me: I'm ready whenever you are
Niklas: same here
I'm correcting lab assignments, can't think of more boring work, so I'm glad for some relief
so...
what I wanted to talk to you about is the future in general
lemme grab some notes...
ok, first of all, Kaz got alphabet this turn and the first trade has gone through
me: That's great! I'm checking now to see how far we are from IW- it was 7 turns when I drafted the note...
Niklas: next turn we should receive alphabet (I think), and could start trading things to you in turn
another thing of note is that Kaz has met SANCTA
me: I understand that KAZ is mostly due east of you... any idea where SANCTA is? Do you know how they met?
Niklas: yes
Kaz met them via workboat, sailing pretty much straight north from them
so they should be quite some ways east of you
we're guesstimating that saturn is between you and sancta
me: We have a warrior that is far to the east (and north) of you. It's possible we'll encounter SAN before SAT.
Niklas: maybe so
do you have any workboats out?
me: Yes, but heading north, not south.
Niklas: towards where we expect saturn to be then?
me: Possibly - if they have a coastal start, of course. It seems that everyone does. The wb left just a couple of turns ago, so it will be a long journey!
Niklas: they definitely have a coastal start
no team had 9 land area on the first turn ;-)
me: Good catch ;-) Our warrior is east of the 'hub', we believe. But we didn't map anything that seemed to be a hub - the avenues may have been in the fog.
Niklas: ok, well, we only have Kaz' word on it and they may have made a guess only
our own warrior scouts have been less than lucky
we've had three eaten by animals :-(
me: Our warrior has mapped a Grand Valley, extending from us to the far east. OMG - that's terrible luck! Especially with all the forested hills!
Niklas: yeah, two of them had great odds to win and yet didn't
me: We are having to be very careful with our escorts - that's for certain.
Niklas: one of them was in a forest, across a river, facing a lion
2 vs 2 strength, and +95% bonus
sigh
me: That's just gratuitious!
Niklas: good thing we had our workboat to make contact
brb
me: ok
Niklas: back
me: One thing we'd like to talk about is settlement boundaries. Can you talk about that?
Niklas: and yeah, gratuitious indeed, that's why we voted no barbs
me: lol
Niklas: hmm, I'm not sure we have enough scouting knowledge to know what relevants boundaries would be
do you feel that you risk settling "too close" to us in the near future?
me: There are a couple of areas where either of us could wind up putting a city, that, without a formal agreement, could lead to tensions. We thought it would be smart to set up an agreement just in case.
Niklas: we should definitely have such an agreement, what I wonder is if there is a rush, or if you could let us scout out our surroundings a bit more before it becomes relevant
for the record we just got AH from sancta and have horses, so scouting should be a bit faster in a short while
me: Yes, definitely scout first. We are not about to settle a city close to you, but, we also were taken by surprise when you settled near our warrior. We see the Mountain Ridges on either side of your new city as being a natural boundary.
AH from SANCTA?...
Niklas: eh, Kaz of course
me: Good cover - your freudian slip is safe with me
Niklas: Cimeira Loucos, named in your honor, is not very far from our capitol
are you saying you feel that it is in what might be contested lands?
and lol, no deals with sancta, never! :-D
me: brb
Niklas: sure
me: back. No, that city is not in contested lands. but on the other side of the mountains becomes tricky. That's why we see the mountains running north / south as a natural boundary.
Niklas: you mean the mountains west of Cimeira?
me: Yes, those west of Cimeira.
Niklas: ok, then I agree, we too see those mountains as a boundary and have no plans to settle past them anytime soon (and definitely not without your consent)
but without further knowledge, it's hard to say anything for sure of course
me: Then I think we are in perfect agreement - we also will not settle on 'your' side of the mountains. Of course you need to scout before you can swear to this sort of thing. But we're just talking about the principle. This was the sort of thing we were considering trying to write into The Treaty - but decided it was best handled between us, as it doesn't concern KAZ.
Niklas: indeed, good call
and I'm sure it won't lead to any disputes
me: Do you know if you'll have any surplus resources soon?
Niklas: I'm not sure actually
I should check the map more often
I think we have a surplus source of wheats
but of course we need a trade route first
me: I'm pretty sure we'll have bananas (after calendar)to trade... We'll also have extra dyes at that point. Calendar is going to open up a lot of things for us. It's one of our priorities.
Niklas: understood
after calendar we will have incence, and we should have wines some time after monarchy once we get around to settling them
me: Speaking of Trade Routes... We can get one set up, but it won't be with the next settler. I'm not sure of the details, but it could be the second settler. But don't quote me! ;-)
Niklas: oh - set up how?
is there a natural connection somehow?
me: See?... it all comes back to your need to scout
If I tell you the details, can you tell me some juicy geographic tidbit we don't know?
Niklas: hehe, I'd need to go look at our maps then
me: I can wait... if you think it's worth it LOL
Niklas: well, I definitely want to know how and when trade can be possible between us
me: Trade routes are possible. I can tell you exactly how, but I'll get yelled at if I don't get anything in return
(i'm not joking - it's happened!)
Niklas: I'm looking at the maps now
not sure what I could tell you that you would find interesting
we have a workboat sailing up the coast to our west
right now it is located pretty much due west of Cimeira
probably 10 tiles or so west of Cimeira, I have no good overview map that shows both
me: That's good news - your workboat may map the Lake Peninsula before we do. We'd like to know more about how to locate KAZ, actually. Did you follow a mountian valley?
Niklas: we found them via workboat
they are located some 30 tiles, and a handful south, of our capitol, along a fairly straight coastline
me: I thought Oystein mentioned walking due east. I'm probably mistaken... Where is that wb now?
Niklas: eh, 30 tiles east
that workboat has since continued sailing north from them, they are located in the southeastern "corner" of the continent
we've sailed northeast and are just about to round a cape pretty far north of them
we passed their capitol on turn 48, so we've gone some way since
we should be closing in on sancta soonish actually
me: Now I understand why you presume SATURN to be north of us.
Niklas: indeed
sancta is pretty much straight north of kaz
and I believe you are somewhere northwest of us?
so that would put the distance between you and sancta at the longest between any of us four, and thus the logical place for the fifth team to be
me: OK - I'll talk now
But one thing I need to mention here: The Triple Alliance needs to have a plan in place for dealing with SANCTA. but first....
we can set up a trade route using the river that flows from CL. It passes between the mountains, and empties into the Lake that's on the peninsula your newer wb is about to explore.
Niklas: hmm, I can see your warrior standing on a forested hill right next to what appears to be the end of said river
3W of CL
me: We have a plan to get a city onto that peninsula (again, I'm not sure which settler is going there), and with a few well-placed roads, we'll have a TR
Niklas: is that the lake you are talking about?
me: ..checking...
Ah,,, I'm mistaken... you're right. The tile Anaxagoras is on will require a road. That road will connect to the hill on the other side of the pass (yes - it's a pass!) and this will complete the trade route to us.
Niklas: ok, that's good, and we can easily supply that road
oh, wait
me: But as I said - it's going to be some turns still.
Niklas: which tile is Anaxagoras on?
you've moved since this shot was taken
is he still 3W of CL?
or 4W?
me: In the turn 1480 screenshots, he's on the tile 4w - on a plains hill just west of the river (which I mistakenly thought passed through the mountains)
Niklas: right, then I'm with you, that makes sense
on my shot he is on the forest 3W of CL, and I couldn't get it into my head how a road there would help
me: Have you explored west through the pass at all?
Niklas: no, nothing
the tile you say Anaxagoras is on now is the farthest of our knowledge in that direction
this is where we lost that warrior to a lion
and our recent warrior, a bit north of Anaxagoras now, was sent northwards since we didn't move close enough to the range to see the pass
so your information is highly valuable!
me: So sad... you really had terrible luck. So do you want your warrior to find us, or to find Saturn?... or maybe find The Hub?
valuable - that's why i needed to get something in return ;-)
Niklas: I think our warrior is better of going north now, our workboat should find your lands
haha, indeed, and I'm sorry if I don't have enough to give, but I will freely share all we know
it's not for lack of will, but for lack of data, that we have little to share
me: When your warrior exits the valley, and the north/south mountain ranges end, he will be in the Grand Valley that our boldest warrior has mapped. Head East, and you should find the hub.
Niklas: ok, thank you
me: btw - you're going to have a dynamite city north or CL. 2 gem tiles!
*north OF cl
Niklas: we have mapped out the land east of us a bit more, there is a larger flat area there where have the wines and wheats
oh - that's great!
how far north?
me: I'm looking now...
Niklas: we have visibility 4N of CL, our warrior will soon extend that though
me: ok - is there a plains hill 2N of CL?
Niklas: yes
just outside its current borders
me: ..with river grass on its west, and plais forest on its east?
Niklas: indeed
and three plains NNN, NNNW and NNNE
me: Hmmm - That's not what I'm looking at. Most of our screenshots are highly zoomed, and spread among many threads. I'm having trouble locating enough shots to piece together where the gems are in relation. But your warrior will certainly find them. The only bad thing is they are jungle hill gems. And I don't remember a river, but I could be wrong.
Niklas: heh, oh well, we'll find them, thanks a lot for that info
we have a Played Turns thread with all the screenshots in it
me: I prefer the setup we have on The Council... but it's fine. We're still finding our system.
Niklas: understood
me: Do you know where KAZ's explorer is - the one who discovered The Hub?
Niklas: no idea I'm afraid
I could ask them for that information, but it hasn't been relevant to us yet
me: We'd like to know where The Hub is - and you will want to know for your warrior. A verbal description will be time consuming, though. I'll try to spend some time looking at the map tomorrow at work.
Niklas: ok, sounds good
I will probably have to leave very shortly
me: That's cool - I'm glad we had a chance to do this.
Niklas: one thing I wanted to discuss though, which has been lost in the interesting information so far, is your thoughts on tech progression past the near goals
what techs do you see as important, and what goals do you have for your own development?
me: I was hoping you wouldn't ask that... this conversation is spread around in a few different threads, and I've had a hard time keeping track of it. The best I can say right now is that I'll have to set up a thread in our forum to solidify our thoughts. We'll have something concrete to offer by the middle of next week, realistically.
Niklas: hmm, well, I really think that this is something that would be best discussed *together*, through all three teams, since it will take a long time for each team to come to a decision on its own, only to find that the other teams have other ideas
of course there needs to be a discussion in the teams, but it would be good if we could talk continuously, to feel the temperature and give input to our teams from each other
me: Very good point. We will also have different goals depending on the alliance's goals as a unit - how do we handle SANTCA, who will build which wonders, etc. Have you had chats with KAZ on this yet?
Oh yeah - which wonders must we DENY to Sancta, as well.
Niklas: yes, we have, and we are keen to include you in them, since it's hard to decide on anything without knowing your thoughts
Kaz are very keen on building the Great Library for instance, both because they themselves are philosophical, and to deny it from S/S
me: Do we know if Saturn and Sancta have met??
Niklas: no, we have no indication of that
SANCTA are putting full EP towards Kaz, but that could be by choice of course, we did the same towards you when we first met you
me: Yes, we noticed
I have to go soon.
Niklas: aye, me too
I'll just give you the state of the discussion on our side now, and you can try to start a discussion in your team
Kaz want to go for CoL next, since they want a religion
we will probably go for Maths, in order to set us up for Civil Service after
which requires CoL and Maths
but Kaz are worried that Sancta will go for Literature, and will probably try to propose that you go down that route soonish, though they have yet to say so out loud
there is of course also the inevitable question of "what's in it for us" if Kaz build GLib, but that's something we'll have to discuss further
me: OK - I'll try to get something concrete to you about the next tech path... perhaps by the end of the weekend? Stacey and I are going skiing this weekend, but I should still have a little time. I can tell you that we have discussed Hanging Gardens (we've a pretty poor start!); but more importantly for The Alliance - The Apostolic Palace. This could open up a pretty interesting avenue for the three of us...
OK, I have to meet Stacey now. Thanks again, and have fun grading labs!!
bye
Niklas: cya
and I can tell you we've discussed Hanging Gardens too
but we'll talk more later, have fun skiing!
thanks Dave. It's easy to forget that there's no way the person on the other end of the chat has no idea if you're still sitting in front of the computer or not. In this case, I had plenty of work to do in the shop, so I was in and out of the office.
I certainly hope I won't make you cry, HUSch!
