Rise of the Homos(Development Thread)

johny smith

Deity
Joined
Mar 10, 2007
Messages
2,273
Rise of the Homos(Development Thread)

This is an idea I have that I thought sharing may help. Remember through all of this this is not supposed to be interpreted as actual history. I want to make it a little comical not so serious. This mod will not be done quickly either. I know this will take a while to be complete. If there is a gathered interest in this idea I say we slowly work towards the goal of making it.

Imagine the year is 150,000 BC in the Paleolithic Era (Old Stone Age). The world is in an ice age. There are many places completely covered in ice. The water level is much lower so more land masses are connected because of this. You begin without a city but a moving camp.

You begin as 4 possible modern Homo Sapien tribes leaving out of Africa. You leave because you are following big game animals. Now this would require animals would actually move around in search of food from the land, and separate animals that are predators. Now you are following the big game. You would collect commerce just from the big game kills. There would need to look really big and pose a serious hurdle to take them down.

Here is small map of genetic patterns that are believed to be true. The numbers in the legend is what time it is estimate the populations appeared in the areas.
Spoiler :


You find for barbarians (nonplayable civs) the other previous members of the Homo genus. Homo Floresiensis and Homo Neanderthalensis are the two that come to mind, but perhaps there could be more added. They need not to be aggressive but wanders at first, but of course things can turn sour. You should be required to have a special unit to be able to actually communicate with them then with more then grunts. They can teach you unique technologies by each of them having a completely different tech tree.

As you go along there should be goodies placed of the map to draw players to a particular area. So like a fantasy map where you can gain some unique rock that draws your attention or perhaps leftover monsters like left over dinosaurs, giant birds or etc. The point is to give you entertainment and a sense of adventure in exploring the map where you gain unique wonders for being there first. Of course you should have the constant struggle of predators coming after you.

Ok later now. The Holocene Epoch occurs and the ice begins melting. The planet is warmer and wetter. For example the Sahara desert was more of a savannah in this time. Many places are revealed on the map and the large big game start dying off so more small game appear. Now this would be the time for domestication of animals. And the other members of the Homo genus disappear.

The idea I thought would be to capture an animal for so long so you could change it into a unit of yours for food. The animal would need protection from predators as well. The units should produce different amounts based on the terrain they go to and how many other animals have visited the same plot. Of course some animals might not should be food. Dogs would be cheap units to help warn of predators, and could be upgraded in the artic to be used as transportation. Reindeer were one of the very first domesticated animals usually left out for the artic. Of course then goats, cows, sheep, and etc.

This era after the melt is the Mesolithic. It starts around 10,000 BC. The principle idea is learning to make better tools for smaller prey and learning to substitute your diet with alternatives. This era should also have small spots of resources like early wild versions of later domesticated plants of today to be collected for food. So there needs to be demands or limits placed on how much you can grow because of the lack of food.

Later comes the Neolithic era which I think is best to begin around 7000BC. This is when you should learn to domesticate the wild plants to make better yields by building improvements on the land. The domesticated animals would not gain a bonus for staying in one place. After learning basic agriculture practices your camp should be able to remain still in one location for so many turns to become a city.

All civilizations should be limited on the eras that they can play I believe. I am hoping that you could create your civilization as you go. My initial thoughts on what determines your civilization would be techs to change your civilization to another unique tech tree. I though to base this on the linguistic families. Like for example the Afroasiatic family splits to form Egyptian or the Semitic language subgroups. This could give you different tech trees for the Egyptians and the Sumerians, This is just my first thoughts only on this though.

I will write more details of plans on this if there is any interest in helping. There is a camp unit that acts a moving city partially done in the WoC. I only wanted to get this out to see if there is any interest. Because I do not want to create a mod just for myself to play. I am open to any ideas to improve this. I hope I hear some positive responses and good suggestions.
 

johny smith

Deity
Joined
Mar 10, 2007
Messages
2,273
So after building cities at some point in the Neolithic Period you later continue on into the various periods related to metals. The world becomes drier in the Copper Age. The Sahara turns into a desert and water levels increase even more on the coast. I know this is not exact, but I am having all the events in one era to keep it simple. For example the Sahul shelf would be example of raising waters which cut off the Indigenous Australians.
Spoiler :



So around 5000 BC roughly begins the Copper Age and it runs till 3000 BC roughly. The Bronze Age begins in 3000 BC and ends in 1500 BC roughly. The Iron Age begins in 1500 BC till 500 BC roughly. Each era's unit should correspond to the metal in use.

I want to have the civilizations that stopped in the Stone Age and did not transition to the Copper, Bronze age to have possibly hypothetical tech trees that show what if they had progressed beyond that. A primarily example being the civilizations of the Americas and Australia. For example Mayan civilization having hypothetical technologies if they had learned metallurgy.

The Classical Era begins around 500 BC till roughly the fall of Rome. All of this beyond 500 BC is more or less the same in general design.

Now I thought of possible having civilizations that could of continued that are extinct with no names. For example civilizations that were in Europe before Indo-European migrations. Anyway just ideas. I want to see what people think about this first.

Proposed eras so far.
Code:
[B]Timeline approx     Era                Tools              Extinct Species[/B]

175,000-100,000	    Acheulean          Axes
100,000-50,000 	    Levallois          Spearpoints	  Homo rhodesiensis
50,000-25,000       Aurignacian        Blades		  Homo erectus
25.000-12,000	    Magdalenian        Microlith	  Homo neanderthalensis
12,000-6,000        Neolithic          Ground stones	  Homo floresiensis
6,000-3,000         Copper Age
3,000-1,500	    Bronze Age
1,500-500           Iron Age

Example idea of possible civs changing in game. Starting as one and progressing into more.
Code:
[I]Homo sapiens sapiens[/I]		[COLOR="Blue"]Acheulean[/COLOR]
	Eastern Migrations		[COLOR="Blue"]Levallois[/COLOR]
		Americas			[COLOR="Blue"]Aurignacian[/COLOR]
			North Americas 			[COLOR="Blue"]Magdalenian[/COLOR]
				[COLOR="Red"]Mississippian(Eastern US)[/COLOR]	[COLOR="Blue"]Neolithic[/COLOR]
				[COLOR="Red"]Anasazi(Western US)	[/COLOR]	[COLOR="Blue"]Neolithic[/COLOR]
			South Americas 			[COLOR="Blue"]Magdalenian[/COLOR]
				[COLOR="Red"]Olmec(Mexico)[/COLOR]			[COLOR="Blue"]Neolithic[/COLOR]
				[COLOR="Red"]Norte Chico(Peru)[/COLOR]		[COLOR="Blue"]Neolithic[/COLOR]
		East Eurasia			[COLOR="Blue"]Aurignacian[/COLOR]
			South Asia/Oceania 		[COLOR="Blue"]Magdalenian[/COLOR]
				[COLOR="Red"]Mehrgarh(Indus)[/COLOR]			[COLOR="Blue"]Neolithic[/COLOR]
				[COLOR="Red"]Jarijari(Australian)[/COLOR]		[COLOR="Blue"]Neolithic[/COLOR]
			East Asia			[COLOR="Blue"]Magdalenian[/COLOR]
				[COLOR="Red"]Banpo(China)[/COLOR]			[COLOR="Blue"]Neolithic[/COLOR]
				[COLOR="Red"]Daepyeong(Korea)[/COLOR]		[COLOR="Blue"]Neolithic[/COLOR]
	Western Migrations		[COLOR="Blue"]Levallois[/COLOR]
		Africa-Middle East		[COLOR="Blue"]Aurignacian[/COLOR]
			Semitic				[COLOR="Blue"]Magdalenian[/COLOR]
				[COLOR="Red"]Nekhen(Egypt)[/COLOR]			[COLOR="Blue"]Neolithic[/COLOR]
				[COLOR="Red"]Eridu(Mesopotamia)[/COLOR]		[COLOR="Blue"]Neolithic[/COLOR]
			Sub-Saharan			[COLOR="Blue"]Magdalenian[/COLOR]
				[COLOR="Red"]Nok(Nigeria)[/COLOR]			[COLOR="Blue"]Neolithic[/COLOR]
				[COLOR="Red"]Mapungubwe(South Africa)[/COLOR]	[COLOR="Blue"]Neolithic[/COLOR]
		West Eurasia			[COLOR="Blue"]Aurignacian[/COLOR]		
			Europe				[COLOR="Blue"]Magdalenian[/COLOR]
				[COLOR="Red"]Chasséen(France)[/COLOR]		[COLOR="Blue"]Neolithic[/COLOR]
				[COLOR="Red"]Vinča(Balkans)[/COLOR]			[COLOR="Blue"]Neolithic[/COLOR]
			Near East/Black Sea		[COLOR="Blue"]Magdalenian[/COLOR]
				[COLOR="Red"]Dnieper(Ukraine)[/COLOR]		[COLOR="Blue"]Neolithic[/COLOR]
				[COLOR="Red"]Çatalhöyük(Anatolia)[/COLOR]		[COLOR="Blue"]Neolithic[/COLOR]
 

Flying Pig

Utrinque Paratus
Retired Moderator
Joined
Jan 24, 2009
Messages
15,651
Location
Perfidious Albion
You have no idea how much I laughed at the thread title. Thanks for making my day! :lol:

On a serious note, it's a good idea but looks like it would need some really pioneering code work. I suggest starting basic, building up a team with skills then trying to put complicated stuff like moving animals in
 

Ninja2

Great Engineer
Joined
Nov 17, 2005
Messages
1,142
Location
Denmarkia
Rise of the Homos - are you kidding me...
 

johny smith

Deity
Joined
Mar 10, 2007
Messages
2,273
You have no idea how much I laughed at the thread title. Thanks for making my day! :lol:

I thought the title might help to get attention.:lol:

On a serious note, it's a good idea but looks like it would need some really pioneering code work. I suggest starting basic, building up a team with skills then trying to put complicated stuff like moving animals in

There is one SDK guy helping but too busy in real life to do things quickly. There is just too much to be done. So looking for more people with knowledge in coding to get interested. I can work on the art and some small things in code if needed. I am just hoping to get a team like you said to help.
 

Flying Pig

Utrinque Paratus
Retired Moderator
Joined
Jan 24, 2009
Messages
15,651
Location
Perfidious Albion
I suggest that you start out with a development version and try to make it just a normal game with new units, buildings, techs, map and civs. Once you've done that then you can show something, which always helps
 

johny smith

Deity
Joined
Mar 10, 2007
Messages
2,273
I suggest that you start out with a development version and try to make it just a normal game with new units, buildings, techs, map and civs. Once you've done that then you can show something, which always helps

I can post a Neolithic tech tree I already did that needs modified, and the partially done camp (but the SDK has more things then just the camp in it at this point). I am planning to do it if there is interest in this sometime this week. Perhaps I can trim down the SDK to include only the camp. If not I can still post what is done. I do not want to sound like I am the only one laying out ideas though. Maybe someone has something better to add to the idea.
 

The_J

Say No 2 Net Validations
Administrator
Supporter
Joined
Oct 22, 2008
Messages
39,627
Location
DE/NL/FR
Nice idea :). (but the title...:D)

The multiple barbarian civs will be a problem, because BtS does not really provide this, but it can be hacked in a dirty way.

But for the design, i think, it would be more interesting, if you could start as one of the different homo species, not only as homo sapiens.
 

johny smith

Deity
Joined
Mar 10, 2007
Messages
2,273
Nice idea :). (but the title...:D)
The title is just for development. I have no clue what the final name should be.

The multiple barbarian civs will be a problem, because BtS does not really provide this, but it can be hacked in a dirty way.

I am thinking of them just being civs now. But I was not thinking playable yet.

But for the design, i think, it would be more interesting, if you could start as one of the different homo species, not only as homo sapiens.

Well I am thinking you can make your civ as you go based on the idea that you and me already talked about(changing civs to a civ with a unique tech tree). I mean I am interested in playing other homo species as well, but we need to think of hypothetical civs that can come after them I think to play later. I don't want them to be same as Homo Sapien is the most important thing I mean. That does not mean worse just different.

I am not against the idea I mean. I am just more concern with Homo Sapien first. Then talk about others later. That does not mean we can not collect ideas for possible other homo species now.
 

Arakhor

Dremora Courtier
Super Moderator
Supporter
Joined
Mar 27, 2009
Messages
39,796
Location
UK
The "Palaeolithic Stone Age". Come now, surely you didn't mean to write that?
 

johny smith

Deity
Joined
Mar 10, 2007
Messages
2,273
The "Palaeolithic Stone Age". Come now, surely you didn't mean to write that?

I just wrote that to make it clear to people who do not know that it was a period of the Stone Age. By the way should there be two eras here? The middle and upper or just Paleolithic? I am thinking two eras because of the time spread.

Edit: I changed it to "Paleolithic Period of the Stone Age." in game of course it would Paleolithic Age or Era.
 

Shiggs713

Immortal
Joined
Mar 11, 2007
Messages
2,361
Location
Indianapolis
Rise of the Homo's, based in 2010, San Fransisco CA, spread your ideology everywhere, make everyone gay!

On a serious note, you should make the barbs or the minors as Neanderthals. Sounds like a fun mod :)
 

johny smith

Deity
Joined
Mar 10, 2007
Messages
2,273
On a serious note, you should make the barbs or the minors as Neanderthals. Sounds like a fun mod :)

I hope it sounds good. I just doubt it will ever get done. At least maybe I can formulate a good plan. Probably minor civilizations would be better.

@ anyone&everyone

I probably should revise the ice ages. I did not know the dates on them exactly before.

Here is table that might help if anyone is interested.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Timeli...based_chronology_of_Quaternary_glacial_cycles

Basically it states there were ice ages...

200,000 BC-130,000 BC was an ice age
130,000 BC-110,000 BC was a break in between
110,000 BC-12,000 BC was an ice age
12,000 BC-present no ice age.

Here is another link if anyone is interested.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Recent_African_origin_of_modern_humans

Some technology of boats I think should enable Homo Sapiens to leave Africa, and some reason to complicate matters by land. I am thinking based on the idea of them crossing the Red Sea around 70,000 BC as speculated anyway.

And if anyone has any ideas that are better the plans can be changed.
 

johny smith

Deity
Joined
Mar 10, 2007
Messages
2,273
One question that might be stupid that I have never seen done. Has anyone ever made an improvement that can only be built once? I was only thinking about it since it might interesting to have early wonders in the form of improvements.
 

johny smith

Deity
Joined
Mar 10, 2007
Messages
2,273
No, hasn't been done yet.
Could be done in python, but would slow down the game by minimum 50% -> has to be done in SDK.

I guess, you want something like a stonehenge improvement :D?

I was thinking something like that yes or Lascaux cave paintings. I am wondering if adding a xml tag to set the maximum amount allowed would work. It would be neat to be able to link a movie to it. Well I can think of a whole bunch cave art anyway and possible other megalithic structures made that could be used.

Anyway thanks for the answer. I was hoping maybe someone had already tried once in the SDK and could give some feedback on the results.
 
Top Bottom