For the next game, I'm actually thinking about notching up the difficulty level and knocking out Caesar. We've gotta play'em all eventually, I want to ease myself into Emperor, and romping around Europe with Praetorians would be... therapeutic after this game's military struggles. Should be a quick game, for obvious reasons, then we can do something more challenging.
King of the World #4: Mansa Musa
- Thread starter Neal
- Start date
r_rolo1
King of myself
How about Saladin?
Joshua368
Warmongering builder
- Joined
- Jun 12, 2008
- Messages
- 3,072
Nothing wrong with one of the European civs but Rome is a bit too easy.
How about trying Spain, proving that a human player can do so much better than the AI with it's OCC
If you do Spain you gotta settle in place. It just won't be the same otherwise.
MrWhereItsAt
Warlord
Which I have just proven
Learn from my mistakes!
I've caught up with all the previous KOTWs, and this one is definitely the most interesting. It's the result of analysing the sort of situation that I don't have the patience/time to deal with in my games. Don't give up; the South America colonisation plan sounds like a great change of pace; I really look forward to the rest of this game!
civvver
Deity
- Joined
- Apr 24, 2007
- Messages
- 5,855
It wouldn't be that hard to play spain and settle in place, they have copper afaik (maybe it's iron, which would delay things a bit, make them slightly harder) and great production- you could just axe rush france, germany, rome and have all of europe.
Rome on emp would be kinda meh, everyone knows exactly what's coming. I'm a noble/prince player, and played rome on monarch and it was seriously so easy.
34 civ map is, well interesting to say the least, but I don't really like it. Messes up the euro civs having another capitol literally 3 squares away, it's weird. I would vote for playing earth but adding sury, shaka, sitting bull and maybe zara. Qin, hatshepsut and monty seem to have a little too much land without much AI competition for it.
But we're getting ahead of ourselves. I find the same thing in my play, I always tire of huge maps in the 1400-1700s and want to move to the next game so my games are never finished. Keep roughing it out out neal, want to see if you can pull this off and what victory you go for.
Rome on emp would be kinda meh, everyone knows exactly what's coming. I'm a noble/prince player, and played rome on monarch and it was seriously so easy.
34 civ map is, well interesting to say the least, but I don't really like it. Messes up the euro civs having another capitol literally 3 squares away, it's weird. I would vote for playing earth but adding sury, shaka, sitting bull and maybe zara. Qin, hatshepsut and monty seem to have a little too much land without much AI competition for it.
But we're getting ahead of ourselves. I find the same thing in my play, I always tire of huge maps in the 1400-1700s and want to move to the next game so my games are never finished. Keep roughing it out out neal, want to see if you can pull this off and what victory you go for.
In this round, we suffer the consequences of stirring the diplomatic pot all willy-nilly like.
As I'd said, we were about 10 turns too late to be able to take Thebes. Those soft Longbows were turning into considerably spikier Riflemen, and we were under the time pressure of an Indian relief column coming up to take back all we had conquered and then some.
Well, we were in danger of an Indian invasion. For a little while.
You wanna go grovelling to Asoka and bring him in as a war ally? DO YOU!? Well, reap the whirlwind, #@%^$. Of course, the real benefit of this was the fact that Cyrus was Catherine's vassal. He would serve as a nice screen to keep the Indians busy for a while.
All of this resulted in quite the... complicated diplomacy screen:
In 1635, Roosevelt, international busybody that he is, decided that he didn't want to be left out:
Shouldn't you be being bent over an Aztec altar right about now? Say what you will about Montezuma, at least having Western power centered in Tenochtitlan makes things simpler.
In 1650 we traded Rifling to Catherine (I know, I know... the rich get richer. But she's the only real friend we've got at this point!) for Military Tradition, which we quickly fired off to Frederick for something we could actually use:
Annnd we turned right around and traded Democracy to Catherine for Corporation. I may as well be her frickin' vassal at this point.
What's that you all are saying? Never trust Catherine the Great? She'll just betray you and leave you broken and alone? I should've listened.
Well, she and Cyrus delayed the Indian juggernaught, at least. I guess. Though I suppose, on the balance, this is a good thing. I've really been handing Russia the game, and if Cathy had taken a few Indian cities or, perish the thought, Vassalized Asoka, we'd be in real trouble.
With the home hemisphere wracked by the throes of war, a few peace-loving Malinesians decided to seek a better life elsewhere, across the great ocean:
They quickly found that life in the New World wasn't that much better than the old. In fact, it reminded me a lot of that Defense scenario:
None of this was especially threatening, but it certainly did make tile improvement more difficult than it should have been.
In 1695, I was finally able to sue for peace with India:
Which was huge. Hatshepsut was beginning to get bold, making punitive raids against our holdings, only to duck behind Thebes' impenetrable walls when I attempted to retaliate.
Of course, being an overly-friendly idiot, I end one war only to jump into another:
So much for returning my populace to a peaceful baseline.
In 1705, meanwhile, we got the first good news we'd gotten in a while:
So it's us and our buddy up there at the top. Good times.
We also received some good news on the American front:
This was just as Roosevelt landed a Crossbow and two Trebuchets outside of our Brazilian outpost. Not that I was worried, but peace is always better than war.
Of course, the very next turn:
... Whatever. I guess that event-mandated peace doesn't include the 10-turn enforcement.
Egypt and India also ceased to be a package deal, which was nice:
So now we can, theoretically, build up for a renewed assault on Thebes.
And there's where I decided to call it a round. Here's the world. The relevant parts, anyway:
Tekedda is working a Plains Farm, and Awlil is working a Mined Gem Plains Hill.
The tech situation:
We're still behind, and I get the feeling that we're slipping, rather than catching up. Decimating the population and eceonomy for a largely fruitless war will do that, I guess.
Diplomacy:
Catherine has a LOT of vassals. *sigh* Oh, and our dust-up with England has become a full-on, Pope-approved Holy War. So we don't have to worry (as much) about Elizabeth making our life difficult.
Military:
We have a lot of outdated units, and no cash to upgrade them with.
Victory conditions:
We're second place in land area, but clearly a distant second. And the war against Egypt may not have been a total waste. With Memphis, Hattie may have threatened a Cultural Victory.
And Economy:
That's gonna get even worse once we start building new cities in South America.
So here we are. Things aren't exactly grim, but they aren't peachy keen, either. It's going to take some doing to snatch victory from the jaws of second or third place, here. I hate to grab Communism and set up another State Property game, but that may be our best option. Thoughts?
As I'd said, we were about 10 turns too late to be able to take Thebes. Those soft Longbows were turning into considerably spikier Riflemen, and we were under the time pressure of an Indian relief column coming up to take back all we had conquered and then some.
Well, we were in danger of an Indian invasion. For a little while.
You wanna go grovelling to Asoka and bring him in as a war ally? DO YOU!? Well, reap the whirlwind, #@%^$. Of course, the real benefit of this was the fact that Cyrus was Catherine's vassal. He would serve as a nice screen to keep the Indians busy for a while.
All of this resulted in quite the... complicated diplomacy screen:
In 1635, Roosevelt, international busybody that he is, decided that he didn't want to be left out:
Shouldn't you be being bent over an Aztec altar right about now? Say what you will about Montezuma, at least having Western power centered in Tenochtitlan makes things simpler.
In 1650 we traded Rifling to Catherine (I know, I know... the rich get richer. But she's the only real friend we've got at this point!) for Military Tradition, which we quickly fired off to Frederick for something we could actually use:
Annnd we turned right around and traded Democracy to Catherine for Corporation. I may as well be her frickin' vassal at this point.
What's that you all are saying? Never trust Catherine the Great? She'll just betray you and leave you broken and alone? I should've listened.
Well, she and Cyrus delayed the Indian juggernaught, at least. I guess. Though I suppose, on the balance, this is a good thing. I've really been handing Russia the game, and if Cathy had taken a few Indian cities or, perish the thought, Vassalized Asoka, we'd be in real trouble.
With the home hemisphere wracked by the throes of war, a few peace-loving Malinesians decided to seek a better life elsewhere, across the great ocean:
They quickly found that life in the New World wasn't that much better than the old. In fact, it reminded me a lot of that Defense scenario:
None of this was especially threatening, but it certainly did make tile improvement more difficult than it should have been.
In 1695, I was finally able to sue for peace with India:
Which was huge. Hatshepsut was beginning to get bold, making punitive raids against our holdings, only to duck behind Thebes' impenetrable walls when I attempted to retaliate.
Of course, being an overly-friendly idiot, I end one war only to jump into another:
So much for returning my populace to a peaceful baseline.
In 1705, meanwhile, we got the first good news we'd gotten in a while:
So it's us and our buddy up there at the top. Good times.
We also received some good news on the American front:
This was just as Roosevelt landed a Crossbow and two Trebuchets outside of our Brazilian outpost. Not that I was worried, but peace is always better than war.
Of course, the very next turn:
... Whatever. I guess that event-mandated peace doesn't include the 10-turn enforcement.
Egypt and India also ceased to be a package deal, which was nice:
So now we can, theoretically, build up for a renewed assault on Thebes.
And there's where I decided to call it a round. Here's the world. The relevant parts, anyway:
Tekedda is working a Plains Farm, and Awlil is working a Mined Gem Plains Hill.
The tech situation:
We're still behind, and I get the feeling that we're slipping, rather than catching up. Decimating the population and eceonomy for a largely fruitless war will do that, I guess.
Diplomacy:
Catherine has a LOT of vassals. *sigh* Oh, and our dust-up with England has become a full-on, Pope-approved Holy War. So we don't have to worry (as much) about Elizabeth making our life difficult.
Military:
We have a lot of outdated units, and no cash to upgrade them with.
Victory conditions:
We're second place in land area, but clearly a distant second. And the war against Egypt may not have been a total waste. With Memphis, Hattie may have threatened a Cultural Victory.
And Economy:
That's gonna get even worse once we start building new cities in South America.
So here we are. Things aren't exactly grim, but they aren't peachy keen, either. It's going to take some doing to snatch victory from the jaws of second or third place, here. I hate to grab Communism and set up another State Property game, but that may be our best option. Thoughts?
r_rolo1
King of myself
Do you still have the FP open? otherwise it might be a good idea to move the palace to the Americas once they start running
BTW Awlil is not on the wrong place ?
BTW Awlil is not on the wrong place ?
FP is indeed open, so the Americas would be a good spot.
Regarding Awlil, I was debating 1E, but I figured that the ability to grow surplus food on the western Grassland in addition to the +1H for Plains Hill outweighed the benefits of being Coastal. I probably made the wrong decision, but I'll have you know that I did think about it
Regarding Awlil, I was debating 1E, but I figured that the ability to grow surplus food on the western Grassland in addition to the +1H for Plains Hill outweighed the benefits of being Coastal. I probably made the wrong decision, but I'll have you know that I did think about it
Ultimocrat
Warlord
- Joined
- Oct 26, 2007
- Messages
- 274
I am also baffled by your city placement in S America -- The amazon is nice once you get it cleared, but there are areas in southern Brazil/Argentina that are much more immediately hospitable, IIRC. (A world map image would come in handy here, once again)
r_rolo1
King of myself
Yup... the area around Rio de la Plata is pretty good for ( if you want ) a settler pump or for the GT, given that you can put a seafood and 3 ( IIRC ) land food resources in one BFC ( riverside and coastal, to add )
Your first cities in other continent should always be coastal, mainly because of the trade routes
Your first cities in other continent should always be coastal, mainly because of the trade routes
MrWhereItsAt
Warlord
Based on the mapsize of Russia, they're only so large in the victory conditions because of their vassals, I think. In terms of landmasses of the motherlands, Mali might be ahead. I don't know if that's any comfort, or whether some of Cat's pets can be turned away from her, but if so then she won't look so hot in that rating anymore.
No chance of sneaking some tech out of Egypt with a Spy, I suppose..? And it might be time to revise the Esp spending as well, what little there may be.
Did all those barbs help much towards a General?
No chance of sneaking some tech out of Egypt with a Spy, I suppose..? And it might be time to revise the Esp spending as well, what little there may be.
Did all those barbs help much towards a General?
r_rolo1
King of myself
Barbs don't give GG points
MrWhereItsAt
Warlord
Seriously? Wow, I've not been paying much attention to cIV rules, have I!
IPEX-731BA5DD06
Deity
Go Cultural.......with religion spread,and corp's, you should be able to set up a late game cultural win
Don't upgrade units of course, if you were going for cultural you really shouldn't have settled those cities on the other continent, although with catherine on a rampage i am not sure that would be very safe... Settling one tile of coast is horrible as it means you can't build workboats or lighthouse... Calcing what would be fastest of space and cultural at this point might be nice, space is safer though as you'll somewhat keep up in tech... All your cities are very very small, you need to grow them long time ago if you want to come close to keeping up in tech... There are tons of people willing to trade you gold, quin have 560 avilable for example. There is no reason whatsoever to not run 100% research(or maybe 100% culture eventually if going for cultural) for the rest of the game...
Gooblah
Heh...
- Joined
- Jun 5, 2007
- Messages
- 4,282
Space, maybe?
Try this: Take Thebes, make peace. Convert Thebes into a GP-Farm which spams Settlers. Have those Galleons deposit troops in S. America, then send 1 Settler, 2 Soldiers, and 3 Workers for every city. Clear out jungle like mad to convert the land into production power-houses, and plop the FP in one of them. Have Africa focus on commerce, and South America focus on building troops. Target the Aztec, Inca, and Americans until your space techs come online, then start building spaceship parts.
Try this: Take Thebes, make peace. Convert Thebes into a GP-Farm which spams Settlers. Have those Galleons deposit troops in S. America, then send 1 Settler, 2 Soldiers, and 3 Workers for every city. Clear out jungle like mad to convert the land into production power-houses, and plop the FP in one of them. Have Africa focus on commerce, and South America focus on building troops. Target the Aztec, Inca, and Americans until your space techs come online, then start building spaceship parts.
Taking Thebes is no mean feat. I plan to do it, eventually, but the place is bristling with Riflemen and siege weapons backed by a ridiculous culture rating spanning a huge amount of land. I can't get a stack close enough to do any damage before it's decimated by collateral damage and fresh Riflemen.
For now, my focus is on getting my own cities, decimated by the draft and slavery, back to a reasonable population. And, of course, doing what I can to settle the new world.
For now, my focus is on getting my own cities, decimated by the draft and slavery, back to a reasonable population. And, of course, doing what I can to settle the new world.
Frankthetank
Chieftain
Before moving up a level, I would still like to see you survive as the incas, settling Brazil as you currently are several thousand years earlier before romping through europe with your preatorians
