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Lonely Hearts Club, BTS Edition, Chapter XX: CharleMagne

r_rolo1

King of myself
Joined
May 19, 2006
Messages
13,818
Location
Lisbon, Portugal
Welcome to the 20th edition of the Lonely Hearts Club for BTS. In the Lonely Hearts Club we explore strategies to cope with one of the most dreaded situations in Civ IV ( possibly the main reason for reloads after the military collapse one :p ): starting in isolation....

For the 20th game in BTS the choosed leader was CharleMagne of the Holy Roman Empire:
Spoiler :
Civ4ScreenShot0181.jpg


Civ4ScreenShot0180.jpg

Oh well, probably the more :gripe: leaderhead of BtS, not due to him but of his civ ( will not enter on that one again ;) ). Charles has a somewhat weak trait pair ( IMP/PRO ), a off-track UU ( not that is bad in any sense of the word ... simply diferent ) and a superb UB, making it a civ that needs to be played in a diferent fashion for most of the others ( probably the only civ of the game that is more turned for middle age expansion ). I never played him and all of my experience of his play is as a foe and if he can get big, he's a serious threat to any win: being Imp he can spam settlers, being Pro he can defend his cities very effectively and his UB helps paying the expenses ( very much like Zulu one..... ). I'm curious to see how he copes isolation.....

His UU.
Spoiler :
Civ4ScreenShot0182.jpg

The LandsKnetch is a pretty beefed pikeman with a bonus vs melee ( making him almost invulnerable to anything of his time except x-bows ). It is a good UU, but , as most of the pre-gunpowder UU, it will have not much use in here

His UB.
Spoiler :
Civ4ScreenShot0183.jpg

IMHO this is the star of the HRE pack. A courthouse replacement, it cuts 75%of maintenance ( compared with the usual 50% ). This affects most of the game and has a huge effect in the game, including corps. HRE can cope much more easily with a big empire..... that is for sure


The start (for reasons that I'll explain below, the warrior may not be exactly in that spot in your game ):
Spoiler :
Civ4ScreenShot0179.jpg

I simply hate this kinds of maps :lol: 2 seafood ( without fishing :wallbash: ), 5 :eek: FP , a AH food source ,some woods and hills in the outer ring... it is surely a strong starting position.

Again I made a functional scenario ( In that regard I must say a thing: free techs for both AI and humans are not kicking in, and that makes that AI in higher levels starts with warrior/scouts instead of archers ( with the correct numbers. Settlers/workers are working well ) . That is not a issue of my scenarios , but of the way the game is coded... the game atributes the free techs before choosing the leaders.... if the leaders are already chosen it simply moves on . And as the handicap file does not specify archers as free units , but simply "defensive units" ( if you give Rifling and Robotics to a AI, it will start with Mechs :lol: ) if the AI does not have archery they will get warriors/scouts ( depends on hunting ) instead. In isolation that is a minor issue ( you can't rush ;) ), so I took the decison of letting things to stay this way, because the correction would need to change the game code, a thing that is not exactly my objective with this games ) ).... All the speeds are working well ( no more games ending in 1900 ) The save is zipped... you only have to unzip this to the worldbuilder saves or for the PublicMaps folder ( either one will do ) and load it from the scenarios.
Any problem PM me...

Again a small request ( not mandatory :p ) :

We ask the participants to do, if possible, a write-up with the victory save and a description of your game ( strategies, techs researched, wars,...). All the info should be in spoiler tags ( to not disturb other people's games ). If you want ( we would like to :p ) post reports at this moments of the game:

Checkpoint 1 - when we have explored the island and are aware of what resources it has. Its not so important when this is, but this is a time to discuss city sites etc. Don't look into a checkpoint 1 spoiler until you have reached this point yourself.

Checkpoint 2 - first contact - when we have met all the other AIs. At this point we can discuss our strategy to get to this point and our plans for dealing with them.

Checkpoint 3 - when we are committed to a victory condition (or at least think we are).

Checkpoint 4 - Victory (or defeat).


The last words are to wish good luck to all :goodjob: . And let the games begin!



P.S We don't have any kind of problem with defeats and reruns. Just play and enjoy ;)
 

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Nice start. I think i'm going to have to go down to monarch for this one, since his traits are just useless in isolation. Gonna try to get col from the oracle and maybe the great lighthouse.
 
Woo Hooo I love the food, I'm on a SE kick. Farms Farms and more workshops, with the occassional mine.

Isolation, GLH, Collossus, ToA, etc. Hmm Pyramids blah blah..

Capitla will Proberly be my Science/oxford city, I'll move the capital inland;
1) Further reduce maintaince costs.
2) Don't lose game due to a surprise AI attack.

Marathon speed, Monarch difficulty.

Why, because I haven't won one of these FIRST time yet on these settings...

And I'm GOING TO:mad:, i MUST DO :crazyeye:, I'm extremely frustrated not too :crazyeye:


P.S. Thanks Rolo, I really enjoy this.
 
Hmm, cottage capitol!

Signing in. I will take emperor because I like pain.

Seriously, that's an incredible capitol. If the surrounding land is anything like that he could almost have no traits. IMP will help the early game a tiny bit, and god help the world if I find a way to get a gunpowder tech lead.
 
Checkpoint 1

Monarch - Marathon


Spoiler :

I just settled in place. The start was good, no reason to move.



I'm isolated, it's only monarch, i start with mysticism. I decide what the hell. Lets go for a religion. So I get hinduism.


Get bronzeworking from a hut, then agriculture. Sweetness.

I already have a religion, wouldn't a double religion capital be sweet? So i decide to go for judaism, and i get it.


I decide to chop out the oracle, and i get it, and then i decide that a triple holy city capital would be pretty damn sweet. So i get CoL from the oracle. So my capital is now the hindu, jewish, and confucian holy city. it's been long time since i've been such a religion hog. Mainly because on emperor you just can't do that. At this point it's pretty obvious what national wonders my capital is getting.



Combined with the rathaus, i have visions of turning a profit at 100% science.


And a view of the island
Spoiler :

Island isn't bad. 2 happy resources, which is more than usual. A little short on health resources though. Only pigs, fish, and crabs. No grains sucks. 1 small island will be worth settling for an early 2 commerce trade route.
civ4screenshot0005wp1.jpg

civ4screenshot0006ip2.jpg

 
Checkpoint 2

Monarch - Marathon

Spoiler :

We soon pop a great priest and we use it to build the confucian shrine. We also manage to get the great lighthouse. We pop another great priest and build the jewish shrine. We also luck out and get the 2 health event, which we really need. Our third GP is a great merchant, who is settled.

We continue to settle the rest of the island. Barbs are a pain in the ass, but I only see 1 that's higher than an archer, and no cities spawn.

A little later a few great generals are born, so i'm glad there's some wars going on. We're in HR and we get the great person event, we choose the great priest.

I decide to go for astronomy instead of liberalism, and we soon meet tokugawa who is south of us. He has no religion so we send a confucian missionary and he soon converts.


Here's the diplo screen. Doing pretty good. I think almost all of them have asked for a tech, and i gave it to them, so that helped matters. I'm not worried about pacal hating me, since he's a total wuss.


And the tech screen. We're a little behind, but it's not too bad. With astrology things should really pick up.



Ok, these two screen shots show just how awesome the great lighthouse is. Getting astronomy was just absolutely huge. A massive 60% research boost. Going from 221 beakers to 353 beakers. This will definitely power our research and get us a massive tech lead. We also trade for just a ton of resources, taking care any happiness and health issues for a while.






The plan now is to get liberalism. I also want engineering for cheap protective castles, and gunpowder for protective muskets. After that rifles. No idea what kind of win i want. I might do space, but maybe take out tokugawa after i get a big tech lead on him.
 
[offtopic] I have two quick questions that aren't really related to the current game

1. Where can I find the sevopedia that r_rolo1 is using? I tried looking at the main site but didn't have any luck :(

2. BalbanesBeoulve, how have you got that "Glance" screen to be apart of your foreign advisor?

Both of those look like nice features so I would like to get my hand on them! This forum has turned out to be a great place to tweak the game to perfectly fit my own needs :egypt:

Thanks all!
 
Ok I'm off and running, although I feel like I'm behind allready;

Spoiler :
Civ4ScreenShot0000.jpg

Starting island, no stone/marble, but 2 happy resources, seems like we've courned the market on Spices..maybe and fur as well. All 3 sea food, and 3 piglets for trading on the open market.

Tech order, Agri, fishing, popped mining from hut, started bronzeworking.
Built worker, work boat, work boat, warrior (happy police) worker, started settler. I waite till size 5 before 2nd worker/settler.

I plan to finish settler in 2 turns, make 2nd city on desert near the 3 floodplains and spam settlers for there, while spamming wonders in capital.

Wonder order, should, could be Great wall, Stonhenge, ToA, Oracle, GLhouse and 'collossus. I may switch oracle and take math with it.

5 furs and no food to work them all, Some cities are just going to be purely trade route cities.

Currency here I come.

 
Hi

waaaaaahhhhh I tried this game was doing ok and working on GLH in my cap and was making nice progress chopped a few trees to speed it up then 6 turns b4 its finished I get hurricane event. It took out my cap's lil light house so next turn it says I cant continue building the GLH so I lose all those turns and the forests and I dont even get gold like i would if i just got beaten to it :(

Kaytie
 
My exams are finally over, so I'll have a bash at this (and some of the others I've missed over the past 2 months!)

Monarch and Epic for me.
 
My game is going just great. I'll write up a checkpoint 3 post later, but for now, it's 1710 and my economy couldn't be better.

civ4screenshot0027nz8.jpg




I'm in US, got the kremlin, and life in the Holy Roman Empire is good.
 
Argh havent finished GW yet! Grabbing the ZIP, but playing MC1 out, then NC-VII, SB, then LHC-XIX, GW, and THEN this one!

I dont think any of those are going to get "highly detailed" reports, heh. Oh well, playing is a lot more fun than writing most days anyway.
 
I was teching like crap, the leading civ was double my score, and teching democracy in 15 turns, and I was taking 60 with Liberialism...Just gave it up..

Hmm maybe I should have tried gifting a crap desert city to spy off the tech leader..I may try that again from a earlier save.

Take 2, No wonderspamming crazies this time.
Spoiler :
BUT got another civ eliminated early this time....
Spoiler :
2ndtrybabsdestroyed0000.jpg

At a guess they founded both Buddism and Hinduism...so 1 Freaken huge free kick for the civ that takes that capital.

I ended up gaining 4 great spies 1 Scientist and 1 profit...What rubbish. Even though I had espionage on them all, I was too far behind allready. It was just a matter of time till I was invaded..NO point going on...too big a struggle.

Here's my 2nd dot map of my island.
Try20000.jpg


This would seem better, I'll try to keep to this, and I DIDN'T build the great wall, after the 1st tries fiasco...
 
Checkpoint 3 + 4

Monarch - Marathon


This game turned out easier than I thought. Maybe I should have tried it on emperor.

Spoiler :

So shortly after the last round ended I popped the last GP i needed for my holy trinity of shrines.


As expected, astronomy lets us skyrocket past the other civs in techs, and we easily get liberalism. I could have delayed it and gotten a much bigger tech, but I forgot to, so we just get nationalism.


I almost never build University of Sankore, but it was late, it was still available, and even without stone it was only 20 turns on marathon, so what the hell, i go for it and get it.


We'd been running scientists in the capital and finally get a great scientist for an academy in our capital. We also get the great spy from communism, which we use for a golden age to finish off the Taj Mahal. We also get the scientist from physics which we use for another academy in our 2nd best science city.


Our tech path is a beeline to superconductors for laboratories. On the way I notice that nobody's built the SoL, so we try for it, and get it. This game's just been too easy.


We settle 3 island cities with astronomy, pop a few great priests and merchants, and build a few more wonders. Broadway, and the Pentagon.

In 1834 we finish the Apollo Program.



Hammurabi builds the UN and we become the secretary general. While we have most people at pleased, nobody's at friendly, so there's no chance of winning that way.


After getting all the spaceship techs we use our free engineer plus one we popped in our capital to rush the space elevator. Even with 2 engineers it still takes 4 turns to finish it. At this point there's only the 2 engines, which are almost done, and the life support, also almost done, left. Even on marathon, the space elevator just isn't worth it.


Victory 1925. Final score 34,448






Super easy game. The jump from monarch to emperor is just so huge. I'm sure I would have struggled on emperor, but even playing what was an essentially traitless game, i still dominated on monarch. I just had a perfect economy going, this game would have been just as easy playing with literally no traits. Imperialistic just did nothing, and neither did protective. I was never attacked the whole time.

The early religious gamble definitely paid off, lt let me run at 100% science for the last part of the game.


Thanks for the good game, rolo.
 
Playing a Noble/Normal game, managed to pull off a space victory in 2009.

Hey, stop laughing, will ya? This was actually my first BTS No/No win, got it only a week ago. Also, I'm playing CivIV for a whopping 3 weeks now.

And I won despite my noobish city placement, not really having a plan and cottage-spamming only one-and-a-half cities. Oh, and no lightbulbing.

Spoiler :


Built a mixed economy, 6 cities only, never settled off my island.
Aggressively fogbusting the entire island kept the barbs at bay, Great What?
BTW, Karl's Rathäuser rock =)
Got beaten at building wonders left and right thanks to no stone and marble and me not bothering chopping them up, but won the liberalism race =) (a first)
The wonders I did build were the Colossus, Anger What?, Eiffel tower and Teh Intarbutt. Which was absolutely worth it (another first), 'cause I got about 10 techs out of it O_O

I did not found a religion to avoid the then usually resulting 'DIE, HEATHEN!!!1', and kept the warmongering to a (my usual) minimum. Well, I was at war with Tokugawa-san for centuries (like all the rest of the world), but all he sent my way was his three airships, who were occasionally visiting my 20-destroyer-stack about every 5 turns. Way to go you super-improved BTS AI.

I wasn't as lucky as IPEX-731BA5DD06, where Tokugawa-san most likely got raided by the Vedic Aryans, instead the random events played against me through pretty much the whole game. The spice plantations were destroyed by bad weather before the workers were even finished building them, factories burned down constantly, the iron mine south of Aachen exploded no less than FIVE TIMES, best of all was an event that made Aachen instantly lose 3 pop despite me paying money, while building the SS motor O_O

Playing beyond the win revealed that Joao was ready to launch in 2010, Pacal in 2012 and Bismark & Abe still building in 2020, while Tokugawa-san was about to research zOMG FLITE!!!1.

tl;dr We won, and are happy with how.


Disclaimer: using BUG & Bhruic's patch


°dA
 

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I say again...wha?? Liberialism in 1300 at Marathon speed?? what??? in my game it went in 1050........:eek:

OMFG...I've never ever seen that before...I just gave up that game...I was struggling something cronic..

2nd try I gave up again, I got pissed off at the barbs attacking, I should have built some axes..just playing dumb..

Both times I've had an AI ELIMINATED in 2800+ BC... 2nd time I founded Jewdaism by mistake..and slow on the wonders...but both times the GLH has gone at 900+ BC...

both times I got upset at missing out..as I was going for ToA and GLH.

I'll give it a 3rd try..No great wall, no Pyramids, and try for both ToA and GLH, but if another AI is eliminated AGAIN in 2800BC, I'm restarting AGAIN!!!!
 
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