, so in a direct comparison, it gets the nod.

 

[Algeroth]

Pyramid 55
Stele 9

There was only one, it was evident from the start that pyramids are going to win.

 

[Carl5872]

Pyramid 53 (-2)
Stele 10 (+1)

I honestly think that the science gained early on isn't quite as helpful as the culture from the Stele. Also with legalism, you dont have to build the stele. So yes friends, I'm going down with the ship on this one.

 

[jacksone7]

Pyramid 52
Stele 10

(-3/+1)

 

[Rooftrellen]

So yes friends, I'm going down with the ship on this one.

Take pride, friend.

I went down with the ceilidh hall and then paper maker; there's nothing at all wrong with fighting the power and taking it to the man!

Even if it means just one little vote.

 

[theguy8882]

Pyramid 53
Stele 7

I'll take faith and science over faith and culture any day

 

[Dogmouth]

I'm glad to see that the Stele survived. Mesix's analysis is a good one, but it leaves out a few non-quantitative factors that are pretty important and weigh in favor of the Stele against the PM: (1) the Stele requires no tech whatsoever; (2) the Stele is the only one of these three buildings that you can obtain for free early in the game with a social policy. When I play Ethiopia, I usually go tradition and hard build a worker instead of a Stele. I then get a free Stele and my choice of pantheons (by this time one pantheon may already be gone, but it's no big deal). The next three Stele's in my other cities are also free and come online immediately (unlike the PM and Pyramid). With four cities, you get 8 maintenence free faith per turn without investing a single hammer. That's pretty darn good.

Edit: In the world of faith, every early point counts, so I consider instant faith from new cities to be rather unappreciated. It's going to take you 20 or so turns to get your pyramids or papermaker online in a new city. By that point, I'm already 40 faith ahead of you with a Stele.

 

[Dogmouth]

Pyramid 54 (+1)
Stele 4 (-3)
Despite my ravings about the Stele, I do recognize that Pyramids are better. Extra science and faith after pottery? You can't beat that.

 

[Mesix]

Another thing the Stele has going for it is that building a Shrine in the early game becomes somewhat unnecessary. If you are already getting 2 and 2 from your Stele, why waste time (and pay maintenance) on a Shrine which will only give you 1 additional . This is especially true if you use Legalism and can count on having the Stele for free in each of the first 4 cities you found.

 

[Gucumatz]

Mesix your comparison does mean they have to reach 6 population first. And that does take a while for the Papermaker to catch up to the other 2 benefits. And faith still has its kick earlier on than gold making faith points that come earlier useful than additional gold points and the same with science. The Paper maker is tied to pop to try and even the balance - which the other 2 can do ahead of the Paper Maker

 

[crawf0rd]

Pyramid 55 (+1)
Stele 1 (-3)

As much as I hate going with the flow, I couldn't find enough reason to downvote the Pyramid. The Stele's synergy with it's UA isn't just zero, its negative. The UA suggests a small empire, but the Stele suggests a wide empire. Too contradicting. The pyramid on the other hand, is a free 4 pop library. And you can still get a library. And (like the stele) you are guaranteed a religion at least up to immortal. I think we can safely declare the Pyramid the winner.

 

[kamikazees]

Pyramid 56
Stele 0

Winner by a landslide. But did you have any doubt? Early faith/science trumps early faith/culture, even if you can get Steles for free.

 

[Gucumatz]

Pyramid 56 (+1)
Stele 0 (-3)
And the half Kaqchikel finishes it!

Was waiting for someone to vote down the Stele so I could finish it off for my pyramids. I am normally a tall player - and don't consider my ICSing optimal yet - but the joy of seeing the graphics in various cities I recognize (and well its power as also established in other posts) is enough to draw me out of my traditional style.

 

[Gucumatz]

Noes Kamikaze had to ruin it