·Imhotep·
Legendary Builder
And I still want a boost for Hemah as I posted on the previous page 
FfH2 0.32 Balance Feedback
- Thread starter Grey Fox
- Start date
MagisterCultuum
Great Sage
In my version I'll probably give HEmah Barrage 1, and made the other barrage promotions available to arcane units (although they can't get the prereq), and also give him Divine so he can also cast OO (high) priest spells. (Actually, I split divine promotion up into divine 1 and 2, to avoid Amurite Archmage-High Priests, and am undecided as to whether I should give him only divine 1 or both).
Once I'm accustomed to event modding, I'll probably add some Hemah's Nightmare events.
I'll probably make Hastur's Razor a spell available to any unit with Mind III and the OO religion (both unit and religion). I'll add other religion specific non-divine spells too, at least one per religion.
I'm also removing Pillar of Fire from Chalid. He is strong enough with just Empyrean High Priest spells plus Law and Sun 1-3. Especially since I'm boosting the summons. Dragon's Breath Fire ability will work like Pillar of Fire in my version, and Pillar of Fire will probably be available to Seraphim, Brigit, Profanes, and/or Priors.
I'll probably make Gibbon Invisible. I may also change his name to Kael Colbane, and give him vampirism (The Kael character was an elven vampire. only the Calabim could actually use his vampirism now anyway, so its just for flavor)
I'm giving Sphener the Arma Justitiae equipment (the sword and shield of Junil that he used to kill the Svartalfar at the Twelve Pines), which provides Law affinity and a combat bonus versus the HN promotion (probably also versus the chaos, entropy, and death spell spheres after some one changes the schema to allow this). Sphenor will also have Law 1, and thus the ability to gain law 2 (Valor) and 3 (Einherjar). He can also fly
Mardero will have extension 1 (and maybe 2), Divine (1 and 2, allowing all AV high priest spells), fire1, entropy1, chaos1, cannibalism , and Flying. (Balors will also be able to cast ritualist spells, and will have both fire and entropy affinity)
Yvain will have Subdue Beasts, woodsman 1, 2, and 3 (if I add such a promotion), Forest Stealth (Ditto). I may let his bloom spell work over improvements, even if not an elven civ. He'll have all FoL high priests and druid spells. (Summon tiger will be replaced with a spell that summons a random animal)
Saverous will have Water Walking (no entering oceans, until Malevolent Designs) and maybe cannibalism.
Kithra will probably have subdue animal and Orc Slaying (I'm adding the anti-racial promotions back, but you can normally only get them through events)
All the mounted heroes will require horse/nightmare resources, so they can get the nightmare promotion.
Bambur (like most RoK units) will be able to carry a siege unit as cargo and to pass though peaks.
I probably won't boost Arthendain, but he will be able to heal like he is supposed to instead of having destroy undead (or maybe additionally). Like all archers, he will be able to attack from 1 tile away.
The Mithril Golem will have Mithril, Earth, and enchantment affinity, and 2 movement instead of 1. I'll probably replace the ability to summon earth elementals with the ability to cast earthquake.
Meshabber will have Fire and Entropy affinity, all Profane spells, and extension 1.
Once I'm accustomed to event modding, I'll probably add some Hemah's Nightmare events.
I'll probably make Hastur's Razor a spell available to any unit with Mind III and the OO religion (both unit and religion). I'll add other religion specific non-divine spells too, at least one per religion.
I'm also removing Pillar of Fire from Chalid. He is strong enough with just Empyrean High Priest spells plus Law and Sun 1-3. Especially since I'm boosting the summons. Dragon's Breath Fire ability will work like Pillar of Fire in my version, and Pillar of Fire will probably be available to Seraphim, Brigit, Profanes, and/or Priors.
I'll probably make Gibbon Invisible. I may also change his name to Kael Colbane, and give him vampirism (The Kael character was an elven vampire. only the Calabim could actually use his vampirism now anyway, so its just for flavor)
I'm giving Sphener the Arma Justitiae equipment (the sword and shield of Junil that he used to kill the Svartalfar at the Twelve Pines), which provides Law affinity and a combat bonus versus the HN promotion (probably also versus the chaos, entropy, and death spell spheres after some one changes the schema to allow this). Sphenor will also have Law 1, and thus the ability to gain law 2 (Valor) and 3 (Einherjar). He can also fly
Mardero will have extension 1 (and maybe 2), Divine (1 and 2, allowing all AV high priest spells), fire1, entropy1, chaos1, cannibalism , and Flying. (Balors will also be able to cast ritualist spells, and will have both fire and entropy affinity)
Yvain will have Subdue Beasts, woodsman 1, 2, and 3 (if I add such a promotion), Forest Stealth (Ditto). I may let his bloom spell work over improvements, even if not an elven civ. He'll have all FoL high priests and druid spells. (Summon tiger will be replaced with a spell that summons a random animal)
Saverous will have Water Walking (no entering oceans, until Malevolent Designs) and maybe cannibalism.
Kithra will probably have subdue animal and Orc Slaying (I'm adding the anti-racial promotions back, but you can normally only get them through events)
All the mounted heroes will require horse/nightmare resources, so they can get the nightmare promotion.
Bambur (like most RoK units) will be able to carry a siege unit as cargo and to pass though peaks.
I probably won't boost Arthendain, but he will be able to heal like he is supposed to instead of having destroy undead (or maybe additionally). Like all archers, he will be able to attack from 1 tile away.
The Mithril Golem will have Mithril, Earth, and enchantment affinity, and 2 movement instead of 1. I'll probably replace the ability to summon earth elementals with the ability to cast earthquake.
Meshabber will have Fire and Entropy affinity, all Profane spells, and extension 1.
City States is STILL overpowered.
I almost never use any other.
Fend for themself have no real disadvantage and cost almost(?) nothing. I use it even with good civs. It sould require neutral/evil and basic care should not be so mutch more expensive.
I almost never use any other.
Fend for themself have no real disadvantage and cost almost(?) nothing. I use it even with good civs. It sould require neutral/evil and basic care should not be so mutch more expensive.
Polycrates
Emperor
- Joined
- Dec 15, 2006
- Messages
- 1,288
Realistically, though, he can pretty easily do both. I'm not terribly opposed to giving him some alternate spell (though I do think he's by far the most powerful hero even without it), it's just that Mutate defeats the purpose of one of the cooler units in the game. There's no reason to build freaks instead of warriors or swordsmen if you can just mutate anyone you like right from the start, for the same price or cheaper.
I agree that freaks should cost 30h though. I'd actually like to see their art stolen for the balseraph swordsman, call it a Mutant or something.[/QUOTE]
But the Balseraph swordsmen already have such cool art as well!
Upgrade cost is done automatically, and it's something like (the difference in hammer costs between the units)+5. Anyway, the upgrade cost is 65 gold, much like upgrading a warrior, and that's a hefty sum of gold.
Avahz Darkwood
Emperor
I think building requirements should be removed from the basic military lines. This would help the AI without having to give them a cheat of their own (the option to remove AI building requirements). The lines that would not have to have building requirements would the the Basic Archer/Slinger Lines, Axe-men/Sword-men Lines, and the basic Horsemen Lines. Other more advance units would require them to be built. Units such as Horse Archers, Champions, etc. Set up the building so that if they are built they can grant 2 additional XP. So if AI one builds an Archer with an Archery Range they would get an additional 2 xp over AI two that did not. This is also more in line with history. The Native Americans learned Archery from hunting and surviving not from an official sanctioned building. Many of the Gaelic tribes leaned from practice not some expensive training yard, though the lack of official tactics is one reason the romans defeated them (granted this is WAY over simplifying this). As technology advanced each was required to adapt to learn new strategies or be left in the dust bin of history. As such as more advanced weapons were brought against them, they had to organize and become a more effective fighting force... So building requirements for champions, long-bowmen etc would IMNSHO be logical in a game sense.
MagisterCultuum
Great Sage
I wouldn't mind removing the building requirements from archers an maybe horsemen, but I'd leave them on axemen. The first unit in their line is the warrior (Yes, I know warriors can also upgrade to archers, and scouts to horsemen, but still. The Doviello need some advantage)
I still think all unit-enabling buildings should have other benefits too.
Edit: I think that I misread it the fist time, and agree with you more than I thought.
I still think all unit-enabling buildings should have other benefits too.
Edit: I think that I misread it the fist time, and agree with you more than I thought.
Avahz Darkwood
Emperor
MagisterCultuum
Great Sage
Could Barbarian World option be changes so that the cities are a little more spread out (i.e., not all restricted to the same landmass)? It doesn't seem fair that one player can be stuck facing so many more barbarians than other player, or (on the flip side) for a single player to get an early game advantage by capturing these cities.
I also still think that the Free promotions from buildings (Horselord, Guardsman, Sinister, Dexterous, ect.) should really either (a.) be applied also upon upgrading a unit in the city (radius) to a unit of the appropriate unitcombat, or (b.) be applied on Move, but only to units of your civ/team. (The later could make permanent alliances more fun.)
Is there really any reason to keep giving promotions from buildings with <bApplyFreePromotionOnMove>1 to rival units that move though the city anyway? Adding this one if statement in the SDK and changing this one boolean for the buildings might be the easiest solution.
I also still think that the Free promotions from buildings (Horselord, Guardsman, Sinister, Dexterous, ect.) should really either (a.) be applied also upon upgrading a unit in the city (radius) to a unit of the appropriate unitcombat, or (b.) be applied on Move, but only to units of your civ/team. (The later could make permanent alliances more fun.)
Is there really any reason to keep giving promotions from buildings with <bApplyFreePromotionOnMove>1 to rival units that move though the city anyway? Adding this one if statement in the SDK and changing this one boolean for the buildings might be the easiest solution.
I think the doviello need some kind of extra advantages anyway.
Clan of embers and the Arcos(sp?) from fall further are much better, and those aren't exactly top level civs themselves.
Maybe if they got a bit of a boost to their melee units (say +1 str, or shock free).
They take a big penalty and don't really get much for it over other civs.
MagisterCultuum
Great Sage
Well, I know I'm planning of giving their leaders a new Trait: Scavenger. The trait also grants the Scavenger promotion to melee units (I'm undecided about giving it to recon and mounted units too, but I might)
This will give units commerces/yields from units they kill. (Animals in general will provide a little food to nearby cities when killed, but more than usual for scavenger trait civs. The promotion will give gold, hammers, and maybe culture from defeating normal units as well)
In addition, the promotion will have a <PythonPostCombatWon> function that will give the unit the weapon promotion of the unit it defeated (if better than its current weapons)
(The second part will mean more when I give weapons promotions tech requirements. I might add building requirements too.)
This only works in conjunction with changes from xienwolf's xml modcomp and other changes I got Grey Fox to add to Broader Alignments.
Their palace will also grant free global xp.This is mostly to compensate for the fact that they can't build several buildings that I'm making grant free xp. I might limit this by unitcombat, when xienwolf gives me the ability
This will give units commerces/yields from units they kill. (Animals in general will provide a little food to nearby cities when killed, but more than usual for scavenger trait civs. The promotion will give gold, hammers, and maybe culture from defeating normal units as well)
In addition, the promotion will have a <PythonPostCombatWon> function that will give the unit the weapon promotion of the unit it defeated (if better than its current weapons)
(The second part will mean more when I give weapons promotions tech requirements. I might add building requirements too.)
This only works in conjunction with changes from xienwolf's xml modcomp and other changes I got Grey Fox to add to Broader Alignments.
Their palace will also grant free global xp.This is mostly to compensate for the fact that they can't build several buildings that I'm making grant free xp. I might limit this by unitcombat, when xienwolf gives me the ability
Zechnophobe
Strategy Lich
I kinda wouldn't mind a 'squelch' option that just removes posts by Magister, when he just goes off talking about his modmod. (For me personally, that is. They don't often add much to discussion, and I'd rather just stay on track in the thread).
jprc
My dog is smarter than me
Religion of Leaves, priests: they summon a permanent tiger, strength:4, speed:2.
It seems to be a bit too much at the beginning, then not enough later on... but always powerful in cities as it had cultural bonus with huge impact on the game!
I would rather prefer to summon a baby spider that start weak, but can grow stronger if it wins combats.
... or summon a wolf with Nature affinity
... or allow the summoned animal spell to grow/change with the priest and his level (which would also help for the Great Menagery, especially with desert lands)
example:
1-2: Wolf
3: Baby spider
4: Lion
5: Gorilla
6: Tiger
7: Bear
8: Spider
>=9: Elephant
It seems to be a bit too much at the beginning, then not enough later on... but always powerful in cities as it had cultural bonus with huge impact on the game!
I would rather prefer to summon a baby spider that start weak, but can grow stronger if it wins combats.
... or summon a wolf with Nature affinity
... or allow the summoned animal spell to grow/change with the priest and his level (which would also help for the Great Menagery, especially with desert lands)
example:
1-2: Wolf
3: Baby spider
4: Lion
5: Gorilla
6: Tiger
7: Bear
8: Spider
>=9: Elephant
Zechnophobe
Strategy Lich
Honestly, the FoL are pretty darn good. Also, the utility of the Tiger is rather surprising.
First of all, you can add it to carnivals, meaning +1 Happiness in most of your cities (Since it's pretty rare to capture tigers).
Secondly, it gets empowered promotions from the caster. This is a 'no duh' thing for the most part except for...
Thirdly, the Tiger gains experience and promotions like normal. Combined with empowered promotions, they vary quite largely in their actual strength.
Lastly: These are permanent Summons. Compare them, for example, to Skeletons. Their about 10 times stronger. They also let your priest have an effect on combat, while he's otherwise blooming about in your borders.
First of all, you can add it to carnivals, meaning +1 Happiness in most of your cities (Since it's pretty rare to capture tigers).
Secondly, it gets empowered promotions from the caster. This is a 'no duh' thing for the most part except for...
Thirdly, the Tiger gains experience and promotions like normal. Combined with empowered promotions, they vary quite largely in their actual strength.
Lastly: These are permanent Summons. Compare them, for example, to Skeletons. Their about 10 times stronger. They also let your priest have an effect on combat, while he's otherwise blooming about in your borders.
jprc
My dog is smarter than me
... forgot the +1 happiness
However, it is nice to have a bit of added strength: elves are not that strong especially with new setup for other civs
However, it is nice to have a bit of added strength: elves are not that strong especially with new setup for other civs
Ecofarm
Deity
It its current form, it is not a nerf. It is an exploit-level boost to power. Why?
Because illusion attacks that result in a withdrawl due to winning do not cost a movement point. Therefor, a blitzing Alazkan illusion can "prep" a kill not only for Alazkan himself - but for EVERY SINGLE assassin in your stack. I do not think this is intended, for Alazkan Illusion to provide for 20+ kills per turn if you have enough assassins in your stack; thus, I only bring enough assassins to get kills as he has moves - I don't exploit it (well, maybe a test or 2
. Yes, I posted this in bug thread several days ago.With the exploit (A_illusion attacks not costing movement) and a couple extra blitzing assassins... this is how it works...
Illusion preps 4-5 kills for Alaz.
Illusion preps 4 kills for blitzing assassin.
Illusion preps 4 kills for blitzing assassin 2.
Illusion preps 5 kills for the other 5 assassins (or 10, or 20!)
The attack order looks like this:
Illusion, Alazkan, Illusion, Alazkan, Illusion, Alazkan, Illusion, Alazkan, Illusion, Assassin, Illusion, Assassin, Illusion, Assassin, Illusion, Assassin, Illusion, Assassin, Illusion, Assassin, Illusion, Assassin, Illusion, Assassin, Illusion, Assassin... ad naus.
Even without that exploit:
Now, even after a successful attack by an illusion costs a movement (I assume the team intends it to)... I still like Alazkan Illusion more now. Alazkan never needs to hit something under 99.9%, because the illusion preps any target below those odds - and the illusion will no longer steal the xp. You see, before he used to get as much xp as Alazkan himself and WAY more than the 2-3 assassins I bring in my attack-group. My assassins (I bring 3-4, one for each of A_Illusion attacks, assuming he uses 1 or 2 to prep for Alaz himself - 1 more if I have haste) get all the xp. I actually get additional assassins with blitz because of his inability to get kills.
If I don't found Aerons with a hunter upgraded to assassin (is this intended to be possible), Alazkan Illusion makes sure I do real quick.
Add to all this the fact that they get the best palace mana in the game (in my humble opinion):
Shadow
Blur (immunity to first strikes), Shadow Walk (ignore defensive bonuses - this makes forest promos uber_powerful and home defense among ancients very easy), MISTFORMS
Nature
Treetop Defense (instant full fortify in forest for entire group), Poison Blade (+1 str all recon units), VITALIZE
Mind
Charm (best anti-AI spell except maybe blind - works pretty well again humans too), Inspiration (+4 research... same as alchemy lab), DOMINATION
And they start with agriculture, the best starting tech.
And FANTASTIC traits (raider for xp/pillaging/movement on enemy roads and arcane so you can make your adepts late).
Add to that forest improvements...
I fear this civ is going to get a smack-down.
Perhaps it is just my playstyle, this civ is so uber I cannot even describe how uber it is - but here I've tried.
MagisterCultuum
Great Sage
6. Combat limited units (catapults, illusions) can no longer attack indefintly.
That was fixed several hours ago in patch b (which caused one serious problem, and so was followed quickly by patch c)
That was fixed several hours ago in patch b (which caused one serious problem, and so was followed quickly by patch c)
Ecofarm
Deity
Even with illusions fixed, I don't think it is a nerf. I was sick of the illusion getting all that nice xp. Now my extra assassins get buff.
MagisterCultuum
Great Sage
I personally don't think it was necessarily a nerf either, but I do wish that illusions were immune to fear (since they can't get courage; well, except through Alazkan's Mirror)
Zechnophobe
Strategy Lich
I think they ARE immune to fear. I've used the Mirror to weaken Acheron before, and Alazkan didn't have courage. This is from a full strength acheron too.
Maybe there was something I was missing at the time however.
And yes, this was a necessary weakening in Alazkan's strength. A borderline-early-game hero that can single handedly win you the game was too much.
Now he's limited to only 4 kills per turn.
