Change Vikings to Danes

At least it has to be tested what the AI does with settlers on galleys.
 
What should the 'Viking' civ in RFC be called?
1st choice: Norse
2nd choice: Vikings
3rd choice: Scandinavians
4th choice: Danes

Where should the 'Viking' capital be on the RFC map?
1st choice: Oslo
2nd choice: Stockholm
3rd choice: Copenhagen

By the way, about the what is Scandinavia? thing, my dictionary lists Scandinavian (Scandinavia isn't in it) as "someone from the area of Northern Europe that consists of Norway, Sweden, Denmark, and usually Finland and Iceland" as indeed english has no group of people deciding what words mean. UK and Ireland is not comparable as the UK is a state which nearly always have a clear border while Scandinavia is a region.
 
That description is something I call Norden (the Nordic), Scandinavia is the scandinavian peninsula + denmark to me. Iceland can be counted as Scandinavian since they are of Scandinavian decent, and so can fins to a lesser degree since they have a close connection to Sweden and are part of the Nordic countries.
 
dragodon64 said:
So no one else cares for the idea of having the Settlers start on a Galley adjacent to Norway, Denmark and Sweden? Did the fact I used the local names (Norge, Danmark, Sverige) confuse too many people?
Click to expand...

That's a nice idea (for the anti-Dane people). I completely missed it before. However I assume the AI will always just do the same thing with the settlers, so I don't think in practice it will make any difference from just started the settlers on the desired tiles.
 
Maybe not, atleast in a 3000 BC game, maybe if Rome survives and has contact with the former Viking civilization it will change how the AI think and cause him to choose one location over another which he would have chosen if he never knew of Rome's existence.
 
Panopticon said:
Why have them on Galleys, if the point is to give Scandinavia three cities in good land at the start of the game? Why not just put the settlers on the desired city spots? (presumably the Nidaros, Stockholm, Kobenhavn plots)
Click to expand...

Nidaros is not a good city location. Due to the placement of resources, Lulea (1S of the Copper) is actually the best city site in Scandinavia, but historically this has never been the location of a large city.

Lulea has in its BFC 12 workable grassland tiles (plus some Tundra forests), access to Copper, Iron, Deer and Fur (plus later Aluminium) and is on a river. Compare that to Nidaros which has 7 workable land tiles (all grassland though), but access only to Deer and is not on a river. Nidaros can't even work the Whale (although by the time the AI has Optics it can at least enclose the resource within the cultural boundary of Nidaros), very sad.
 
Etienne said:
my dictionary lists Scandinavian (Scandinavia isn't in it) as "someone from the area of Northern Europe that consists of Norway, Sweden, Denmark, and usually Finland and Iceland".
Click to expand...

Scandinavian is either an adjective describing the region or a noun identifying a person from the region. Scandinavia is the noun referring to the region.

I'm quite happy with this open interpretation of the term Scandinavia, given that I'm also in the "usually" category. :goodjob:
 
blizzrd said:
Nidaros is not a good city location. Due to the placement of resources, Lulea (1S of the Copper) is actually the best city site in Scandinavia, but historically this has never been the location of a large city.

Lulea has in its BFC 12 workable grassland tiles (plus some Tundra forests), access to Copper, Iron, Deer and Fur (plus later Aluminium) and is on a river. Compare that to Nidaros which has 7 workable land tiles (all grassland though), but access only to Deer and is not on a river. Nidaros can't even work the Whale (although by the time the AI has Optics it can at least enclose the resource within the cultural boundary of Nidaros), very sad.
Click to expand...

Well, many of the city locations aren't very good. From Niwt-Rst to Qusqu, relative historical accuracy for the AI has been put above optimal city positioning, which is still an option for the human player.
 
Well, I still haven't had the chance to test the galleys myself (no free time).

However, in my previous experience modding the map, I noticed that when the AI spawns on a tile I designate as a mountain or jungle (since I don't know how to change spawn locations) the capital is founded in different spots in most games. In case you were wondering, It's the Aztec and Khmer spawns that I made impassable. I would like to do it to the Vikings, too, but unlike the other two where 1 tile over is better, they need their capital at least 3 tiles south.
 
Panopticon said:
Well, many of the city locations aren't very good. From Niwt-Rst to Qusqu, relative historical accuracy for the AI has been put above optimal city positioning, which is still an option for the human player.
Click to expand...

Well, since the main power base of the 'Vikings' was in Denmark, Nidaros is still blatantly wrong...
 
It depends on whether Vikings represents only "vikings" or also the early Christian states, in which case Nidaros presumably represents the early kingdom of Norway.
 
It is a common misunderstanding that the Vikings weren't Christian. The Asetro religion was already on its way out in the early 10th Century.
Canute, Harald Harderaade, Svend Forkbeard and every other famous Viking king who came after Gorm the Old were Christian kings.
 
And that is why I still like London as my Viking capital. :)
 
York would make more sense in that context. London was never a Viking town in the same way as York.
 
I vote that the name should be changed to Norse, because that is a historical name for the people of the region and it is generalized enough to refer to all groups that lived in that region. Because it literally means of or relating to the North, this term is flexible enough to refer to regions as diverse as Baltic Russia to Vinland/Newfoundland.

I also think the starting location should be changed to Copenhagen. That way, Jutland will always be Norse instead of Dutch or German. The close borders will also encourage conflict between the Norse AI and Germany, which I think is a good thing. The Danish location of a capital also reflects the dominance of Denmark throughout the Viking Era.

I wonder if the AI will naturally settle Sweden, Norway etc from settlers provided in Jutland using the Galley's they start with?
 
I'm sure it will given the settler maps focus on those areas.
 
Okay I tallied up the votes and updated the original post. Norse (Danes a very close second) and Copenhagen (overwhelmingly) are the current winners. Only ten votes though. I'm hoping more will follow. Anyway, it's interesting that nobody wants to keep 'Vikings' and Nidaros. I pray the Divine One hears us.
 
The Divine One has spoken not long ago that he is on a mission far away. He might be able to hear our plea but I doubt he can do something about it before he returns to his true home.
Perhaps a prophet of some sorts can try and correct the problem, I'm sure it will be recognized by The Divine One!
 
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