azzaman333
meh
the only units i saw exploring near my territory of the germans were a warrior and a spear. do you think what direction they send the units has something to do with them attacking or not (i wasnt attacked)
COTM14 First Spoiler: Starting Landmass, Ancient Age Resources
- Thread starter Karasu
- Start date
denyd
Emperor
I had the same first contact, spying a warrior with a settler heading east towards the silks. The second contact was a settler & spearmen heading to the coast, but my warrior & settler beat them to the spot.
In my game Germany settled to the east & north first, maybe because they would have had to cross through my land to get to the south.
In my game Germany settled to the east & north first, maybe because they would have had to cross through my land to get to the south.
MjM
Deity
Cuivienen said:
Hmmm not my case. My first build was a Granary. After that finished and I had built a warrior , 3 german archers came. The RNG gods loved me though and my warrior didnt even get scratched. Shortly after that I sued for peace , as a stream of archers kept pounding London.
Bigfoot
Emperor
Sorry, I didn't keep a detailed log so I don't know the date. It was fairly early, but after the first warrior and curragh had already been built and sent out exploring.
eldar
ChiefTank
Of some interest... what was traded for first up?
I thought about it and went for Warrior Code rather than Bronze Working. An archer (or even the ability to build archers?) is a bigger deterrent to an AI than a spearman.
I thought about it and went for Warrior Code rather than Bronze Working. An archer (or even the ability to build archers?) is a bigger deterrent to an AI than a spearman.
Hmmmm.... My case fits with Cuivienen's theory. My first build was a warrior who stayed home as MP. I went predator, if that matters. Second build was a granary. I went straight for the Republic slingshot. Met Germany via an archer(?) waving across the German channel in 3150. Traded for Bronze Working immediadely. I didn't get attacked, was visited by transient spearmen...
Well it seems there has been some bad luck flying around. I was ( and still am ) cheesed off by 7 turns of anarchy, non existant AI tech race and bad curragh luck, but at least I still have a game to play. On the bright side, I always regard very early losses as proof of honest play 
.
I built warrior granary settler, and never got attacked by the germans even though they had 2 spearmen right next to my undefended second town.
I made as many deals as possible, especially trying to pay gpt for any German cash, but really think I was just fortunate this time.
I did get sneak attacked by the Spanish though, which was pretty damaging to my game plan, as I wasted ages in a rather ineffectual war with them, pulling all of my troops away from the german border.
.I built warrior granary settler, and never got attacked by the germans even though they had 2 spearmen right next to my undefended second town.
I made as many deals as possible, especially trying to pay gpt for any German cash, but really think I was just fortunate this time.
I did get sneak attacked by the Spanish though, which was pretty damaging to my game plan, as I wasted ages in a rather ineffectual war with them, pulling all of my troops away from the german border.
Mark Cutt
Analytic Chieftain
I built two warriors who fortified in London and Germans did not attack me despite many spearmen walking close to undefended cities.
I had tech deals with Gemany. I kept at least one tech for me. The rationale being that, hopefully, before attacking the AI civ should try to extort a tech.
My 3 Curragh were destroyed, they only met the 2 close civs.
I had tech deals with Gemany. I kept at least one tech for me. The rationale being that, hopefully, before attacking the AI civ should try to extort a tech.
My 3 Curragh were destroyed, they only met the 2 close civs.
Nata
Warlord
Jove said:
No, I was attacked even before I got a 2nd city.
I think it is placement of AI units when they meet us, and that is RNG triggered by other factors, for example worker/warrior movements.
My worker move was road cow and then South and chop.
Every time when I replayed and did that 2 German Archers would appear on the same distnce from London when my warrior would go North.
They might have desided that moving 2 Archers to London at the same time is too much an advantage, and nothing would stop them, no trade or gift or MP warrior.
Karasu - thanks for the pity, it's OK.
I took my chance and didn't switch granary to archer when I could. And it was a concious decison: to have a good game or no game rather than a slow agony which was GOTM43 (I switched granary to archer in Kioto THREE times, and lost on expansion).
Bigfoot
Emperor
Hmm, interesting thought. I initially sent my warrior exploring south, and he circled around to the north. He never actually crossed into Germany's cultural borders, because I didn't want to annoy them. The warrior stayed on the mountains S of the cow and tried to interfer with any units moving S. I rechecked the few notes I have, I traded with Bismark upon first contact, getting both WC and BW in exchange for my two techs plus a payment of gold and gpt.
For what its worth, I was burned once by Bismark in a solo game even though I had kept a spear fortified in my capital (which was on a hill, no less). That game was Deity, although I don't recall how high the AI aggressiveness was set.
For what its worth, I was burned once by Bismark in a solo game even though I had kept a spear fortified in my capital (which was on a hill, no less). That game was Deity, although I don't recall how high the AI aggressiveness was set.
Markus5
Code Monkey
My build was warrior curragh granary settler spear (1 turn from completion).
My worker watered and roaded the cow, then chopped mined and roaded a forest, then chopped another forest.
The warrior left NE and saw the blue border, then returned for MP duty.
The curragh met Germany while building the granary.
I traded for Bronze Working.
I had no chance to change production. I had just completed the settler.
I think I could have kept the settler running and eventually sued for peace. For some reason, I settled instead.
Well, I'm having fun as the Greeks in another game. But, I wish the Germans had decided to be wonder lusting in this game.
My worker watered and roaded the cow, then chopped mined and roaded a forest, then chopped another forest.
The warrior left NE and saw the blue border, then returned for MP duty.
The curragh met Germany while building the granary.
I traded for Bronze Working.
I had no chance to change production. I had just completed the settler.
I think I could have kept the settler running and eventually sued for peace. For some reason, I settled instead.
Well, I'm having fun as the Greeks in another game. But, I wish the Germans had decided to be wonder lusting in this game.
Puppeteer
Emperor
Open Class
Mods: NoAIpatrol=0, smiley popHeads, CivAssist
Strategy
I guessed/gambled that I'd have the island to myself with not even barbs on the isle, so I decided to go for Colossus, Republic slingshot and GLH en route to a space launch. To get all three I'd have to outproduce and/or outresearch my Emperor AI opponents in the early AA which I've done before but you have to sacrifice rapid expansion and instead have rapid growth in the captial pulling in commerce while the AI is walking its food and shields (settlers) around the map in an effort to expand. My initial build specs were granary, settler, Colossus.
In solo games I don't usually peek at my opponents, but in *OTM I know a lot of others do, so I do this time and note the Vikings with amphibious attack in early MA and three scientific civs that will start with the Colossus-enabling BW--but not necessarily on a coast, I told myself. I also noted the count three seafaring civs.
I'm going to start completely differently than I usually do. I usually don't build wonders, do explore early and fast and always road tiles before my worker leaves them. My plans negate the first two and I wind up stepping my worker off of a lot of unroaded tiles in a rush for early shield production.
The Game
I settled on the spot and sent the worker S to chop the fur forest. Production to granary, research at max to BW. Worker chops NE forest next (no improving the other tile first). As the 2nd chop completes the borders expand and I can see a blue border 1 tile away from mine to the N/NE--looks like Germany's color. They're on my island I can barely tell through fog gazing. I'm pretty sure they're an aggressive civ. I have no contact and see no troops so I decide to finish the granary and then reasses the plan. Worker moves to cow to irrigate.
The granary completes, and I still have no German contact and have seen no troops. I haven't explored at all obviously since I only have a worker who's busy. I decide to build the settler as planned instead of military and live life dangerously. (And hope that Germany doesn't find me soon.)
Three turns later a german spear appears between our borders but is more than 2 turns away because of the sea--I complete BW early that turn, I suppose because contact with Germany lowered the tech cost since he knows it. The settler is 3 turns away, and I have no military. I decide to continue the plan and be his b____ (um, buddy, that is...yeah, that's the ticket) to keep him from killing me off.
I'm up Alpha and Pottery and he's up WC. Of course he's annoyed. I need to trade with him to keep his attidude up with me, but I can't make a halfway decent deal and decide to wait a turn or two and see if he comes up with something new.
Start research on Writing starting at minimum; I research as fast as I can without running a deficit, so the research speed varies over time based on income and expenses. I avoid losing gold per turn because I'm expecting Bismarck to demand all my money away and I don't want to lose the granary.
The next turn his northern spear goes back north, but another spear appears at my Eastern border! Yikes, I thought I had a couple more turns! He also learned The Wheel since last turn. I can't get Wheel and WC for everything I've got so I buy The Wheel and 3g for Alpha and 2gpt. You may think I'm crazy for not buying the archer tech and panic-building military, but I'm not going to survive a war with him right now so I'm counting on the facts that he's still in the exploration/expansion phase and that I'm paying him gpt and that I'll give him whatever he demands to keep me alive (I still have Pottery to demand and some gold), and the Wheel shows me where horses are so I may better choose my slowly-coming new city sites. I see no horses, but I haven't explored any.
The worker roads the cow after irrigating then moves to mine a fur. London finishes settler, starts on Colossus as the German spear is walking around my lands (around? what happend to Emperor RoP?) and the other reappears from the fog to follow. I originally wanted the settler to go E along the river, but now I send him S along the river to say hi to the friendly (I hope) spear and not settle towards Germany.
I make #4 on the Most Advanced Nations list. Sumerians are surprisingly in 7th--they're usually tech runaways.
I brazenly walk the settler right next to the exploring spear on his way down to scout the city site. What would you do? In 2800 BC found York 3S,1E of London on the river and coast next to 2 BG and it's sort of a canal city, and after settling the border shows I'll have a wheat after expansion. I'm thinking long-term and want loose spacing for my core/main island cities because I want large cities making lots of commerce for the space race and parts building. By the way, I found this town while a German spear is right next to my settler/town. I have no military. Set production to settler--just kidding, I start on a warrior.
On the same turn as founding York I see Bismarck researched CB. I can't comfortably afford WC so I buy CB for Pottery and 26g. He would've demanded my tech and money anyway, and I actually like temples. Plus trade is good for relations.
A strategy for taking the island occurs to me: I thought the AA despot GA would be mostly a waste, but I realize I can use it to build rax and military in both towns. I'll use the GA income to buy WC on a gpt deal and then archer rush him as soon as the GA and deal are over.
After founding York both German spears seem to turn around and head home! He's being suspiciously timid, but next turn I realize only one spear reversed and the other decided to explore W instead of S of me. I still find it odd that he is being so respectful of my territorial borders. This is Emperor level and I have no military, right? What am I doing alive?
Worker again moves without roading to mine the other grass fur. Roading with river/fur bonus would lose the commerce in depotism, anyway, at least before GA/Colossus. After that it would be worthwhile to road it for the commerce, but now I'm racing for Colossus, GA and the ensuing military buildup. Bismarck gets a 3rd city somewhere. Mil advisor: "We could support a larger military." Oh really? More than the one worker I currently have?
York completes the first warrior in 5 turns, and I start a worker. Crazy? You bet. But I change my mind before it completes because I don't want the gpt deal with Bismarck to end while I have an undefended city, so I build the second warrior and have both cities MP'ed and minimally defended when the gpt deal expires. Not for real defense, but to take down the "please invade me" signs. The first warrior goes straight to London to fortify, and the second will stay in York and fortify; neither explore. By the way, I've been checking F3 for reports of barb camps, but none have been reported and no barbs seen.
Worker finally starts his second road--this one will connect furs and start the road towards York. I wonder if I'll regret one or both roads--I will if I miss Colossus as I have a citizen or two working unimproved BGs.
In 2390 BC the second warrior completes and York starts a worker. I never have enough workers and I'm already behind on tiles. I'm #1 in pop, GNP, Mfg goods and Productivity but #8 in Annual income. Go figure.
Worker moves to road a BG--Colossus is almost done and a mine would be wasted in GA while the road won't. London grows to size 7. York completes worker and starts barracks. Bismarck discovers Iron Working and hooks up silks.
In 2070 BC the Colossus completes and the GA has begun. I immediately buy WC from Germany for 51g and 12gpt. I'll get it back as he can't spend it in despotism and I've been watching his money--it's increasing only as I pay him so he doesn't seem to know anyone else. (No big buys or sells except for me.) Both cities are on rax and will build archers after. At first London can do 2-turn archers but later at pop 8 can be MM'ed to 20spt for an archer per turn while tiny mostly-unimproved York is on 4-turn archers.
I wonder about why that exploring spear hasn't come back through and wonder if my island is bigger than I thought, but that very IT the spear comes back into view. He's still reg and full health so I assume he didn't meet any barbs, and by watching Bismarck's tech and money I'm pretty sure he didn't meet anyone that way.
London is #1 in the top 5 cities. I'm not used to having a city at #1, especially this early on Emperor. In the Largest Nations of the World report I'm naturally #8 but Germany is #7...at first I think good because he isn't too big, then I think maybe we have a crappy island.
During the GA archer buildup I note that Bismarck has 3 extra silks hooked up and later horses which worries me a tad. I don't have IW or writing so I have no way of knowing if he has iron. He eventually has 6 cities before our deal runs out including Munich which he founded and encroached on London's borders even taking one of its workable tiles. He started the Pyramids during my GA and built at least one culture building because I wasn't gaining culture on him after Colossus. That's good news because he's wasting tons of shields on temples and Pyramids instead of building horsemen and/or swords and/or other military.
Over halfway through the GA I was average militarily to him and got bolder by running research defecits and sending scout archers into his territory to annoy him and get booted. I also sent my two reg warriors to explore to the West and South. I didn't plan on breaking our gpt deal even though I assume I'd wipe him off the planet before he contacted anyone, but at that point I wasn't going to accept demands, either. Oddly enough he has yet to make any demands. Usually on Emperor I'm constatly getting demands for tribute.
Near the end of the GA I finish Writing and start CoL. Trade Writing to Bismarck for IW and 9g, and I can finally see if he has iron hooked up--he doesn't.
And I see iron nowhere on the island or anywhere else I can see, although I haven't explored much into his territory.
As the GA ends in 1450 BC I'm worried about support and happiness costs because I have 17 archers (vet), 2 warriors (reg) and 2 workers and only 2 cities in despotism, but I magage with min reasearch and a couple of clowns. Bismarck is the master of bad timing as he wasted the shields towards temples and pyramids and to add insult to injury leaves an archer/settler pair at our border right by my 14-stack of invasion archers as the GA and our deal ends.
By the way, York switched to work on a settler a couple of turns before the end of the GA.
I demand Munich, and he refuses so I declare war. It takes two archers to net my first 2 slaves, then the remaining split into two groups of 6: one group towards Munich and one towards Berlin.
Munich falls getting autorazed killing 2 of his and one of mine. Berlin falls killing two of his and 4 of mine. I killed a leader stepping into Berlin and got a slave. I keep Berlin; it takes 2 turns to quell 2 resisters. It started as pop 3 but starved to 2 during resistance. I set production to wealth figuring it will flip and I'll lose production and take it back.
An archer that earlier got booted to the NE part of Germany's lands sneaks in and disconnects his horses outside Leipzig.
London switches to curragh production because it's at 15spt and I think Bismarck is already crippled. By the way, my war plan is to beat him until I can get all his cities, gold and tech for peace then finish him 20 turns later. Workers continue to improve tiles while slaves mainly build roads to connect Berlin and London. Troops heal, kill off pesters and regroup while London builds 2 curraghs and starts a temple because I think I have enough archers for a while. First curragh's job is to map theGerman soon-to-be-English coastline while the second curragh goes to check out the isle to the West.
Germany wants peace but won't give up the empire, plus his palace jumped to Leipzig which has the horse and silks, and we I wants it my precious.
Settler completes in York and starts on an archer but I change my mind the next turn and put York back on Settler. Settler will go on coast and river East from London.
Send 3 archers, one at 3/4 to attack Frankfurt (SW of Berlin and N of London) but lose one to an archer. Decide to press my luck and kill another of my archers attacking. Retreat the last archer to await reinforcements. When reinforcements arrive a stack of 7 approaches Frankfurt and autoraze it winning 2-0. The other 5 head immediately back and dispatch a couple of pesters.
The same turn as razing Frankfurt I found Woolmer Green N of the river by the whale, and it's already roaded up. Set production to granary as I want these three river/coast cities to be big and commercey and shieldey and the war is nearly over I hope.
One of the two curraghs somewhere meets another civ, but I don't trade...wait to get Bismarck's stuff first. I think he's up two techs now. Lose an archer, kill an archer with pesters, moving remaining archers to Leipzig which is on a hill with reg spears.
Bismarck will now give me everything he has (cities, gold, tech, worker), but he can't give me his capital Leipzig which is what I want for the horse and silks. There is another horse at the western point but I'm not over there yet, and this on will be hooked up immediately and deny them to his remaining city after I sack Leipzig.
I finish CoL and start Philosophy. I start to wonder if it took too long to get here after spending a lot of Writing on minimum research due to troop buildup and unit support.
York finishes settler and starts on temple. The settler will head west and settle near the cow...I'm not sure where yet, but I like the spot on the hill even though there are early problems with that. I'll be able to irrigate the western peninsula before electricity if I settle on the hill.
Just before the battle for Leipzig the Dutch build The Great Lighthouse. Yikes I'm behind and I missed at least one of my goals. I really fear for the Republic slingshot, too.
In the battle for Leipzig I am impatient and send in some wounded archers in the 7-stack. I kill one defender and lose 6 archers promoting both remaining spears to elite but redlining them. Wouldn't be surprised if there's a leader in Leipzig, too. I got stubborn and stupid sending a 2/4 archer after a 4/4 fortified spear on a hill (FSoH) and a 2/5 archer after a 3/5 FSoH, but at the time I thought he was the last defender.
At that point my offensive force was gassed as I had started on exploration, infra and expansion back home, and Leipzig will have 2 healthy elite FSoH's plus new military by the time I can get attackers back there. He'll still give me everything he owns even though I think I just halved my military strength in one turn.
I wanted Leipzig too much, and I pretty much know I need to make peace as the other AIs are probably done expanding by now and will grow pop and commerce and I need to keep up. It's 4am in real life so I sleep on it. The next morning I realize that it was stupid to try for Leipzig with few/hurt archers not only because it's on a hill but because it's already connected by road to my captial and I could have forced peace and then traded to get the silk and take Leipzig after the peace deal was up.
Current Situation and Future Strategy
It's 1050 BC in the game. I haven't returned to it to make peace yet. The next big episode is whether or not I get the Republic slingshot and whether any cities flip back to Bismarck during peace. I don't think they will because I'll have more culture, but I'm not sure...I may finally try out one of those flip calculators and see what the odds are. I'm worried that I may be falling behind, but owning my own island (well, with one "visitor") and the isolation should let my human advantage catch up, especially since I have a killer pop 9 city in London and two more cities ready to grow that big in fairly short order. I think I'll build workers with ex-German cities for a while using them to improve lands then join workers into cities. I'm planning on big cities for this game.
Besides killing off Bismarck when I get the chance I'm going into explore and build mode and try to outpace the AI in research. I have in mind using galleys and later Mans-of-War (Men-of-War? Man-of-Wars?) to keep warring AI off my lands and have minimal troops on my island. I'm not sure this will work with the Dutch having the GLH, and I'm wary of the amphibious-attack Berserker, so plans may change. As for killing off Bismarck I may have to wait until I get catapults as I can't get any over-2-attacker until Invention or get iron and he's got 2 elite spears on a hill city.
I never saw a horse from Bismarck. I doubt he'll build one now with just one city, but I hope he does 'cause it's a waste of shields for him with 1-defense and my desire for Leipzig.
I have seen no iron so far, but given my plans I may not need any until Steam Power.
I have 4 cities, 2 workers, 3 slaves, 2 warriros, around 2-4 archers and about 11 population. I know BW, Pottery, Wheel, CB, Writing and CoL. By the QSC 1000BC in a couple of turns I'll have 2 or 3 more cities and pop points (2 from Bismarck and a settler's going to settler soon), Masonry and Mysticism and another slave. I've been figuring it'll be a bad QSC score but I'm not sure..I did a lot of builds and wonder how many others have Bismarck neutered already. (I haven't read spoilers yet...I want to but may not because I expect others have met civs I haven't met yet.) I've met Germany and another civ but won't say who in this spoiler.
Mods: NoAIpatrol=0, smiley popHeads, CivAssist
Strategy
I guessed/gambled that I'd have the island to myself with not even barbs on the isle, so I decided to go for Colossus, Republic slingshot and GLH en route to a space launch. To get all three I'd have to outproduce and/or outresearch my Emperor AI opponents in the early AA which I've done before but you have to sacrifice rapid expansion and instead have rapid growth in the captial pulling in commerce while the AI is walking its food and shields (settlers) around the map in an effort to expand. My initial build specs were granary, settler, Colossus.
In solo games I don't usually peek at my opponents, but in *OTM I know a lot of others do, so I do this time and note the Vikings with amphibious attack in early MA and three scientific civs that will start with the Colossus-enabling BW--but not necessarily on a coast, I told myself. I also noted the count three seafaring civs.
I'm going to start completely differently than I usually do. I usually don't build wonders, do explore early and fast and always road tiles before my worker leaves them. My plans negate the first two and I wind up stepping my worker off of a lot of unroaded tiles in a rush for early shield production.
The Game
I settled on the spot and sent the worker S to chop the fur forest. Production to granary, research at max to BW. Worker chops NE forest next (no improving the other tile first). As the 2nd chop completes the borders expand and I can see a blue border 1 tile away from mine to the N/NE--looks like Germany's color. They're on my island I can barely tell through fog gazing. I'm pretty sure they're an aggressive civ. I have no contact and see no troops so I decide to finish the granary and then reasses the plan. Worker moves to cow to irrigate.
The granary completes, and I still have no German contact and have seen no troops. I haven't explored at all obviously since I only have a worker who's busy. I decide to build the settler as planned instead of military and live life dangerously. (And hope that Germany doesn't find me soon.)
Three turns later a german spear appears between our borders but is more than 2 turns away because of the sea--I complete BW early that turn, I suppose because contact with Germany lowered the tech cost since he knows it. The settler is 3 turns away, and I have no military. I decide to continue the plan and be his b____ (um, buddy, that is...yeah, that's the ticket) to keep him from killing me off.
I'm up Alpha and Pottery and he's up WC. Of course he's annoyed. I need to trade with him to keep his attidude up with me, but I can't make a halfway decent deal and decide to wait a turn or two and see if he comes up with something new.
Start research on Writing starting at minimum; I research as fast as I can without running a deficit, so the research speed varies over time based on income and expenses. I avoid losing gold per turn because I'm expecting Bismarck to demand all my money away and I don't want to lose the granary.
The next turn his northern spear goes back north, but another spear appears at my Eastern border! Yikes, I thought I had a couple more turns! He also learned The Wheel since last turn. I can't get Wheel and WC for everything I've got so I buy The Wheel and 3g for Alpha and 2gpt. You may think I'm crazy for not buying the archer tech and panic-building military, but I'm not going to survive a war with him right now so I'm counting on the facts that he's still in the exploration/expansion phase and that I'm paying him gpt and that I'll give him whatever he demands to keep me alive (I still have Pottery to demand and some gold), and the Wheel shows me where horses are so I may better choose my slowly-coming new city sites. I see no horses, but I haven't explored any.
The worker roads the cow after irrigating then moves to mine a fur. London finishes settler, starts on Colossus as the German spear is walking around my lands (around? what happend to Emperor RoP?) and the other reappears from the fog to follow. I originally wanted the settler to go E along the river, but now I send him S along the river to say hi to the friendly (I hope) spear and not settle towards Germany.
I make #4 on the Most Advanced Nations list. Sumerians are surprisingly in 7th--they're usually tech runaways.
I brazenly walk the settler right next to the exploring spear on his way down to scout the city site. What would you do? In 2800 BC found York 3S,1E of London on the river and coast next to 2 BG and it's sort of a canal city, and after settling the border shows I'll have a wheat after expansion. I'm thinking long-term and want loose spacing for my core/main island cities because I want large cities making lots of commerce for the space race and parts building. By the way, I found this town while a German spear is right next to my settler/town. I have no military. Set production to settler--just kidding, I start on a warrior.
On the same turn as founding York I see Bismarck researched CB. I can't comfortably afford WC so I buy CB for Pottery and 26g. He would've demanded my tech and money anyway, and I actually like temples. Plus trade is good for relations.
A strategy for taking the island occurs to me: I thought the AA despot GA would be mostly a waste, but I realize I can use it to build rax and military in both towns. I'll use the GA income to buy WC on a gpt deal and then archer rush him as soon as the GA and deal are over.
After founding York both German spears seem to turn around and head home! He's being suspiciously timid, but next turn I realize only one spear reversed and the other decided to explore W instead of S of me. I still find it odd that he is being so respectful of my territorial borders. This is Emperor level and I have no military, right? What am I doing alive?
Worker again moves without roading to mine the other grass fur. Roading with river/fur bonus would lose the commerce in depotism, anyway, at least before GA/Colossus. After that it would be worthwhile to road it for the commerce, but now I'm racing for Colossus, GA and the ensuing military buildup. Bismarck gets a 3rd city somewhere. Mil advisor: "We could support a larger military." Oh really? More than the one worker I currently have?
York completes the first warrior in 5 turns, and I start a worker. Crazy? You bet. But I change my mind before it completes because I don't want the gpt deal with Bismarck to end while I have an undefended city, so I build the second warrior and have both cities MP'ed and minimally defended when the gpt deal expires. Not for real defense, but to take down the "please invade me" signs. The first warrior goes straight to London to fortify, and the second will stay in York and fortify; neither explore. By the way, I've been checking F3 for reports of barb camps, but none have been reported and no barbs seen.
Worker finally starts his second road--this one will connect furs and start the road towards York. I wonder if I'll regret one or both roads--I will if I miss Colossus as I have a citizen or two working unimproved BGs.
In 2390 BC the second warrior completes and York starts a worker. I never have enough workers and I'm already behind on tiles. I'm #1 in pop, GNP, Mfg goods and Productivity but #8 in Annual income. Go figure.
Worker moves to road a BG--Colossus is almost done and a mine would be wasted in GA while the road won't. London grows to size 7. York completes worker and starts barracks. Bismarck discovers Iron Working and hooks up silks.
In 2070 BC the Colossus completes and the GA has begun. I immediately buy WC from Germany for 51g and 12gpt. I'll get it back as he can't spend it in despotism and I've been watching his money--it's increasing only as I pay him so he doesn't seem to know anyone else. (No big buys or sells except for me.) Both cities are on rax and will build archers after. At first London can do 2-turn archers but later at pop 8 can be MM'ed to 20spt for an archer per turn while tiny mostly-unimproved York is on 4-turn archers.
I wonder about why that exploring spear hasn't come back through and wonder if my island is bigger than I thought, but that very IT the spear comes back into view. He's still reg and full health so I assume he didn't meet any barbs, and by watching Bismarck's tech and money I'm pretty sure he didn't meet anyone that way.
London is #1 in the top 5 cities. I'm not used to having a city at #1, especially this early on Emperor. In the Largest Nations of the World report I'm naturally #8 but Germany is #7...at first I think good because he isn't too big, then I think maybe we have a crappy island.
During the GA archer buildup I note that Bismarck has 3 extra silks hooked up and later horses which worries me a tad. I don't have IW or writing so I have no way of knowing if he has iron. He eventually has 6 cities before our deal runs out including Munich which he founded and encroached on London's borders even taking one of its workable tiles. He started the Pyramids during my GA and built at least one culture building because I wasn't gaining culture on him after Colossus. That's good news because he's wasting tons of shields on temples and Pyramids instead of building horsemen and/or swords and/or other military.
Over halfway through the GA I was average militarily to him and got bolder by running research defecits and sending scout archers into his territory to annoy him and get booted. I also sent my two reg warriors to explore to the West and South. I didn't plan on breaking our gpt deal even though I assume I'd wipe him off the planet before he contacted anyone, but at that point I wasn't going to accept demands, either. Oddly enough he has yet to make any demands. Usually on Emperor I'm constatly getting demands for tribute.
Near the end of the GA I finish Writing and start CoL. Trade Writing to Bismarck for IW and 9g, and I can finally see if he has iron hooked up--he doesn't.
And I see iron nowhere on the island or anywhere else I can see, although I haven't explored much into his territory.As the GA ends in 1450 BC I'm worried about support and happiness costs because I have 17 archers (vet), 2 warriors (reg) and 2 workers and only 2 cities in despotism, but I magage with min reasearch and a couple of clowns. Bismarck is the master of bad timing as he wasted the shields towards temples and pyramids and to add insult to injury leaves an archer/settler pair at our border right by my 14-stack of invasion archers as the GA and our deal ends.
By the way, York switched to work on a settler a couple of turns before the end of the GA.
I demand Munich, and he refuses so I declare war. It takes two archers to net my first 2 slaves, then the remaining split into two groups of 6: one group towards Munich and one towards Berlin.
Munich falls getting autorazed killing 2 of his and one of mine. Berlin falls killing two of his and 4 of mine. I killed a leader stepping into Berlin and got a slave. I keep Berlin; it takes 2 turns to quell 2 resisters. It started as pop 3 but starved to 2 during resistance. I set production to wealth figuring it will flip and I'll lose production and take it back.
An archer that earlier got booted to the NE part of Germany's lands sneaks in and disconnects his horses outside Leipzig.
London switches to curragh production because it's at 15spt and I think Bismarck is already crippled. By the way, my war plan is to beat him until I can get all his cities, gold and tech for peace then finish him 20 turns later. Workers continue to improve tiles while slaves mainly build roads to connect Berlin and London. Troops heal, kill off pesters and regroup while London builds 2 curraghs and starts a temple because I think I have enough archers for a while. First curragh's job is to map the
Germany wants peace but won't give up the empire, plus his palace jumped to Leipzig which has the horse and silks, and we I wants it my precious.
Settler completes in York and starts on an archer but I change my mind the next turn and put York back on Settler. Settler will go on coast and river East from London.
Send 3 archers, one at 3/4 to attack Frankfurt (SW of Berlin and N of London) but lose one to an archer. Decide to press my luck and kill another of my archers attacking. Retreat the last archer to await reinforcements. When reinforcements arrive a stack of 7 approaches Frankfurt and autoraze it winning 2-0. The other 5 head immediately back and dispatch a couple of pesters.
The same turn as razing Frankfurt I found Woolmer Green N of the river by the whale, and it's already roaded up. Set production to granary as I want these three river/coast cities to be big and commercey and shieldey and the war is nearly over I hope.
One of the two curraghs somewhere meets another civ, but I don't trade...wait to get Bismarck's stuff first. I think he's up two techs now. Lose an archer, kill an archer with pesters, moving remaining archers to Leipzig which is on a hill with reg spears.
Bismarck will now give me everything he has (cities, gold, tech, worker), but he can't give me his capital Leipzig which is what I want for the horse and silks. There is another horse at the western point but I'm not over there yet, and this on will be hooked up immediately and deny them to his remaining city after I sack Leipzig.
I finish CoL and start Philosophy. I start to wonder if it took too long to get here after spending a lot of Writing on minimum research due to troop buildup and unit support.
York finishes settler and starts on temple. The settler will head west and settle near the cow...I'm not sure where yet, but I like the spot on the hill even though there are early problems with that. I'll be able to irrigate the western peninsula before electricity if I settle on the hill.
Just before the battle for Leipzig the Dutch build The Great Lighthouse. Yikes I'm behind and I missed at least one of my goals. I really fear for the Republic slingshot, too.
In the battle for Leipzig I am impatient and send in some wounded archers in the 7-stack. I kill one defender and lose 6 archers promoting both remaining spears to elite but redlining them. Wouldn't be surprised if there's a leader in Leipzig, too. I got stubborn and stupid sending a 2/4 archer after a 4/4 fortified spear on a hill (FSoH) and a 2/5 archer after a 3/5 FSoH, but at the time I thought he was the last defender.
At that point my offensive force was gassed as I had started on exploration, infra and expansion back home, and Leipzig will have 2 healthy elite FSoH's plus new military by the time I can get attackers back there. He'll still give me everything he owns even though I think I just halved my military strength in one turn.
I wanted Leipzig too much, and I pretty much know I need to make peace as the other AIs are probably done expanding by now and will grow pop and commerce and I need to keep up. It's 4am in real life so I sleep on it. The next morning I realize that it was stupid to try for Leipzig with few/hurt archers not only because it's on a hill but because it's already connected by road to my captial and I could have forced peace and then traded to get the silk and take Leipzig after the peace deal was up.
Current Situation and Future Strategy
It's 1050 BC in the game. I haven't returned to it to make peace yet. The next big episode is whether or not I get the Republic slingshot and whether any cities flip back to Bismarck during peace. I don't think they will because I'll have more culture, but I'm not sure...I may finally try out one of those flip calculators and see what the odds are. I'm worried that I may be falling behind, but owning my own island (well, with one "visitor") and the isolation should let my human advantage catch up, especially since I have a killer pop 9 city in London and two more cities ready to grow that big in fairly short order. I think I'll build workers with ex-German cities for a while using them to improve lands then join workers into cities. I'm planning on big cities for this game.
Besides killing off Bismarck when I get the chance I'm going into explore and build mode and try to outpace the AI in research. I have in mind using galleys and later Mans-of-War (Men-of-War? Man-of-Wars?) to keep warring AI off my lands and have minimal troops on my island. I'm not sure this will work with the Dutch having the GLH, and I'm wary of the amphibious-attack Berserker, so plans may change. As for killing off Bismarck I may have to wait until I get catapults as I can't get any over-2-attacker until Invention or get iron and he's got 2 elite spears on a hill city.
I never saw a horse from Bismarck. I doubt he'll build one now with just one city, but I hope he does 'cause it's a waste of shields for him with 1-defense and my desire for Leipzig.
I have seen no iron so far, but given my plans I may not need any until Steam Power.
I have 4 cities, 2 workers, 3 slaves, 2 warriros, around 2-4 archers and about 11 population. I know BW, Pottery, Wheel, CB, Writing and CoL. By the QSC 1000BC in a couple of turns I'll have 2 or 3 more cities and pop points (2 from Bismarck and a settler's going to settler soon), Masonry and Mysticism and another slave. I've been figuring it'll be a bad QSC score but I'm not sure..I did a lot of builds and wonder how many others have Bismarck neutered already. (I haven't read spoilers yet...I want to but may not because I expect others have met civs I haven't met yet.) I've met Germany and another civ but won't say who in this spoiler.
IroquoisPlisken
Brigadier Idiot
Open - This is my first COTM, so I didn't think of taking notes. This is all from memory.
I started off with a warrior who I sent exploring I believe north towards Germany and met them like the 2nd or 3rd turn. I don't believe I traded anything, since I wanted to hold onto Alphabet for as long as possible (Spain ended up beating me to Philo by just 5 turns, though
). Next was a curragh who I sent West.
My exploring warrior trespassed Germany's borders a couple times while exploring in the north. Bismarck sent 2 spears through my territory, one into the southern peninsula, one west, then when they came back, they crossed through my borders again.
Most of the time I was weak to Germany. Recently I became average, and he had 2 settlers along with a warrior and a spear in my terrritory (he already sent one that claimed the horses to the far west of the island), so I decided to tell him to leave. He declared.
It's 1250 now, and I've destroyed Munich (the city on the horses) and captured Konigsberg. I'm planning on capturing Leipzig (silks) and either making peace or continuing on to Berlin.
It seems like I did everything that SHOULD have made him declare on me, but he didn't.
I started off with a warrior who I sent exploring I believe north towards Germany and met them like the 2nd or 3rd turn. I don't believe I traded anything, since I wanted to hold onto Alphabet for as long as possible (Spain ended up beating me to Philo by just 5 turns, though
). Next was a curragh who I sent West.My exploring warrior trespassed Germany's borders a couple times while exploring in the north. Bismarck sent 2 spears through my territory, one into the southern peninsula, one west, then when they came back, they crossed through my borders again.
Most of the time I was weak to Germany. Recently I became average, and he had 2 settlers along with a warrior and a spear in my terrritory (he already sent one that claimed the horses to the far west of the island), so I decided to tell him to leave. He declared.
It's 1250 now, and I've destroyed Munich (the city on the horses) and captured Konigsberg. I'm planning on capturing Leipzig (silks) and either making peace or continuing on to Berlin.
It seems like I did everything that SHOULD have made him declare on me, but he didn't.
First post to these boards, first GOTM, first game at Emperor and only had Conquests about a week and a half...
But I've played Monarch on Classic for years and years. 100% of my wins have been score, dipl or space. However there were some tactics I never knew about, and some rules that had escaped me. Like I never knew that fresh water was what let towns get to 12 pop -- I just knew that some did and some didn't...
I also really don't understand the tech slingshot tactic, though I think I am getting there. I'll do some more research on this site.
Initial builds for my original run at this game: 3 warriors, settler, curragh,
Researched Ceremonial Burial followed by the Advisor's call (no attempt at slingshot)
Spotted Otto spearman after 1st cultural expansion and traded all three of my techs for Bronze and Warrior Code. (Maybe one advantage of not going for slingshot?)
Founded York on far N grassland on my side of the gap and then managed to plug the gap after dancing with Otto settler and archer. I did let Otto spear wander free in my lands while I built up, but caught him north of the gap too.
Meanwhile curragh finds Spain, France and one of the iron spots in the Barbarian Sea. I was a little late in mapmaking (disadvantage of not going slingshot?) but did get two towns on Iron Island and two on Gem Island.
Managed to hold off Otto until just before the horses were hooked up, when he declared. Proceeded to take all his cities on the starting island, the little one to the east and the larger one to the east. Settled for Monarchy and Lit and left Otto with 3 cities on sugar island and one on the spec to the south.
However the war, the lack of any Wonders, the slow tech progression, too long at Despotism and late entrance to middle ages effectively put me out of the hunt for the win. But at least I finished ahead of Otto!
I've replayed it several times since and had varying degrees of success. Be nice to Otto early and build up your guard seems to be the best tactic.
Bog
(Edit: I love the map and the conditions, btw. I find the Barbarian Sea very entertaining.)
But I've played Monarch on Classic for years and years. 100% of my wins have been score, dipl or space. However there were some tactics I never knew about, and some rules that had escaped me. Like I never knew that fresh water was what let towns get to 12 pop -- I just knew that some did and some didn't...
I also really don't understand the tech slingshot tactic, though I think I am getting there. I'll do some more research on this site.Initial builds for my original run at this game: 3 warriors, settler, curragh,
Researched Ceremonial Burial followed by the Advisor's call (no attempt at slingshot)
Spotted Otto spearman after 1st cultural expansion and traded all three of my techs for Bronze and Warrior Code. (Maybe one advantage of not going for slingshot?)
Founded York on far N grassland on my side of the gap and then managed to plug the gap after dancing with Otto settler and archer. I did let Otto spear wander free in my lands while I built up, but caught him north of the gap too.
Meanwhile curragh finds Spain, France and one of the iron spots in the Barbarian Sea. I was a little late in mapmaking (disadvantage of not going slingshot?) but did get two towns on Iron Island and two on Gem Island.
Managed to hold off Otto until just before the horses were hooked up, when he declared. Proceeded to take all his cities on the starting island, the little one to the east and the larger one to the east. Settled for Monarchy and Lit and left Otto with 3 cities on sugar island and one on the spec to the south.
However the war, the lack of any Wonders, the slow tech progression, too long at Despotism and late entrance to middle ages effectively put me out of the hunt for the win. But at least I finished ahead of Otto!
I've replayed it several times since and had varying degrees of success. Be nice to Otto early and build up your guard seems to be the best tactic.
Bog
(Edit: I love the map and the conditions, btw. I find the Barbarian Sea very entertaining.)
JonathanValjean
Porschephile
Bognor said:
Bognor, it appears that a manifold welcome is in order then: welcome to CFC, your first GOTM, your first game at emperor level, and Conquests!
Predator, going for 20K, maybe (anything is still possible)
As announced in the pre-game thread, I built a second Worker asap.
Warrior first though, which found the Germans and quickly hurried home so as not to invite any misdoings on their part. I also kept a lead in tech so in case they got uppety I could give them something. However, they had mainly Spearmen and quickly fell behind because, as so often, the Germans did not improve their land (they still haven't connected their silks in 1500bc).
London was settled on the spot as this would yield a nice 40 shields at size 12 during GA and later with railroads. Our building order was:
4000bc London
3750bc Warrior
3600bc Worker
3450bc Curragh
3000bc Granary
2800bc Settler
2710bc Warrior
2550bc Settler
2230bc Temple
2150bc Settler
1525bc Colossus
This started our Golden Age, one turn after we became a Republic (3-turn revolution). 3 German Slaves and one Worker joined London to make it size 12 (I timed the capital to grow to size 8 when completing the Colossus), and now we are building the Pyramids in 10 turns.
Our initial curragh went west and kept following the coast, which simply never ended. It spotted plenty of barbarians on islands but met no barbarian ships. So, finally, this little curragh met everyone. I kept trade to a minimum though, as I am hoping to break the wonder cascade at some point. Probably in vain.
Later, a second curragh was sent out to find all coasts to prevent missing any trade routes. That one survived a barbarian galley attack.
Our other cities (I have 5 now) built primarily Workers. These improved all the terrain around London. In 1500bc I still have 8 as only 1 joined the capital. They are now busy irrigating bonus grasslands.
2750bc York - 3sw of London
2550bc Warrior
2430bc Worker
2270bc Worker
2110bc Worker
1725bc Settler
1500bc (building Settler)
2430bc Stonehenge - 4ne of London stealing the German cow
2190bc Worker
1990bc Worker
1790bc Warrior
1650bc Worker
1525bc Worker
1500bc (building Curragh)
2070bc Nottingham - se,e,e from London on the east coast (forest tile)
1950bc Curragh
1500bc (building Temple = prebuild for Library)
1675bc Hastings - sw end of the London river
1500bc (building Curragh)
1500bc
Technology
4000bc Alphabet (starting tech)
4000bc Pottery (starting tech)
3000bc The Wheel (Germany)
3000bc Bronze Working (Spain)
3000bc Ceremonial Burial (Spain)
3000bc Masonry (France)
3000bc Warrior Code (Germany)
2470bc Writing (research)
2150bc Iron Working (Germany)
2070bc Mysticism (Spain)
1830bc Code of Laws (research)
1625bc Philosophy (research)
1625bc The Republic (slingshot)
1500bc Mathematics (France)
The AI also have Horseback Riding, Map Making and Polytheism for which I can trade. We are researching Literature.
As announced in the pre-game thread, I built a second Worker asap.
Warrior first though, which found the Germans and quickly hurried home so as not to invite any misdoings on their part. I also kept a lead in tech so in case they got uppety I could give them something. However, they had mainly Spearmen and quickly fell behind because, as so often, the Germans did not improve their land (they still haven't connected their silks in 1500bc).
London was settled on the spot as this would yield a nice 40 shields at size 12 during GA and later with railroads. Our building order was:
4000bc London
3750bc Warrior
3600bc Worker
3450bc Curragh
3000bc Granary
2800bc Settler
2710bc Warrior
2550bc Settler
2230bc Temple
2150bc Settler
1525bc Colossus
This started our Golden Age, one turn after we became a Republic (3-turn revolution). 3 German Slaves and one Worker joined London to make it size 12 (I timed the capital to grow to size 8 when completing the Colossus), and now we are building the Pyramids in 10 turns.
Our initial curragh went west and kept following the coast, which simply never ended. It spotted plenty of barbarians on islands but met no barbarian ships. So, finally, this little curragh met everyone. I kept trade to a minimum though, as I am hoping to break the wonder cascade at some point. Probably in vain.
Later, a second curragh was sent out to find all coasts to prevent missing any trade routes. That one survived a barbarian galley attack.
Our other cities (I have 5 now) built primarily Workers. These improved all the terrain around London. In 1500bc I still have 8 as only 1 joined the capital. They are now busy irrigating bonus grasslands.
2750bc York - 3sw of London
2550bc Warrior
2430bc Worker
2270bc Worker
2110bc Worker
1725bc Settler
1500bc (building Settler)
2430bc Stonehenge - 4ne of London stealing the German cow
2190bc Worker
1990bc Worker
1790bc Warrior
1650bc Worker
1525bc Worker
1500bc (building Curragh)
2070bc Nottingham - se,e,e from London on the east coast (forest tile)
1950bc Curragh
1500bc (building Temple = prebuild for Library)
1675bc Hastings - sw end of the London river
1500bc (building Curragh)
Technology
4000bc Alphabet (starting tech)
4000bc Pottery (starting tech)
3000bc The Wheel (Germany)
3000bc Bronze Working (Spain)
3000bc Ceremonial Burial (Spain)
3000bc Masonry (France)
3000bc Warrior Code (Germany)
2470bc Writing (research)
2150bc Iron Working (Germany)
2070bc Mysticism (Spain)
1830bc Code of Laws (research)
1625bc Philosophy (research)
1625bc The Republic (slingshot)
1500bc Mathematics (France)
The AI also have Horseback Riding, Map Making and Polytheism for which I can trade. We are researching Literature.
Puppeteer
Emperor
I never saw barb galleys. I didn't explore as much as others, but I saw two or three barb islands with warriors but never saw a galley or horseman, and I'm pretty sure Bismarck has HBR and the Dutch built GLH so they have MM.
I keep trying to discern a pattern about Germany's aggressiveness. He spent time on wonders and temples while I was building up archers and he never built a horseman. He was even mostly respectful of my territory when I had no military. He never demanded anything. I half expected him to call me up just to offer some flowers he picked. I definitely had the kindler, gentler Bismarck. I wonder if having no military gives you a break over having a tiny military early in the game?
Or maybe his units go exploring in random directions and two archers near a vulnerable civ is too much temptation? Or maybe it's just totally random.
I keep trying to discern a pattern about Germany's aggressiveness. He spent time on wonders and temples while I was building up archers and he never built a horseman. He was even mostly respectful of my territory when I had no military. He never demanded anything. I half expected him to call me up just to offer some flowers he picked. I definitely had the kindler, gentler Bismarck. I wonder if having no military gives you a break over having a tiny military early in the game?
Or maybe his units go exploring in random directions and two archers near a vulnerable civ is too much temptation? Or maybe it's just totally random.
denyd
Emperor
I was somewhat aggressive in settling claiming both a German cow & a German silk and also spent time blocking Otto's attempts to get a settler to the SE peninsula that was available for settlement until post 1000 BC. My timeline for military was:
3800 BC - Warrior # 1
3700 BC - Spot blue border
3550 BC - Meet Germany and trade with him
3150 BC - Build Warrior # 2 & found City # 2 stealing German cow
2630 BC - Found city # 3
2510 BC - Another trade with Germany
2230 BC - First Vet Spearman built
1950 BC - Found city to steal German silks
1870 BC - Curragh survives attack by barbarian galley (first BG sighting)
1790 BC - Germany starts Colossus
1550 BC - 2nd and final spearman of QSC is completed - Germany connects horses
From about 1700 BC until about 1300 BC, I was blocking German settlers with workers & a warrior at the narrow point N of London and from 1200 BC until about 1050 BC, I had a warrior block at the narrow point SE of London. I would move the warrior from the spot and 2 German settler/spearman pairs would show up and begin marching to the spot and when they got 2 tiles away, I moved the warrior back and the started marching home. I did this three times until I had a couple of settlers plant cities down there to prevent the now visible German Galleys from getting there first.
At 1000 BC 2 Vet spears, 2 Reg warriors & 10 towns
When I finally went to war with Germany in 270 AD, I faced only archers & spearmen, even though Otto had horses available for nearly 2000 years.
3800 BC - Warrior # 1
3700 BC - Spot blue border
3550 BC - Meet Germany and trade with him
3150 BC - Build Warrior # 2 & found City # 2 stealing German cow
2630 BC - Found city # 3
2510 BC - Another trade with Germany
2230 BC - First Vet Spearman built
1950 BC - Found city to steal German silks
1870 BC - Curragh survives attack by barbarian galley (first BG sighting)
1790 BC - Germany starts Colossus
1550 BC - 2nd and final spearman of QSC is completed - Germany connects horses
From about 1700 BC until about 1300 BC, I was blocking German settlers with workers & a warrior at the narrow point N of London and from 1200 BC until about 1050 BC, I had a warrior block at the narrow point SE of London. I would move the warrior from the spot and 2 German settler/spearman pairs would show up and begin marching to the spot and when they got 2 tiles away, I moved the warrior back and the started marching home. I did this three times until I had a couple of settlers plant cities down there to prevent the now visible German Galleys from getting there first.
At 1000 BC 2 Vet spears, 2 Reg warriors & 10 towns
When I finally went to war with Germany in 270 AD, I faced only archers & spearmen, even though Otto had horses available for nearly 2000 years.
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