Goodie huts - winning the lotto

Bushface said:
there is little evidence of better yields from Scouts.
Click to expand...

I just checked the SDK files (CvPlayer.cpp, lines 4211-4251) and I can't see any reference to the unit type there. Line 4233 defines the goody you receive, and it seems only to depend on chance and the difficulty level.
 
Teg_Navanis said:
I just checked the SDK files (CvPlayer.cpp, lines 4211-4251) and I can't see any reference to the unit type there. Line 4233 defines the goody you receive, and it seems only to depend on chance and the difficulty level.
Click to expand...

This is because the only benefit scouts get is that they cannot get barbarians from a goody hut. Of course this means the probability of all the good results goes up.

The code calls the routine CvPlayer::canReceiveGoody on line 4238. This routine checks the validity of the goody on offer in several ways including checking some unit info. In particular, if the goody on offer is bad as defined in CIV4GoodyInfo.xml and the unit has the flag bNoBadGoodies as defined in CIV4UnitInfos.xml (by default either a scout or an explorer) then it returns false and a new goody gets chosen.

Code: 
if (GC.getGoodyInfo(eGoody).isBad())
{
   if ((pUnit == NULL) || pUnit->isNoBadGoodies())
   {
      return false;
   }
}
Interestingly if a scout/explorer rolls barbarians 10 times in a row it gives up and you get nothing.
 
mjs0 said:
Interestingly if a scout/explorer rolls barbarians 10 times in a row it gives up and you get nothing.
Click to expand...

That is very interesting to know, as now I know why in a couple of isolated situations I did not get anything from a goody hut.
 
I also tried an experiment with the huts lately, though I was not nearly as mathematically precise as Bushface.

What I tried doing was popping the hut with the same unit, but from different directions. I used a Scout, since the 2 moves meant I could try a different approach on the same turn.

What I found was: (1) this simple adjustment completely changed the result of the hut, and (2) the results were consistent, i.e., if I popped the hut from the North, reloaded, and did the same thing again, I got the same results. In addition, as I kept trying it, I found that (3) as the game progressed, later huts popped the same result regardless of approach direction. Early hut-pops had the most variation.

I don't know if this is very useful, but it was interesting. To take advantage of this knowledge, you would essentially have to cheat by saving the game, popping the hut, then reloading and entering from a different direction, even on a different turn, if you don't like the results. Given how long it takes to load a Civ IV game (not to mention my distaste for exploits like this--I'm so ashamed for discovering it), I'm disinclined to do that.

Unless I get one of those useless maps, of course... ;)
 
grangerm said:
What's up with huts providing you maps out 5 squares into the ocean, when they are supposed to be tribal villages. Tribal villages with optics and caravels?!
Click to expand...
They are very good swimmers. :lol:
 
Today I popped Metal Casting on an archipelago map, of course I had been researching it for almost 100 turns (marathon) and had only 3 left to go before I discovered it..

So not much cursing there then...:mad:
 
Bushface said:
Note that there were no barbarians, because in error I had turned them off, and no "health" because all my units were at full strength. But there is little evidence of better yields from Scouts.
Click to expand...

The only advantage you get from Scouts is immunity to barbarians from the huts. If you have barbs disabled, the only advantage scouts have is their 2 MP.

Beyond that:

Settler

Lots of gold : 20%
Some : 10%
Map : 5%
Settler : 10%
Warrior : 10%
Scout : 5%
Worker : 10%
Experience : 5%
Health : 5%
Technology : 20%

Chieftain

Lots of Gold : 20%
Some Gold : 10%
Map : 5%
Settler : 10%
Warrior : 10%
Scout : 5%
Worker : 10%
Experience : 5%
Health : 5%
Technology : 15%
Some barbarians: 5%

Warlord

Lots of Gold : 15%
Some Gold : 15%
Map : 10%
Settler : 5%
Warrior : 10%
Scout : 5%
Worker : 5%
Experience : 5%
Health : 5%
Technology : 15%
Some barbarians: 5%
Many barbarians: 5%

Noble

Lots of Gold : 15%
Some Gold : 20%
Map : 10%
Warrior : 10%
Scout : 5%
Experience : 10%
Health : 5%
Technology : 10%
Some barbarians: 10%
Many barbarians: 5%

Prince

Lots of Gold : 10%
Some Gold : 20%
Map : 10%
Warrior : 10%
Scout : 5%
Experience : 10%
Health : 5%
Technology : 10%
Some barbarians: 15%
Many barbarians: 5%

Monarch

Lots of Gold : 5%
Some Gold : 20%
Map : 10%
Warrior : 10%
Scout : 5%
Experience : 10%
Health : 5%
Technology : 10%
Some barbarians: 15%
Many barbarians: 10%

Emperor

Lots of Gold : 5%
Some Gold : 25%
Map : 10%
Warrior : 5%
Scout : 5%
Experience : 5%
Health : 5%
Technology : 10%
Some barbarians: 15%
Many barbarians: 15%

Immortal

Some Gold : 25%
Map : 10%
Warrior : 5%
Scout : 5%
Experience : 5%
Health : 5%
Technology : 10%
Some barbarians: 15%
Many barbarians: 20%

Deity

Some Gold : 25%
Map : 5%
Warrior : 5%
Scout : 5%
Experience : 5%
Health : 5%
Technology : 10%
Some barbarians: 10%
Many barbarians: 30%
 
grangerm said:
What's up with huts providing you maps out 5 squares into the ocean, when they are supposed to be tribal villages. Tribal villages with optics and caravels?!
Click to expand...

What about them giving you techs

These small barbarian tribes being more advanced than you... :lol:
 
Does anybody know if "hostile villagers" will show up in the first few rounds when the city culture area expand and pops the goodie hut next door? It seems that I've never seen any hostile outcomes in so many games I've played.
 
The actual percentages are somewhat skewed from what is in the XML by the forced rerolls in CvPlayer::canReceiveGoody.

For example, you reroll in the following situations
You roll Barbarians and your unit is a scout/explorer (I think everyone knows this one!)
You roll Health and your unit is above 60% health
You roll Experience and your unit is a worker/settler/missionary OR the game has not yet reached turn 10
You roll Tech and you are not eligible to discover any of the techs on offer, maybe due to lack of prerequisites or having already researched them all
You roll Warrior and it is either a multiplayer game or a single player game that has not reached turn 20
You roll Barbarians and either have no cities or have 1 city and the hut is less than 8 tiles (where diagonal moves count as 1.5) from your city
You roll Settler and are playing with the OCC option on.

The big gotcha that I did not realise until looking through this code is that you cannot get a tech out of a goody hut before you found your first city (which I understand because at that point you are not able to do any research but it is a little strange)

In other words if you pop a hut before you build your first city the only things you can get on Noble and above are gold, local maps or a scout. (Or nothing if you roll other stuff 10 times in a row!)

Interestingly you can still get warriors and scouts from goody huts even when you can no longer build them.
 
gettingfat said:
Does anybody know if "hostile villagers" will show up in the first few rounds when the city culture area expand and pops the goodie hut next door? It seems that I've never seen any hostile outcomes in so many games I've played.
Click to expand...
You can never get barbarians from a hut that is popped by it coming within your cultural borders rather than by a unit.
 
I can hardly buy this odds. I just popped 4 scouts in a row in the last game (Monarch level). According to the table it should be only 5% chance to get a scout. The probability this happens should be 0.000625%. I've never won more than $10 buying any lottery ticket.

Unfortunately, this is an island map game. 5 scouts in total seem a bit too many.
 
gettingfat said:
I can hardly buy this odds. I just popped 4 scouts in a row in the last game (Monarch level). According to the table it should be only 5% chance to get a scout. The probability this happens should be 0.000625%. I've never won more than $10 buying any lottery ticket.

Unfortunately, this is an island map game. 5 scouts in total seem a bit too many.
Click to expand...

The odds you quote are about 1 in 160000 which seems pretty rare, but with over a million copies of Civ4 sold its going to happen to someone!
Of course, the actual odds really depend on the situation.
For example, if this were very early in the game and you are using healthy scouts then the odds drop to around 5 in 50 or 10% which equates to .01% or about 1 in 10000 for 4 in a row.
So while still rare given the number of games of Civ played worldwide in any one day it will still happen quite often.

Still, let me know if you feel like sharing your picks for the lottery this week...;)
 
mjs0 said:
The odds you quote are about 1 in 160000 which seems pretty rare, but with over a million copies of Civ4 sold its going to happen to someone!
Click to expand...

Actually the odds are 1 in 3200000 :p
 
Stylesjl said:
Actually the odds are 1 in 3200000 :p
Click to expand...

Hmm, I did (5/100)^4 giving 625/100000000 which is 1/160000

Is there something wrong with my logic? (wouldn't surprise me!)

edit:
Ah, got it the odds quoted were wrong, not mine, doh!
The probability is 0.000625, which is 0.0625%, not 0.000625% as quoted.
 
Mewtarthio said:
Prince

Lots of Gold : 10%
Some Gold : 20%
Map : 10%
Warrior : 10%
Scout : 5%
Experience : 10%
Health : 5%
Technology : 10%
Some barbarians: 15%
Many barbarians: 5%
Click to expand...
I mostly play prince so I am quoting that... About health... What happenes if you draw health and your unit is allready at 100%?

OK Reading on, 60% health you dont get health... SO I make sure to be above 60% when I pop a hut....

So if you are running around with a healthy (enough) scout the odds turn to...
Lots of Gold : 13,33%
Some Gold : 26,67%
Map : 13,33%
Warrior : 13,33%
Scout : 6,67%
Experience : 13,33%
Health : 0,00%
Technology : 13,33%
Some barbarians: 0,00%
Many barbarians: 0,00%
(on prince)
Only about 7 in a 100 pops a scout? Not my experience... I seem to pop scouts left and right... atleast 1 in 5... (or it simply feels that way)
 
namliaM said:
Only about 7 in a 100 pops a scout? Not my experience... I seem to pop scouts left and right... atleast 1 in 5... (or it simply feels that way)
Click to expand...
Don't forget that since a lot of huts are popped in the very early stages that also removes the warrior from the mix (for the first 20 turns).
I thought I popped a lot of scouts also until I actually paid attention to the number of times I was getting gold/maps, which tended to be ho-hum events for me and thus quickly dismissed.
 
I've gotten Physics from a hut before. It happened late in the game and it was on an island that no one bothered to discover.

Cool stuff.
 
The game I just finished, I got a scout first, so he went off exploring and got a worker. I then used the worker to explore as well, and so on... I found 4 workers like this and got so many huts because I walked half the continent on a huge Pangea! I ended up with 1 scout, 1 warrior, 4 workers, 2 settlers, 2 techs, 3 maps and a load of gold.

Got me off to an unbeatable start. I was so unbelievably far ahead of the AI in development.

I forgot to mention I was Gandhi, so the workers were awesome. Do you think the probability of getting them is affected by what leader you are?
 
mjs0 said:
I thought I popped a lot of scouts also until I actually paid attention to the number of times I was getting gold/maps, which tended to be ho-hum events for me and thus quickly dismissed.
Click to expand...
Maps I don't love either, but with the way economics works in Civ IV, I love getting gold early on. It allows me to run research at 100% for a lot longer than I otherwise could. So if you think about it, popping gold is roughly equivalent to popping a tech--probably more than one, but I'm not gonna do the math.
 
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