SGOTM 16 - Plastic Ducks

How do you plan the war with Ram and how do you plan to defend Western cities? It's a waste to let sword stay at cities.
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I'd build some muskets for west (Egyptian land, right?). One in Thebes and Memphis should be enough for defense + some warriors and 4 warriors in coastal cities so Rammy couldn't take city with amphibious assault from galleon. It is fast and can reinforce if needed. It can also join in attack when safe.
Cannons can seem overbuilt but after Egypt, they are going to China.

Offense: Visigoth stack (3 cannons + What is already there + 2 Muskets) attacks Byblos, workers road the forest, then attacks city in the south (3S 2W of sheep) with road towards it. After that it goes after corn+incense city with help of one or two galleons, after that attacks Giza and more western city of Giza.
3 cannons can seem too much but it attacks at least 2 hill cities. I am even thinking about 4.

Thebes stack: 4 cannons 5 Muskets 2 Swords. Attack Alexandria, then attack Pi-Ramesses. It'd be better other way around but there are too many units in Alexandria.
 
kossin said:
Globe Theatre + National Park isn't really worth it. All island cities will grow enough that we'll already have 3C traderoutes everywhere, maybe 4.

I thought +3C trade route. It'd be worth somewhere near 8 commerce. I think I remember I got that internal route from one city in some game.

The best use, which I was insinuating, is in a heavily whipped city with high food surplus. Duckweed suggests Tours/Marseilles and I agree. These are very nice cities but heavily capped by the whip.

Without question. But I tried to think more like: How can GT help all cities instead just one. Must check in WB how far those trade routes can go.

I'd also like some details on the war against Ramesses. How many troops, from where, to where, when and how (galleons? land?) ... not in great detail but the general plan. As long as it is clear in your mind how to proceed, you don't have to provide detailed plan.

@Duckweed
Taking Hammy's southern cities is good; less culture pressure on us initially.
SB is a bit far, but if he builds Versailles and SM... he's got to go.

Agree.

~~~

I've been warming up on civ4 earlier; played on Immortal and completely stomped the AI with a so-so start and little-to-no micro. I guess I'll be ready on Friday is what I mean :)
Click to expand...

Why just Immortal.;)
 
shakabrade said:
I'd build some muskets for west (Egyptian land, right?). One in Thebes and Memphis should be enough for defense + some warriors and 4 warriors in coastal cities so Rammy couldn't take city with amphibious assault from galleon. It is fast and can reinforce if needed. It can also join in attack when safe.
Cannons can seem overbuilt but after Egypt, they are going to China.

Offense: Visigoth stack (3 cannons + What is already there + 2 Muskets) attacks Byblos, workers road the forest, then attacks city in the south (3S 2W of sheep) with road towards it. After that it goes after corn+incense city with help of one or two galleons, after that attacks Giza and more western city of Giza.
3 cannons can seem too much but it attacks at least 2 hill cities. I am even thinking about 4.

Thebes stack: 4 cannons 5 Muskets 2 Swords. Attack Alexandria, then attack Pi-Ramesses. It'd be better other way around but there are too many units in Alexandria.
Click to expand...

You could gather forces in Thebes and do a 2 fork attack, the major stack goes for Ale and another stack goes for Pi, so that you don't need to worry much about defense in Thebes and Memphis, 1 musk in Memphis should be enough. Too bad that Ram still does not want to OB, but you can ship the forces in Vis there, It seems that a couple warriors should be enough to defend Vis.;)
 
Tested. Super trade route between Amiens size 24 with sushi and city as far as Akkad size 36 is worth 12 gold.

If Akkad was size 24 it'd be worth 8 gold. It is important that GT+NP city is as far as possible from the most of our cities. Akkad could play that role. It has many flood plains, thus food, and also fish. With Sushi it can skyrocket in pop. Investment is 400 Hammers. We are Industrial, aren't we. While it can bring even over 150 commerce per turn by the end of the game. If average is 100 for 20 turns. It is something.
 
Duckweed said:
You could gather forces in Thebes and do a 2 fork attack, the major stack goes for Ale and another stack goes for Pi, so that you don't need to worry much about defense in Thebes and Memphis, 1 musk in Memphis should be enough. Too bad that Ram still does not want to OB, but you can ship the forces in Vis there, It seems that a couple warriors should be enough to defend Vis.;)
Click to expand...

Actually, now I see we could fork attack already. Without shipping units from Vis. We can road to forest hill 3W of Vis. Oui. Way to go. Thebes stack can then use galleons from Babylon to reach all other cities and kill Rammy in no time.

Edit: Of course, this isn't fork attack but effect is the same.
 
shakabrade said:
Tested. Super trade route between Amiens size 24 with sushi and city as far as Akkad size 36 is worth 12 gold.

If Akkad was size 24 it'd be worth 8 gold. It is important that GT+NP city is as far as possible from the most of our cities. Akkad could play that role. It has many flood plains, thus food, and also fish. With Sushi it can skyrocket in pop. Investment is 400 Hammers. We are Industrial, aren't we. While it can bring even over 150 commerce per turn by the end of the game. If average is 100 for 20 turns. It is something.
Click to expand...

Very interesting. I guess we only need to estimate the time it takes to grow that large then and decide on ROI. (It's at least 20+ turns (assuming 1t/pop), we'd probably only reach 36 near end of game)
 
You still need to gather enough forces to attack Ele and can't rely on much forces back from Bab since most of them need to go for another invasion vs SB or Qin. Therefore, shipping units to Thebes direction is necessary.

It's very hard for any city to reach over 30, not because of happiness and health cap, but the food needed to grow that big. The number of Sushi resources in this game are much less than SGOTM12.
 
New post so it doesn't get hidden...

War: Agreed for 2-cities strike
1) Alexandria
2) Pi-R
If only 1 Musket, move the Pike to Thebes to avoid a HA snipe. (yea, I'm overly-cautious !)

Other suggestions are good, you're clear to lose some more sleep ;)
 
Only 18 food Sushi at best?! That hurts our culture too.
But even with that, Akkad can grow 1pop/turn for quite long. It'd have large surpluses at first which would transfer to food deficit times. That is what I gathered from those score games recently. Food is not lost.

edit:

You still need to gather enough forces to attack Ele
Click to expand...

Ele? Who the fuc* is Ele?:D

Seriously, DW, what do you mean by Ele?
 
As long as you know who's that.:D Now, time to work.

You also need to think about the civic change during GAs, we need to switch between Pacific and OR often.
 
Qin will trade Guilds and Furs. Actions?

We have Philo, Paper, Astro and Gunpowder to trade.
 
Is it T187? He is likely to go for Banking next. If we trade him with Phi + Paper, we might be able to trade Banking next from either Hammy and Qin. I'd say go for it. We should be able to complete Liberalism ~T200. Don't think Qin will give serious trouble for the race.
 
I thought so.:D
Yes T187.
Guilds in. He had no cash on himself but it was good trade.

BTW, we discovered 3 fish and 1 crab in the south.:D
 
Save uploaded.
T188
Hammy is going for Lib. 7 turns until completion. War is for tomorrow. Please check and suggest.

Tired.
 
There are nine extant manuscripts of the Song of Roland in Old French. The oldest of these manuscripts is held at the Bodleian Library at Oxford. This copy dates between 1140 and 1170 and was written in Anglo-Norman.
 
@soundjata
???

@game
Liberalism is good and bad news I guess. So long as we capitulate Hammy within 6~7 turns, we're safe a bit longer as we tell him to switch techs after capitulation. He is very lightly defended so I don't expect a long war. (idiot sent all his troops north!)
After capture of first 2 cities, we can expect a big drop in his research which helps us also.

Suggestions:
-unload the GM in Akkad, send to Babylon for trade mission. We can burn some gold in case something goes wrong (capitulates to a friend is unlikely (power, not Friendly) BUT I'd rather it not happen.) Especially since we're changing targets to SB, we can afford to beg from Qin.

-we need to work on that GPP plan NOW. We need to target cities that won't be whipped anymore. Some cities to start producing GPP now and maybe some to start growing.

-we're having a tough time moving troops to old Egypt... damn OB's. If only he'd meet Hammy. Anyway, I see we have almost all troops done or in production.
 
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