Training game emphasizing trading - Emperor

[Jurimax]

Being seafaring, we can get a lot of contacts early on, before the other civs know each other, we can get a tech from one civ and trade it around. This way they'll have to trade thru us.

 

[Bede]

I would pick Carthage or Netherlands if you want to take a more peaceful route to superiority.

Scandanavia would be my choice for "pointy-stick" research in the Middle Ages.

The English are the killer in this variant. See Jumpmasters1A for a demonstration. Made it all the way to AlphaC on no research and ended the game with over 50 grand in the bank. Not without some serious warfare on the way.

Since we have many new SG players in this game I am going to post TedJackson's excellent guide:

General SG Etiquette Guidelines
Please do:
Let the team know if you're going to be unable to play for an extended period - holiday, illness, exams etc.
Post a "Got it" notice or ask for a skip within 24 hours of the save becoming available (I reserve the right to skip a player who hasn't responded after the 24 hour grace period is over).
Play and post within 48 hours of posting a "Got it".
Zip up your save file before posting.
Write up a log of the events occurring during your turn and post it along with your save.
Provide notes for the next player as to the current situation and any immediate plans for the future - are those Caravels heading NE or SW? is that Swordsman fortified to heal or act as a lookout? Our forces are mustering for an attack on...
Feel free to pause and ask for advice, or simply discuss, if a situation arisies in the game and you're unsure of the best course of action.

Please do not:
Automate Workers.
Use City Governors unless the team has discussed and agreed their use.
Leave units on goto orders that will extend beyond your turn.
Make deals on your last turn. However, you should notify the next player if trading opportunities exist.
Make wholesale changes to build orders on the inherited turn without consulting the team.


General Gameplay Notes
Reputation: we will need to protect our reputation very carefully in the early part of the game. Losing the ability to make GPT deals early on would make the game much harder.

Brokering: for those unfamiliar with the term it's just a shorthand for acting as "middleman" in deals - e.g. buying a tech from Civ A then selling it on to Civs B, D & E (hopefully picking up something else of value along the way). We'll need to be on the lookout for brokering opportunities at every turn so I suggest that we use CRPMapstat to monitor trade opportunities. This utility offers no information that cannot be gained by slogging through the Diplomatic screens every turn, it just presents the information quickly and simply.

Keeping the AI Isolated (from each other): again, this is an important factor that will help us to maintain our position as a broker. Even if we have to devote significant resources to keeping the AI isolated we will still benefit by controlling trade. Obviously this situation can only last until the end of the Middle Ages but it is well worth the effort!

Roads: we will need every gold piece we can lay our hands on in the early game so building roads has an even higher priority than normal. We really don't want our citizens working unroaded tiles.

Here is a link to the RBCiv rules regarding ethical and non-exploitative play:

Realms Beyond Civilization Banned Exploits

Any questions?

Looking forward to a fun and interesting game.

 

[dl123654]

Any opinions on water coverage for a Archipelago?

Also it might be better with no barbarians.

 

[Bede]

Barbarian camps are cheap barracks and busting them for provides a nice treasury boost. Also, if there are expansionist nations in the game "goody-huts" make the early tech pace go faster, and if we have more contacts, more opportunities.

May want to consider making all the other guys expansionist, if we don't go "Random" on opponents.

 

[oopsy poopsy]

I hadn't tried using any utilities yet, but I just downloaded that mapstat and I'm in love All the parts of the game that drive me nuts, 'cause I can't remember to do them every single turn, like making sure no one's about to become unhappy or checking for possible trades every turn which just gets downright annoying, is now taken care of (arent' run on sentences great ). I'm not a warmonger typically, but I'm trying to learn so Scandinavia sounds good. Also, it couldn't hurt since trikos is in the neighborhood. If we choose peaceful, I vote for carthage for the all purpose and early uu and so we build all those roads quicker that bede says we need.
I still can't get over the part in my head about wanting the other civs to get to techs quicker, just totally against my nature. I understand it and it's a good idea, it just goes against my instincts.

 

[plarq]

Sign me as the last trainee,will you Team?I'm thinking my trade experience is bad,once I had a standard,Arch 80% water Viking game,I was trapped by no money for tech brokering though I did fairly good in AA.

 

[oopsy poopsy]

I just want to check something. Are we playing with the aipatrol barbarian fix. I didn't put it in for cotm06 and don't know if we all have to play with it or not. It isn't a problem to put it in, but I wanted to make sure before I did and to make sure we're all on the same page. Is there a standard for succession games so if I play I'll know without having to ask?

 

[trikos]

Plarq, I have signed you in. Welcome on the team

This also mean we have a team

@trainers: are four players a good number for a training game?

 

[trikos]

@Bede: Thanks for posting the background information

@All: Please read the TedJackson General SG Etiquette Guideline if you haven't already. Since some of us are new to SG games I think it is appripriate to point to the guide if some of us should forget what is says.

I have read the first 4 pages of the Jumpmasters1A game. I think it is worth reading and I will read the rest today. I also have to got through the Realms Beyond Civilization Banned Exploits.

I have used CivAssist for my last game. I think it worked well. I will install MapStats and you both and find out what I like the best.

 

[trikos]

I just want to check something. Are we playing with the aipatrol barbarian fix. I didn't put it in for cotm06 and don't know if we all have to play with it or not. It isn't a problem to put it in, but I wanted to make sure before I did and to make sure we're all on the same page. Is there a standard for succession games so if I play I'll know without having to ask?

I thinks we should play with the barb fix and have smarter barbs. You can find the fix here.

 

[trikos]

I think we should we go for Carthage. As oopsy poopsy pointed out, the fast workers and an early defensive UU is nice. The Netherlands agriculture might not be that powerful if we end up on small islands (I am not totally sure about that).

I am not sure how much water we should have. I don't know how much a difference it makes for the game (besides that there will be more or less water). I suggest the average 70 percent.

I suggested the barbs to be roaming. Is that ok?

Should we go for expansionist or random opponents?

I thinks we have to settle on these four things (civ, water, barbs, and opponents) and them we can get started. I will let the game role three games we can choose from.

PS. sorry for posting for post in a row, I thought it was appropriate this time. Will not happen again

 

[plarq]

My 2 cents:
Random Opps (More Challenging if it ends up with lots SEA opps)
Archileago,70% or 80%
More barbarians,fix AINoPatrol=0
Climate random,I don't like fixed ones...also,I still suggest Scandinavia be the best one on current level IMO,fair traits,excellent and real "unique" berserk,along with pikes they are invincible.I love brokering and my first Deity is Vikings(After reading Sandman2003's three Viking game in Stories and Tales sub-forum).

 

[Bede]

Problem I have with the Vikes in this variant is they don't grow fast enough or work hard enough to earn the money needed to make the AA trading opportunities work. Food and cash are king at this stage.

I agree that in the MA they are the pre-eminent "broadaxe beakerheads".

Concur with Carthage. Random opponents are okay, as well as roaming barbs. As for other world settings average will work as well as anything else. You want to stay away from arid on Arch maps.

 

[oopsy poopsy]

carthage sounds great. I'll fix my barbs when I get home from work and I agree with bede about staying away from arid. 70% or 80% ocean doesn't matter to me. If we were going to preselect our opponents, then I'd say 80% and keep them from being seafaring, but that might be a little cheap. Age doesn't matter to me at all. I usually like older, but on an arch map, mountains could be a good thing production wise. The only other thing to worry about is order. I vote for trainer, trainee, trainee, trainer, trainee, trainee; but I don't mind going anywhere.

 

[Bede]

We won't need the Cathaginian UU on an arch map if we don't share the island. A handful of archers and horses with catapaults will do just fine for island defense.

A mountainous map (young world) could be a problem, though.

 

[oopsy poopsy]

I still like the idea of playing with carthage. If we're on an island with anyone else it'll help and if not it's an easy way to trigger a GA when you want. In terms of a younger world, at what point can coastal squares generate three food? We need to be able to grow and that won't happen until at least republic with harbors, right? If so an older world is probably better.

 

[dl123654]

The only other thing to worry about is order. I vote for trainer, trainee, trainee, trainer, trainee, trainee; but I don't mind going anywhere.

This would work, but I would add one change, all trainees (maybe the trainers too ) play the first 20 turns, we look at each game and decide which to continue.

 

[Rik Meleet]

More help needed ?
Trading is my middle name (actually it is John, but anyway) and I beat Emperor on a daily basis. I have a lot of experience on Deity and on SG's.
I am however not looking to play a SG, but I could be the "examinator". As soon as you do a trade; upload a save and I'll check if it is a good / average or bad trade. How does that sound ?

Just a thought; Prohibit the building or capturing of the Great Library; it ruins the trading-learning curve.

 

[trikos]

I think we are close to finalize the settings for the game.

Water: 70 percent
Rest of the climate will be set to average.

Opponents: random

Civ: carthage (or scandinavian)

@plarq: is it ok not to go for the vikings?

I guess we are ready for some starting positions. I will let the game role some starting position in a couple of hours and post them in this thread.

 

[trikos]

More help needed ?
Trading is my middle name (actually it is John, but anyway) and I beat Emperor on a daily basis. I have a lot of experience on Deity and on SG's.
I am however not looking to play a SG, but I could be the "examinator". As soon as you do a trade; upload a save and I'll check if it is a good / average or bad trade. How does that sound ?

That sounds like an offer that is hard to refuse I put you on as examinator.

I suggest that we save the game before trading and then play on, so the examination won't interrupt the playing too much.

Just a thought; Prohibit the building or capturing of the Great Library; it ruins the trading-learning curve.

You are probably right.

Please post if some of you disagree.