Philosophy 101

This thread is designed to save other threads.
Other threads are being infected with philosophy, and to keep them on topic im creating this one.

"But there are other threads that are about offtopics". - Yes, but those threads tend to be silly and about popular culture, or the RL habits we have.
This one is for the flexing of the mental muscles I know you all want to flex.
Offtopic thread can remain silly, the Lostkitten thread can remain...whatever that is.
And this one can be about the serious and well thought out conversations about Happiness, the Meaning of life (42), and anything that might scare people away from other "offtopic" threads.

As a substantial contribution to the philosophical threadjacking, i took it upon myself to alleviate the "thread-pressure" by providing this sort of valve.

Hopefully things that are about .16 teasers, or the sheiam, or whatever, could return to their native states. In essence, im advocating a "return to native" threads clean up. I am after all, an environmentalist.
-Qes

Please Refer the current discussion you are in by Posting a Subject Heading reading one of the following, or a {Subject-type} so that people might know what your talking about.

Current Topics

The Nature of Happiness

Ethics vs Morality

History, Brutality and the Nature of Violence

Perceptions of Reality, and Sanity

Definitions of various schools of thought, and disaplines in Philosophy

Authority: Meaning, Purpose, and Impact

NOTE: The answers given by anyone should always be challanged, nothing should be taken as "settled". If you see an answer you agree with, great, ask another question in those lines. If you see something you disagree with, but dont know how to argue, ask a question about what you disagree about. Ask, WHY you dont agree out loud, sometimes that can create discussion. Always ask questions, in all things. Always.

Im asking Thunderfall to move this to the off topic forum. I definitly apprciate keeping the other threads clear, but the threads created to continue those conversation should be linked in the thread they are started in to threads in off topic.

I don't see anything here about great people growth rates. Man, I feel so duped!

"How many roads must a man walk down..."

Kael said:

Im asking Thunderfall to move this to the off topic forum. I definitly apprciate keeping the other threads clear, but the threads created to continue those conversation should be linked in the thread they are started in to threads in off topic.

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It'll never get used there. But you do as you want. I only brought it up, so that it would alliviate the threads in THIS forum. As it is, for people who only visit this forum, it'll never get seen somewhere outside of it.

<Shrug> I Could be wrong. Just trying to help.
-Qes

QES said:

It'll never get used there. But you do as you want. I only brought it up, so that it would alliviate the threads in THIS forum. As it is, for people who only visit this forum, it'll never get seen somewhere outside of it.

<Shrug> I Could be wrong. Just trying to help.
-Qes

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I agree and I know your intentions are good, we are just burying the good information in lots of conversations and threads about non-FfH stuff. Which is fun for those that visit the forums everyday but off-putting to those that come here looking for specific information.

I am the worst offender and I love to just chat, make a few jokes, and get to know the regular posters. So I dont want a strict adherence to ffh-only talk allowed policy of any sort. But just a small change to your plan of keeping the ffh threads less cluttered by putting the threads in offtopic instead of here.

Though if the title was changed so that it was explicitly stated that it's "philosophy for FfH fans," perhaps it would be a nice advertisement... it's amazing how many Civ IV fans don't know about FfH.

Kael said:

I agree and I know your intentions are good, we are just burying the good information in lots of conversations and threads about non-FfH stuff. Which is fun for those that visit the forums everyday but off-putting to those that come here looking for specific information.

I am the worst offender and I love to just chat, make a few jokes, and get to know the regular posters. So I dont want a strict adherence to ffh-only talk allowed policy of any sort. But just a small change to your plan of keeping the ffh threads less cluttered by putting the threads in offtopic instead of here.

Click to expand...

I'm with you 100%. I just think that the moving of this thread wont accomplish its goals. The conversations that sidetrack those other threads, will continue. And people wont go "find" the offtopic forum because its too much work (I know, were all lazy). This FfH forum is one layer of community, and to try and move conversations to another layer - even if good intentioned, doesnt strike me as effective.

My suspicions are that the conversations will merely continue in their current threads, and not get moved to an easily seen (on one web page) thread, so entitled.

My prediction? Move the thread to another forum, and it dies. And the conversations it was meant to contain, will instead eat the threads that their already in.

I too, am a horrible offender of such, the "reply" button is simply too quick and easy not to. But thats just it. If i had to go searching through a completely different forum to say something related, that people may never see, I may simply post offtopically in the topic thread, instead.

-Qes

EDIT: What is truly bizzare about this conversation, is that...it is, in fact, ontopic.

blank,blank,blank,blank

Chandrasekhar said:

Though if the title was changed so that it was explicitly stated that it's "philosophy for FfH fans," perhaps it would be a nice advertisement... it's amazing how many Civ IV fans don't know about FfH.

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30 seconds in the Mod forum, and you see Ffh's title. That thread links you to this forum.

When/if this thread leaves this forum, it'll die. And the rampant (but interesting) talk will go on in the threads they're in already.
-Qes

It's not necessarily such a bad thing. And too many people ignore the mods because they assume that they're all just little fan projects that have little value aside from novelty. This is pretty sad, considering that FfH probably doubles the replay value of Civ IV, and more than doubles it if you're active in the community.

Chandrasekhar said:

It's not necessarily such a bad thing. And too many people ignore the mods because they assume that they're all just little fan projects that have little value aside from novelty. This is pretty sad, considering that FfH probably doubles the replay value of Civ IV, and more than doubles it if you're active in the community.

Click to expand...

I agree for the most part.
Personally I see FfH as giving Civ4 replay at all. And this community has become equally as entertaining as any game, OR mod. The combination is just too priceless.

(I find it uniquely interesting that most offtopic threads, wind up talking about FfH more than what they were designed to. Maybe, people just dont like instructions)
-Qes

We're all rebels at heart.

One of the main reasons I love FfH is its mutability. The "suggestions" or "ideas" threads of mainstream games are absolutely worthless, because they have little to no impact on the games they're for. On the other hand, FfH can be and is changed based on what the community says, within a span of days, oftentimes. Of course, it's all reliant on the decisions of the design team, but we all effect it to some degree or another.

Right, well im gonna attempt to subbornly fullfill this threads purpose.

{Ethics Vs Morality}

Nikis-Knight said:

So what is the difference between ethics and morality, oh wise youngster with more than an intro to philosophy course.
I see one as principles (morality) and the other as details (ethics) though I'll use them interchangably since most everyone else seems to as well.

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First, Let me commedn you on a fantastic Title to the PM. I knew I would enjoy its contents as soon as I read that.

Secondly, I started typing a huge responce, and now will try to "sum up".

Ethics is about means.
Morality, functionally, is about ends.
Ethics are the questions about how you arive to conclusions and decisions, morality describes the decesision itself.
Morality tends to bring forth its tennants of conduct from an authoritative source, such as religion, therefore, Morality can be seen as a set of rules, or laws. Ethics, however, does not deal so much directly with authoritarian structure of code, but instead deals with the consistancy in dealing with value vs action. And when contradictions arise, ethics sights violation.

An example of a Moral Choice, but an unethical one is as follows:

A god Commands that you execute your son in a ritual showing your devotion to this god. The moral desicion is to sacrifice your son, because that is the will of your god. It is unethical, because you are still taking a human life, more than that, you violate your duty as a parent to protect your child.

Ethical, but not Moral:

An old woman is suffering greatly. She has had pain for years, and prays every day to find the release of death. You are her doctor. She pleads with you to let her go, but you have refused because you believed there was a way to cure her. After a final test was taken, you realize that she will never be cured, and you assist her into death. Ethical, because you provided an easement unto the end of pain and suffering, also she was old and had lived fully. Immoral, because you took a human life.

You'll note that in some cases, taking a human life is unethical, at other times immoral, but not necessarily one or the other 100% of the time.

{On Happiness and Bliss}

Chandrasekhar said:

I must ask: most of you seemed to indicate in your responses that self-improvement is a more noble goal than self-gratification. I reply (rhetorically), if one can live the majority of their life in relative bliss, playing a game with no improvement value whatsoever, how is this worse than a lifetime of toil to try to leave a lasting mark?

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Suffering brings about the evolution of the spirit, without which life loses all tangible meaning. Without suffereing, or experiance, a blissfull existance would be a non-existant one. What do i mean? Specifically that the state of suffereing and pain, in life, defines that life to the point where it can become recognizable in the dream state of "real" reality.
-Qes

{Violence}

lostkitten13 said:

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If you're shooting blanks, thats not particularly violent, allthough you could argue that it Portrays violence, and such a portrayal will always in fact reflect the intentions of violence, and if one marks intention with the notion of the propositial object that "is" violence, you could say that shooting blanks, is in fact, violent.
-Qes

funny QES, I do oh so luve shooting people(blanks of course), I...well, I lost what I wanted to type here, lemme find her...

*yells into the infinite abyss of the internet* oooohh the "thing i wanted to tyype"!...where are you?!?

hmm, oh well...

lostkitten13 said:

funny QES, I do oh so luve shooting people(blanks of course), I...well, I lost what I wanted to type here, lemme find her...

*yells into the infinite abyss of the internet* oooohh the "thing i wanted to tyype"!...where are you?!?

hmm, oh well...

Click to expand...

Perhaps Ill add another topic in your honour. "Perceptions of Reality, and Sanity"
-Qes

thanks QES.

hmm...well, having a deep conversation with my computer on this matter he told me that what I was doing was perfectly normal because it gave him the sense of security that he no longer has to remain with me. That, mayhaps with enough help with me he will be able to find his long lost loved one that was left behind and later taken by a porn-mongering-gamer-that pimps her out often, you know, new software and hardware. How terrible it must be to be her.Though whom he later want's to resue from such a terrible ordeal and whisk her away to comp. heaven(my home). Though What isn't real(according to moi), or what I wish wasn't...is having to goto school and live another standard of, 'girl' is it? What isn't real, again what I wish wasn't, is having my creativity demolished and thrown to the side...but, wait...i might have that mixed up, nope...it isn't.

-bullshitting is funny.

no really, it's really funny.

{Perceptions of Reality, and Sanity}
@Lostkitten

Beneath the vanear of complete and utter babbel that you just spat out lies a very tangible amount of Philosophical discourse. The "bs" aside (and Philosophy isnt bs, for all who care) what youre talking about is the disparte nature of what we wish to be true, and what is true. Equally important is that often what we wish to be true (unbeknownst to ourselves) IS true. The creation of reality through subconcious projection, with or with out effort, is a reality manifest by the collection of humans around us (all 6 billion depending on the manifestation in question). So, your imagination, as it is, may be more attuned to "real" reality than when you are at school getting stiffeld.
Conversely, your refusal to accept the manifestation that others put before you could lead you into pain and suffereing because of the disparate projections present.

At that point, the question is, which do you like more, your imagination, or a lack of discomfort?
-Qes

what if I were to say neither? my imagination get's me ridiculed. Me, lacking of discomfort is something that actually is unrealistic, haha.(how'd you like my emo moment.)

but really, which would be hands down, lack of discomfort.