GOTM 40 Spoiler 2: Entering Industrial Ages

PTW Open 20K in Athens

The middle ages went much better than the AA, simply by virtue of the AA being so horrible. The Persians declared on me, giving me a nice happiness boost. A space opened up off continent for me to expand into peacefully near the end. And best, I had some culture to build: a colosseum, a cathedral, Sistine Chapel, a university, Copernicus's observatory, and Bach's Cathedral all got finished during the middle ages. Plus I finished 3 more middle age wonders in the industrial ages. If I hadn't screwed up the first 4500 years so horribly, I would have been in good shape.

Nothing interesting happened during the middle ages, as I started no wars and the Persians couldn't reach me. I learned navigation early, and this let me trade for several luxes, and then no one else had learned music theory so I traded it around the turn I built Bach's and got a nice pile of money. Everyone liked me, but I was pretty much a non-entity as far as they were concerned.
 
Still trying for 20K with Vanilla Open.

At the end of MA (1375AD) I managed only to add two wonders:

Sistine 950AD
Shakespeare 1310AD

Newton will be finished shortly after that. According to CivAssist game will last almost till 2000AD. I am afraid I will be forced to go for Diplomatic or I will lost on Spaceship.

How do you know which oponents likes you and which not? :confused:
 
Jonesy10 said:
@Redbad

What do you think I should be focuses on?

Lately I’m getting more and more radical in pursueing the chosen victorygoal. With focus I mean concentrate on the things that further the chosen victorygoal. In your case you choose 20K as victorytype.

First priority is to start the 20K-business asap. Get out a settler at size three and start building culture.

Second priority is to max production in the 20K-city. This means improving the surroundings to max shield production and joining workers to max population. Only build cultural improvements in the 20K-city. Exceptions can be made for hospital (PTW), factory and coalplant and, in this situation, a settler and a harbour.

You are using your capitol for 20K. That’s very good for early culture (palace and possibly temple before settler) and low-corruption. It’s bad for not having the palace-prebuild option and not being able to jump the palace. Consequences are you have to time your research well.
(I have in a recent game dedicated a city to build the palace. I planned it’s completion with the switch from a Leo’s prebuild to FP in the 20K-city. This strategy enabled me to have a bit of the advantages of both alternatives, while costing me the production of one city for an entire era)

The rest of the empire is there to serve the 20K-city. And there a number of things to be done:
- We need units (in despotism) or money (republic) to hurry normal improvements
- We need stock-exchanges for Wall Street, and hospitals for Battlefield Medicine.
- We need science to get us through the horrible (culture-wise that is) Industrial Age.
- We need wars to produce MGLs for hurrying wonders and enabling Heroic Epic, Military
Academy and Pentagon.
- Maybe we need a pinpoint operation to knock-out a single city that otherwise would beat
us to a certain wonder.
- Maybe we need a city building a low-culture wonder to interupt a wonder-cascade.
And I’m sure there a few other tasks thinkable for supporting the 20K-city.

The above ofcourse are suggestions for a fast 20K victory, it won’t garantee you a high score. There is besides the quite common species Homo Sapiens an other species roaming these threads. They go for a medal and choose a victorytype to prevent the medal feeling lonely. I call them Homo Civvicus. Homo Civvicus can be addressed as an english nobleman, or he likes orange-soda or is dang fast but doesn’t hurry, etc, etc. You can learn quite alot from their postings.
 
@Redbad

An excellent summary and some ideas, like stopping wonder cascades, which had never ocurred to me before. I think you overlooked one thing though: leader farming.

Edit: I see you did bring leader farms up. You just didn't use the term. My error. Sorry.

Redbad said:
Lately I’m getting more and more radical in pursueing the chosen victorygoal. With focus I mean concentrate on the things that further the chosen victorygoal.

IMO, 20K is the only victory condition which has to be pursued from the very beginning. All the others start out the same way:
- rapid expansion as fast as possible
- conquer the world
- get to the industrial era ASAP by hook or by crook

Depending on the level and the map, it's possible that a conquest or domination might end before you ever get to the IA. Alternately, conquer-the-world mode might last into the Modern Era. In any case, the three first goals are always the same. It's only once you've conquered the world that they start to move in different directions. Or do you disagree?
 
GOTM40 OPEN PTW 1.27f

Link to AA_spoiler

I have decided to try for a military win, either domination or conquest.

I reached middle ages in 70BC, I get Engineering as free tech, I gift/trade Persia and Babylon to MA, Persia gets engineering Babylon Feudalism. Trade engineering for feudalism, start om Monoteism.

I have a city on iron to NW but no harbor there so I build warriors in Athens and galleys in other citys. 250AD I learn Monoteism start Theology.

350AD Xerxes shows up and demands contact with Babylon, whem I refuse he declares :) . This is great since my plan has been to start my military campaign against Persia and now I can reduce lux tax for a while. I have been setting up an invasion force for Persia. I sign up Rome, Carthage and Arabs against Persia so they can burn some troops while I continue to prepare my invasion.

470AD I learn Theology start Education, my invasion force is getting ready to launch. It consists of 18 galleys, 16 MDI, 4 catapults and 3 hoplites.

490AD I send 7 galleys to set up a suicide transfer point, I lose four IBT :( , I move three with 5 MDI and a hoplite through the point and land on the mountain NW of Samaria.

ts64_gotm40_persian_invasion.JPG


500AD I capture Samaria with the loss of 1 MDI. The war against Persia goes well, in 730AD they are eliminated, my allies managed to take some of Persias citys but that will change:satan: . My biggest problem during this war was to get extra galleys to replace the ones that sank, I lost 15 total on the transfer point.

My plan is to move my palace to Persepolis with a leader, so I set-up RCP 5, 7, 10 around Persepolis. I have built FP in Sparta 530AD so my home continent shouldn't have any corruption problems. I continue to build up my empire and in 1130AD Carthage starts acting suspicously, I have just learned MT, he shows good timing. I ask him to remove his troops and he declares. I sign up the romans against him, he is gone in 1310AD.

When I learned Military tradition in 1130AD, I stopped research for the rest of the game and used the cash to rush military, settlers and buildings.
Move troops in position and declares on Arabs 1325AD.
1335AD Zulu move in some troops towards my beach head Miletus, I ask them to go away and he declares. I kill his first troops. A few turns later this happens :eek:

ts64_gotm40_zulu_army_1355ad.JPG


I have mostly been playing C3C lately, so it made me a bit surprised. I guess I had some RNG luck as one cavalry killed the army with 1HP left.
1345AD Rome move in some troops, I ask him to remove them and he declares. I easily fend off his troops. This is a very good year since in one of my elite wins Pyrrhus appears [party] , it will take two turns to move him to Persepolis. It will be very interesting to see the effect of the palace move, since this is not something I normally do.
1360AD is the palace in Persepolis ready, corruption goes from 744GPT to 586GPT and production around Persepolis increases dramatically.
I eliminate romans 1395AD and arabs 1400AD, now I start to move all my troops to get serious with Chaka, Cleo and Hammurabi.
I trigger my golden age 1425AD with a hoplite attacking a regular archer. I decided early that I didn't want a golden age before the palace was moved, since I wanted some production and not only commerce which was what my old palace region produced, so I kept my hoplites away from battles.
I eliminate zulu 1450AD, the same year I declare on Egypt and Babylon. I had planned to start with Egypt but Babylon moved up a few knights, longbows and bowmen just outside the border to Memphis, I suspected him to declare next turn but I thought it would be better to attack then defend with cavalry.
I take some egyptian towns and win by domination 1475AD.

ts64_gotm40_progress.JPG


Thoughts what I could have done to achive an earlier victory.

1. My biggest mistake was probably to overestimate the AI's, this is probably because I normally dont play on regent, but on emperor/demi-god.

2. When I eliminated Persia I should have declared on Carthage directly and not waited for 40 turns.

3. When I learned Navigation I built Magellans and that was totally useless. I had the Great Lighthouse, never researched Magnetism and learned that the
extra movement points dont stack :( .

4. I built quite a few cats/cannons and when I got faster units I never used them, and when I used them earlier they mostly missed their target. So probably would have been better with more troops instead.

Things I belive was good

1. I never traded communications to the AI's so the two continents never knew each other, this probably slowed their tech-pace and I guess it was good for me but I'm not sure

2. I traded WM for about 5 - 15g almost every turn, a small thing but it was better I had the gold then the AI's.
 
davidcrazy said:
... Bab asked gold from me and declare war on me after I rejected
<snip>
i did reload and play again, this time giving in to Bab's request. with the reloaded game, i accidentally achieved domination in 1892 while my original goal is 100k.
<snip>
i did submit my game just to 'participate'. with the pitifully low score, i am not sure whether it's ok to leave my reloaded game there since it won't harm anyone. :)

Isn't it illegal to reload and play on? :confused:
 
Abegweit said:
It's only once you've conquered the world that they start to move in different directions. Or do you disagree?

I quite agree, for the most part, that is ;) . If going for domination, conquest or the cow there is really no other way than rapid. agressive expansion. And if one wants a high score, again one needs to expand fast.

However, speaking for myself, I'm mostly interested in a fast finish. And so, when having enough cities for fast research in diplo- or space-games, I do not continue to conquer the world just for the sake of high-scoring. For 100K I also stop conquering when I have enough room to fit in the needed cities.

If you look at my games that won awards, COTM38 and COTM39 you'll see that they didn't score high and that I left most AI's untouched. But as I said, that's just me. The topplayers follow the pattern you described.
 
Without horses back home, my course changed to catapults/cannons/artillery and hoplites/riflemen/infantry. I also tried to get to Magnatism as fast as possible. While trying to get to Magnatism, I was only able to work on conquering the Babylonians. They took a good 1000+ years to conquer. I got into the IA in 1330AD, and the Babylonians were still not gone. I still had no leader and so I had no productive cities on the continent. Catapults suck in PTW (as opposed to Conquests). A stack of 10 of them would hit once per turn against a spearman in a size 5 town. I basically had to rush MI to capture a few cities get to saltpeter. Cannons were much better, but once again, cannons are much different in PTW than in Conquests. Instead of doing damage to units, cannons would first have to destroy all city improvements and kill almost all citiens first. This made each town/city siege take 2-3 turns instead of 1 turn. By my IA (1330AD) I had 27 cannons, 24 hoplites, and 5 medieval infantry on the Zulu-Egyptian-Babylonian continent, and the Babylonians had only 3 cities left. Also, I made sure to get Leo's Workshop to reduce upgrade costs. This was very nice, and, for some reason, I had no problem building it first.

I really started to hate the Persians. They had a perfect (I mean perfect) starting position. The space to expand was perfect. They had enemies on only one side, and they had the space between them and their enemies to expand to a very nice circle. By my IA (1330AD) they had conquered the Romans and were in perfect position for more conquest.

I got lucky to get a city on the Zulu/Egyptian/Babylonian continent in 330AD in a nice spot that had horses and iron. I was also able to stay at peace without much sacrifice so that I would not lose this foothold. With more care, as I said above, I was even able to make a little bit of progress into Babylonain territory for saltpeter. The really interesting stuff for me did not happen until the IA. Here is my timeline up to the conquering of the Babylonians.
 
This is my first GOTM, despite having played Civ2 and now Civ3 since 1998!

I'm trying for a 20K culture victory in Athens; playing Vanilla Open (Mac player).

1525BC Colossus
330BC Great Library (entered Golden Age!)
150AD Great Lighthouse
510AD Hanging Gardens
1040AD Sistine Chapel

Also in Athens: Palace, Temple, Library, Cathedral, University & Colosseum
53 culture per turn. 6,726 in 1495 - will I make it?

Up to 1495 and almost everyone, except Egyptians and Romans, have declared war on me! Plus trade embargos, alliances - hey, what did I do!?

Finally got Saltpeter and Horses in current war with the Zulu, so time to kick some butt! Have survived so far with purely hoplites & catapults, though now able to build riflemen, cavalry and frigates :)
 

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Predator, Going for Domination

My Ancient Age post is Here

Middle Ages, 290bc—720ad

Strategic Plans
We were on a tiny starting island and horses were not to be found. Therefore my plan at the beginning of the Middle Ages was to research to Navigation as soon as possible, but in the meantime to assemble a fleet of 14 suicide galleys to take a force of around 15 Medieval Infantry to Persia. Assuming a few galleys survived the mission, this force would be followed by a few workers (that now had nothing to do) and a few settlers to facilitate a palace jump.

My major reasons for the suicide mission were to set up a second core and to obtain horses. The second core would help to accelerate research initially, and afterward it would be invaluable for producing the military I would need to reach domination.

The Suicide Fleet and the Persian War, 710 bc—290 ad
While my fleet was being completed, the rest of my cities (particularly those on the tiny islands) were building libraries and harbors if they didn’t already have them. The only exceptions were my colossus city, which also built a marketplace, and my forbidden palace city, which began the Great Library as a prebuild for Leonardo’s Workshop.

210 bc was a nice turn: the Persians completed the Pyramids in their capitol and lost their iron city to the Romans. That meant that when I finally got there they would have very few immortals. They would definitely have no more than their two “Predator” pikemen, because they had no trading partners from whom to acquire Feudalism.

I lost two more galleys to barbs, so it took me longer to assemble my suicide fleet than I expected. The crossing did not begin until 110bc. I had fairly good luck, with only two of my eight ships sinking, but the following turn I lost five out of six: law of averages I suppose. I took my first Persian city (and horses) in 10 ad. Over the next 100 years I captured a few more cities and shipped over three more settlers, three workers and two more Med. Inf. More galleys sank in this crossing, leaving me with about four, but I was building replacements. In 150 ad I finally reached the walls of Persepolis (and the Pyramids) with 8 Med Inf (2 elite) and 3 settlers to facilitate a palace jump. I didn’t need the settlers however, because fortune shined and I got a Great Leader during the assault. Since my last 4 games were leaderless until the end, this was a very, very happy moment! The leader not only allowed me to keep my old palace city, but he enabled me to use my settlers to build three more cities at RCP 5 from the new palace. Unfortunately, Carthage plopped down a city just to the west of Persepolis, so that hampered my expansion toward their lands for a little while (it culture flipped to me a few hundred years later).

In 290 ad I eliminated the Persians. Initially, most cities built a worker or two if they were big enough. After that they built a library, a barracks, then lots of horsemen and an occasional settler. The additional force of workers was very, very important, as I wanted to improve as many tiles as possible in the second core before my GA began.

BF-GOTM40-290ad.jpg


The Golden Age of Greece and the Egyptian War, 310 ad—570 ad
I still had about 10 Med. Inf left from the war with Persia, along with a few shiny new horsemen. Also, I now had Astronomy, so it was safe to transport troops from the Persian continent to the Zulu continent. It seemed like an ideal time to take a few more cities, preferably from a weak opponent. Egypt was definitely the weakest AI, as they only had a handful of spread-out cities and were still three techs away from the Middle Ages. They also had two easily obtainable luxuries which I really needed. I declared war on Egypt in 310 ad to slow them down even more while I assembled my troops for transport.

In 430 ad I completed a harbor on the Persian continent which, along with navigation, enabled the cities on the home island to start building horsemen. I also had almost completed a chain of caravels from the home island to the Egyptian continent.

The first Egyptian city fell in 470 ad, and it had dyes. I rushed a harbor 2 turns later to connect them. On the next turn (500 ad), I decided to trade a tech to Carthage and Rome for a total of three more luxuries. I then took an Egyptian city that had Incense. So we went from one luxury to six in a single turn: yummy! And just to add to the fun, the Egyptians attacked one of my hoplites, which kicked off my GA. In 570 ad I gave Egypt peace for one city, which left them with only one.

BF-GOTM40-590ad.jpg


Tough Choices
I had a difficult time deciding when to trigger my GA in this game. It might have been better to have it at the beginning of the conflict with Persia. That would have sped up science and got me to military tradition sooner. On the other hand, by triggering it late, it allowed me to have a GA with a nicely productive second core. That allowed me to expand my military very quickly and also raise the cash I needed for upgrades. I am not sure if the late GA was the best decision or not, but it seemed to work out pretty well.

A second difficulty in this game was deciding whether to fight my final wars with knights or with cavalry. At the time I finally got Navigation (430ad), I still had very few horsemen built, so I decided to go ahead and go for cavalry. In most cases I would choose knights for a regent level game, but in this one—due to the late development of the second core and late acquisition of horses—I couldn’t work it out logistically. If I could have established my second core and acquired horses about eight turns sooner, then I think shutting off research after chivalry would have resulted in an earlier victory date. But that is just a guess.

Research
My research wasn’t quite as fast as I would have liked, but I am not sure how I could have sped it up much more—short of triggering my GA earlier. It went as follows: Monotheism for free (290bc), Feudalism via trade with Babylon (290bc); Theology, 16 turns (30ad); edu, 11 (250ad); Astron, 7 (320ad); Navigation, 6 (380ad); Engineering via trade with Carthage (310ad); all techs from Invention to Military Tradition could have been learned in 4 turns, but I ended up delaying MT by two turns because I was waiting for Leonardo to finish. Therefore I didn’t get it until 600ad. After that I turned off research and, due to my GA and the high-commerce harbor cities of our starting island, was making 475-575gpt. I didn’t build many marketplaces this game, and those that I built came late: around 500 ad when I had acquired more than one luxury.

The First Arab War, 470 ad—610 ad
I will give a brief mention here of a hollow war I started in 470 with the Arabs. The Romans had many Legionaries in my territory (about 12 I think), and they were making me nervous. Therefore I declared war on the Arabs and gave the Romans and Carthage a tech to join me. Over the next few turns I watched them send vast numbers of military toward the Arabs. There couldn’t be many units left defending their cities. :) Giving the Arabs peace in 610ad blew my Alliance rep, but that was hardly a concern considering what I planned to do next.

The Age of Cavalry and World Domination
Carthage and Rome learned Gunpowder in 590 ad. I didn’t expect to see any Musketmen, however, because I would be taking Carthage’s saltpeter soon, and Rome didn’t have any. I got Military Tradition in 600ad. I immediately upgraded 38 horsemen to cavalry. About 15 of these cavalry were next to the Zulu and the rest were next to Carthage. I positioned my troops outside 6 Carthage cities and 6 Zulu cities, and in 620 ad I performed a dual RoP rape, taking all 12. That left Carthage with two cities and the Zulu with eight, although four of those were on an island. Carthage was eliminated on the next turn.

BF-GOTM40-620ad.jpg


I was continuing to build lots of horsemen in my cities by connecting/disconnecting saltpeter. Thanks to my GA, I was able to build about 10 horsemen per turn, and I had more than enough money for the upgrades. The Conquest was proceeding very quickly at this point, so I started adding my workers to cities.

I took Egypt’s last city in 660ad, and the Zulu were confined to their tiny island in 680ad, the same turn in which I RoP raped the Romans for eight more cities. Like Carthage, Caesar was eliminated on the following turn. At this point I had around 54% of the map, and so I rushed about 20 libraries, primarily in coastal cities.

BF-GOTM40-x.jpg


In 700ad I began switching my military factories over to wealth, because it was unlikely that new military units would be able to accomplish anything productive before domination was triggered. I RoP raped Babylon in 710ad, taking nine cities and leaving them with one, and I attacked and took 3 cities from the Arabs. In 720 I got my border expansions from many of the libraries I had rushed earlier and reached domination.

BF-GOTM40-720ad.jpg
 
Well done, bradleyfeanor! :goodjob:
Nice to read your story. You know, Domination is my favorite victory. :)
(I don't play GOTM40, read only)
 
Dynamic said:
You know, Domination is my favorite victory. :)
(I don't play GOTM40, read only)

Woohoo!!! That means I might actually get the award! :banana:

Obviously, my strategy was very similar to the one you used in our last game. Foregoing Marketplaces was very helpful! Harbors were much more costly though since we were not seafaring in this one--but they were necessary because the starting island was even smaller.
 
bradleyfeanor said:
Woohoo!!! That means I might actually get the award! :banana:

Obviously, my strategy was very similar to the one you used in our last game. Foregoing Marketplaces was very helpful! Harbors were much more costly though since we were not seafaring in this one--but they were necessary because the starting island was even smaller.


How did you keep happiness up this game? Sliders, temples, cathedrals, luxuries??
 
@bradleyfeanor
Really great game :goodjob: Suiciding over in late BC to take the Persian core so that it was well built to profit a maximum from GA. Wish I had the same idea. But seeing how my poor galleys sank it really didnt spring to mind.
 
[ptw]
swordsman_small.gif
predator.
Goal: Space or diplomatic. Highest possible tech rate in any case.

Link to AA spoiler is here.

Indeed, I wish I'd had a second core, but in this game I couldn't quite match my military performance from last GotM. I tried, but I was too weak and was subsequently beaten back. That severly hampered my research, I didn't reach 4 turn research until Metallurgy as the last necessary tech of the MA.

Here's the full story:

Reach MA in 130 BC, got Engineering, as did Babylon and Persia. Thus I had to start reasearching Monotheism instead of going straight for Theology. :(
My general plan was to research the Theology-Education-Astronomy-Banking-Navigation path, hoping to get some help with Feudalism and Invention.

Tech story:
90 AD: Monotheism (11 turns)
210 AD: Feudalism from Carthage
280 AD: Theology (11 turns)
370 AD: Education (9 turns)
450 AD: Astronomy (8 turns)
530 AD: Navigation (8 turns)
590 AD: Banking (6 turns)
590 AD: Invention from Carthage
590 AD: Gunpowder(!) from Rome
590 AD: Chivalry from Babylon
640 AD: Chemistry (5 turns)
700 AD: Physics (6 turns)
750 AD: Theory of Gravity (5 turns)
800 AD: Magnetism (5 turns)
800 AD: Printing Press from Rome
840 AD: Metallurgy (4 turns), Enter IA.
840 AD: Nationalism (free tech)

Obviously my tech rate was far from what I had hoped for, mainly due to two things:
  • Bad RNG Luck. All three scientific civs got Engineering. One of us getting Monotheism would have saved me maybe 8 or so turns. There is also a spill-over effect from bad RNG luck in the AA, where it seems many of the AI civs chose the same tech route, leaving me to research more on my own, leading to a later MA entry. In the IA the evil RNG popped its head again, giving me Nationalism, and none of the others got Steam Engine.
  • My utterly failed attempt to set up a second core, story to follow.

My first attempt to expand to the ZEB continent started in 210 AD. I founded Thessalonika on the site of an Egyptian town razed by the Zulu. I saw a horde of Zulu troops marching on Egypt and greedily wanted a piece of the cake. MA with the Zulu against Egypt, even though I only had a single sword on that continent.

Over the next few years I lost my entire ship chain (that was too small to begin with) . That stopped reinforcements coming, I had managed to ship in two MInf only. In 310 the invincible Zulu forces had been beaten back by Egyptian archers, leaving me with no cover against the retaliation attack. It consisted of a single archer who killed my sword and razed Thessalonika. The two MInfs were stranded in Egypt and were killed in 360 AD.

At this point I had next to no navy and I decided to wait for Navigation. In the early 7th century I built a few fishing villages along the coasts of ZEB, biding by time. I was slow on amassing troops, so it took until 810 AD until I finally had the nerve to declare on Egypt, bringing Zulu in with me. Egypt was far behind in tech, and I was confident my 7 vMedInfs would take Thebes that was guarded by 2 spears and one pike. Out of nowhere storms two Egyptian knights, I didn't even realize they had gotten Chivalry two turns before. Two MedInfs down, and two more defenders in Thebes.
To make a long story short, Zulu took Thebes while I had to settle for two fringe towns for now, the rest is IA. I clearly need to practise even more on warfare...

Other interesting events:

580 AD: Sparta builds FP.
700 AD: Athens builds Copernicus'.
780 AD: Persia declares war on me (ROP rape!). The harbor town I built was too tempting it seems. Whatever, I just wanted to have a harbor over there, now I just need to make peace again. It just bothers me that I didn't simply *give* them the town...
880 AD: Despite being gracious towards me, getting 13gpt, having a MA against
Egypt *and* a MPP, Babylon sneak attacks me and captures my incense town.
I get incense from Zulu instead and a MA agains Babylon...
900 AD: Athens builds Newton's, triggering the GA (this is IA, but a MA wonder so... ;)

My GA lets me make good progress, though I would have wanted a second core well established first. Oh well, I'll do what I can from now on and try to keep my empire together despite the sneaky neighbors. I'll add a few images when I get home.

I've seen a lot of posts on 20k, where are the other Dipl-SS players? I saw MOTH's post, but there were no dates in it so I couldn't really compare. And what about RedBad? No spoiler from you?
 
Niklas said:
I founded Thessalonika on the site of an Egyptian town razed by the Zulu. I saw a horde of Zulu troops marching on Egypt and greedily wanted a piece of the cake.
Are you sure the town was razed by the Zulu? In my game I thought the Babs had razed an Egyptian town, but looking at it with the CRP-viewer it turned out the Egyptians abandoned it! This was a very dumb thing to do because it must have been one of the first towns they built. I just thought the same thing might have happened in your game because this town was placed on the incence (a coveted spot I suppose) but it had no access to food so the Egyptians probably built a worker and chose to abandon the town when the worker was finished.

I considered attacking Egypt too but I didn't really need a strong second core like you do. On the other hand, bradleyfeanor shows that the second core could save turns even with the quick military approach ( :goodjob: )

ainwood, I noticed some tiles have names like "Sea PREDATOR". Does that mean that the layout is altered for predator. I haven't seen any signs of it.
 
Niklas said:
I've seen a lot of posts on 20k, where are the other Dipl-SS players? I saw MOTH's post, but there were no dates in it so I couldn't really compare. And what about RedBad? No spoiler from you?

Yes, there is, only not in this thread but in the final one.
 
MeteorPunch said:
How did you keep happiness up this game? Sliders, temples, cathedrals, luxuries??
I used the slider. Here’s a pic of my civ from 490ad, when I still had only one luxury.

BF-GOTM40-490ad.jpg


I ran a 20% luxury rate most of the time, although there were a couple of turns when it was at 30%. Usually, I hired a scientist or two (as seen in the pic) to keep lux at 20%. Science was usually maxed out, although it isn’t in the pic because Chemistry was due the next turn.

In 500ad I brought in six luxuries, so they took care of happiness for the remainder of the game. I ran a 10% lux rate for a small boost to score from happy people, but the lux rate wasn’t needed to prevent revolts.

I seldom ever build happiness improvements such as temples. I use them in 100k and 20k games, of course, but in a non-culture game I rarely build them. I may build one in a town in which the borders need to expand, and I sometimes build one in a city if it is bigger than all my other towns and I know it will stay larger than them for a long time. Those are the only two cases I can think of where I find them useful. In general, I consider them to be a waste of valuable shields. They are no more effective at keeping people happy than the luxury slider, but you have to pay lots of shields to build them. I would rather spend that production on science improvements or military. Or, as in this game, lots and lots of boats…


MiniMe said:
…seeing how my poor galleys sank it really didnt spring to mind.
There were a few turns in which I thought my strategy was sinking right along with my galleys! :sad:

I built—and lost—more galleys in this game than in any five of my other games combined. Between the barbs and sinking, I lost around 28. I had harbors and libraries in most cities back around 600bc, and—until horses were available in 430 ad—my cities just built galleys over and over and over. That’s almost a millennium of building boats. If it had gone on much longer my people could have walked to Persia on the hulls of their sunken ships! :) I couldn’t think of any other improvements that it would be useful to build until then, however, so I kept at it. In the end, I was surprised by how well it worked out.

There were two big exceptions to the boat building: one city was dedicated to the FP and Leonardo, and my colossus city built everything—harbor, library, market and university. It was generating around 75 commerce through most of the middle ages. (Now that I think of it, more than that, because most of the Middle Ages were spent in my GA.)
 
Your screenshot, bradleyfeanor, is very close to my COTM09 when I also have 1 lux for a long time and use 20% of slider.

I understand you gladness about I'm not playing this game but in any case, I think you finished earlier then I possibly could because I should not build suicide galley exept for contacts before Navigation.
 
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