Big cities in relation to worked tiles and districts

[remconius]

I am very curious as to how tile management will work in relation to growth. Here are my thoughts:

Every city has 36 potential tiles to work just like Civ 5. But now these tiles have to be shared with districts and wonders. So looking at big cities: they would be your capital and some other, usually early, cities found on fertile terrain with lots of space. I can easily imagine these cities have 6+ districitcs; science, commercial, encampment, holy, entertainment, productio, etc. They might have a few wonders 2-3 and mountains 2-3.
That leaves only 20-24 tiles for farms and production. This could potentially support 15-20 population.

But then, what is next? Apparantly you replace farms by neighbourhoods. Do they provide food and more than farms? Or will it be a trade-off between lots of districs and wonders versus have a very big city in terms of population...

 

[UncleJJ]

Large cities in the late game will be fed by multiple internal trade routes bringing food and hammers. So farms and other tiles can be replaced by neighbourhoods since housing will be a major limitation.

 

[remconius]

Take this screenshot for example:


Washington is size 12 but only has 8 improved tiles and 4 districts. I really wonder how it can support it's self in terms of food.

For 12 people you normally need 24 food, excluding growth. I really dont see how it can support 12 people.

Lets do the maths:
Rice: 4?
Farm: 3?
2 oranges: 4? (2 each)
Horses: 2?
TOTAL: 13 food

Where is the other 11+ food coming from?
Granary 1?

 

[Paramecium]

Take this screenshot for example:
View attachment 456105

Washington is size 12 but only has 8 improved tiles and 4 districts. I really wonder how it can support it's self in terms of food.

For 12 people you normally need 24 food, excluding growth. I really dont see how it can support 12 people.

Lets do the maths:
Rice: 4?
Farm: 3?
2 oranges: 4? (2 each)
Horses: 2?
TOTAL: 13 food

Where is the other 11+ food coming from?
Granary 1?

Hm, I think unimproved Oranges give you 4 food and you forgot the sheeps, but Im not sure if sheeps give extra production or food. And consider, from the looks of the screenshot, every tile is on grassland providing 2 food at least ...
And Im not sure if the rice is on marsh, rice on marsh gives 4 food without farms and Im not sure if a farm on marsh rice replaces the marsh.

So lets make that list:
Rice: 2f from grassland, 1f from rice, 1f from farm, 1f from watermill: 5 food in total, if it is on marsh too, could even be 6 food.
Orange: 4 f each plus 1g for plantation: 8 (4+4) food from both oranges
Horses: 2 f from grassland, horses add production: 2 food
Farm: 2f form grassland, 1f from farm: 3 food total
Sheep: 2f from grassland, 1f or 1p from sheep, pastures give food or production?: At least 2 food, might be 3 or even 4.
the rest: only grassland, every tile gives 2 food.

Sum in worst case (only those tiles mentioned above): 5 + 4 + 4 + 3 + 2 + 2 = 20 food and only 6 citizen needed. So there are still 6 citizen who can work at least tiles with 2 food, summing up to a total of 12. Sum in total: 20 + 12 = 32 food production.

Seems legit ...

EDIT: Okay, just saw it, the rice by Washington is just on grassland and the rice by New York is on marsh and the farm doesnt remove it ... so rice on marshes is a heavy source of food income, coupled with water mills and later adjacent farms, it can be huge ...

 

[Lord Yanaek]

And don't forget 2 base for city and (if i recall correctly from streams) another 2 from granary so you have 2 free citizen before using tiles.
Also, not related to the screenshot but farms have adjacency bonuses so 4 farms in a rough diamond shape can give you lots of food.

 

[remconius]

Ok that makes sense. Tiles with high yields, just like Civ IV. And you are dependent on them to grow you city bigger then?

 

[Lord Yanaek]

Yes, but you can create them now (to a limit) thanks to adjacency bonuses.

 

[ExemplarVoss]

Yeah, the farm adjacency bonuses become a big deal (+0.5 food per adjacent farm in the medieval era, +1 per farm with replaceable parts). The next logical step for more food in that city is cutting down the forest directly west of Washington and replacing it with a farm.
2+1 food. +2 because it is adjacent to two farms. And those two farms get +1 food each. So one more farm in the right spot gives the city +7 food (with replaceable parts).
On the downside there are only 3 (maybe 4) more places for farms after that, and they won't get adjacency bonuses... unless a city gets placed to the north, and they put some more farms in adjacent to Washington's farms.

The campus and encampment honestly should be in the tundra rather than where they are in the grassland. I get why the holy site isn't, but I'd probably setup a district triangle (and get an adjacency bonus to all three districts rather than get 1 measly mountain). Between the two of them and adjacency bonuses, they're denying the city 10 food in the late game, whereas tundra can't be farmed, so it is perfect for districts and wonders. And in the tundra the encampment would help against those barbarian incursions, while someone should want to settle in the coastal area near an oasis and those jungles.

 

[Lord Yanaek]

The campus and encampment honestly should be in the tundra rather than where they are in the grassland.

And this comes from Firaxis official "How To Play" videos. No wonder the developers can't really teach the AI how to play

Yes the Campus should be directly south of Washington on the Tundra (buying tile if necessary) for the same forest adjacency bonus with Encampment next to it for district adjacency bonus adding a 3rd one S of the river, probably a commercial hub.
Given the hit or miss nature of religious belief, sacrificing the early faith from the mountain is another story.