No war weariness...

KrikkitTwo · Nov 13, 2005

One thought, the reason Jail and PS+Rushmore act differently maybe because they act on different levels (PS+Rushmore cutting the total WW for the Civ and Jails cutting how much that Civ WW causes unhappiness in the cities)

snepp · Nov 13, 2005

Krikkitone said:
One thought, the reason Jail and PS+Rushmore act differently maybe because they act on different levels (PS+Rushmore cutting the total WW for the Civ and Jails cutting how much that Civ WW causes unhappiness in the cities)

Makes plenty of sense to me, with Police State and Rushmore being global effects they get applied first, then the Jail supplements them at the city level. Being able to completely remove WW would have been overpowered imho.

MeteorPunch · Nov 13, 2005

snepp said:
Being able to completely remove WW would have been overpowered imho.

This brings up another possible exploit/strategy. Declaring war on another civ, you could take up defensive positions and kill lots of their units, giving them WW (which is unnavoidable, it seems), and denying them peace. Again, I don't really know how all this works - you could be experiencing a little WW yourself, but giving it a lot more so that it cripples their happiness.

snepp · Nov 13, 2005

MeteorPunch said:
This brings up another possible exploit/strategy. Declaring war on another civ, you could take up defensive positions and kill lots of their units, giving them WW (which is unnavoidable, it seems), and denying them peace. Again, I don't really know how all this works - you could be experiencing a little WW yourself, but giving it a lot more so that it cripples their happiness.

Looking at the WW modifiers, alot of things would have to be in place for it to be significant, especially considering the WW bonus that the AI receives depending on the difficulty level. Even playing on Noble the AI only experiences 70% of the WW that a human player would. Perhaps if you were running PS, had Rushmore, built jails in all cities, and the AI civ didn't have Rushmore/Jails, WW could have a damaging effect. I don't think that it could be exploited, but it very well could be viable strategy.

Shillen · Nov 13, 2005

Even playing on Noble the AI only experiences 70% of the WW that a human player would.

Now that's messed up. Noble is supposed to be the level with no cheating. I don't care if they get a bonus on the higher ones, but there should be a level where everything is exactly even.

snepp · Nov 13, 2005

Shillen said:
Now that's messed up. Noble is supposed to be the level with no cheating. I don't care if they get a bonus on the higher ones, but there should be a level where everything is exactly even.

I agree, but to be fair to those involved in the development of Civ4, I don't think anyone made the claim that noble is 100% even across the board. I have seen it stated that noble is the "most balanced" difficulty level, which is true.

anton_z1 · Nov 14, 2005

I dont even get what is the problem with WW. Maybe it becomes worse with different Civics (Like Free speech

). I play on Emperor and i am already in war for 2000 years! ( From 1000 BC to 1000 AD). Having Hereditary Rule and Organised religion plus several units in the cities, i onl;y get 1 or 2 unhappy faces in an 11 size city !.

ranLR · Nov 14, 2005

anton_z1 said:
I dont even get what is the problem with WW. Maybe it becomes worse with different Civics (Like Free speech ). I play on Emperor and i am already in war for 2000 years! ( From 1000 BC to 1000 AD). Having Hereditary Rule and Organised religion plus several units in the cities, i onl;y get 1 or 2 unhappy faces in an 11 size city !.

hmmm, it seems to me (and correct me if im wrong) that ww is also affected by who the enemy is. ie if its an "historical enemy" that youve been in and out of war with for centuries, then probably less ww would be incurred (fits the diplomatic/cultural "reality" designers were striving for). also, i see you have organized religion, maybe their religion is different then your state religion thereby justifying the war, reducing ww? these arent "scientific observations" but seem right.
ive always had a hard time with ww in civ3, havent had enough time to fully explore civ4 yet (pesky job)

snepp · Nov 14, 2005

Here's a couple WW modifiers that I missed...

GlobalDefines.xml
<DefineName>BASE_WAR_WEARINESS_MULTIPLIER</DefineName>
<iDefineIntVal>5</iDefineIntVal>
<DefineName>FORCED_WAR_WAR_WEARINESS_MODIFIER</DefineName>
<iDefineIntVal>-50</iDefineIntVal>
<DefineName>MULTIPLAYER_WAR_WEARINESS_MODIFIER</DefineName>
<iDefineIntVal>-50</iDefineIntVal>

Hergrom · Nov 14, 2005

Here are a couple other sources of war weariness:

1. Nationality - cities with partial or all foreign citizens incur ww (I imagine it is only if they are of the same nationality as the civ you are fighting).

2. Religion - If you are fighting a civ with the same state religion as yours, you incur a ww penalty.

Maybe not all sources of ww are treated the same with respect to the decreases from wonders and buildings.

No war weariness...

KrikkitTwo

Immortal

snepp

King

MeteorPunch

#WINNING

snepp

King

Shillen

Deity

snepp

King

anton_z1

Warlord

ranLR

Chieftain

snepp

King

Hergrom

Bushido Master

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