AP giving too much hammers?

Magma_Dragoon

Magma_Dragoon

Reploid
Joined
May 10, 2008
Messages
2,354
In my current game, which is going super well, the AP is giving me +4 :hammers: for religious buildings instead of +2. WTH?
 

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It does not look like the city was yours originally; so perhaps there was a random event related to this building that you did not see ?
 
JujuLautre,

I've never seen an event for a Holy Shrine. But I'm not sure that one doesn't exist, either.
 
A save would be helpful. Of particular interest would be before & after you captured that city or before & after the AP was built depending on the timeline.

Also, has it been giving +4 since the AP was built or did it go from +2 to +4 at some later point?
 
Two saves, one before and one after the screenshot was taken. They are the closest saves I have to the weirdness. In the first save I'm getting +2 hammers from Hindu buildings. In the second save, I'm still getting +2 hammers. However, I don't know if loading the save could have changed that. I also didn't check if those hammers were real or if it was just a graphics glitch.
I noticed I was getting +4 when I decided to to build something to boost my culture output in Thebes so I could move my army out to conquer Shaka without the city revolting. I don't know of any random event or quest that gives double hammers to AP buildings.
 

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Thanks for posting the saves. The fact that you are still getting +2 :hammers: on all the Hindu buildings in Thebes means the problem is still "active" since the AP has been obsoleted and you are not getting a hammer bonus anywhere else. Not really much more info from that can be gained though.

I do have a wild theory. Did you defy an AP resolution a few turns prior to capturing Thebes? If so, I can see how this might have happened and will have to run some experiments to see if I can reproduce it.
 
Indeed I did. I defied a resolution to stop the war with Egypt so I could capture Thebes, which was the whole point of the war.
 
OK, here is what happened in chronological order; it is indeed a bug. All steps verified through in-game tests starting with your 1610 save.

  1. You defied a resoultion, removing (sort of, see below) the +2 :hammers: on Hindu buildings in all your cities. Thebes, still being Egyptian, is not affected.
  2. You captured Thebes. It retained the +2 :hammers: bonus; thus it is the only city you have with the bonus.
  3. You don't capture any further cities and make peace. Time passes.
  4. Sometime later, you voted for some other resolution like Open Borders. You are supposed to regain the +2 :hammers: bonus in all your cities now. However, what actually happens is the game simply gives +2 :hammers: everywhere regardless of whether the buildings in a given city previously had a bonus. So Thebes gets an extra +2 :hammers: for +4 :hammers: total.
  5. Time passes.
  6. The AP obsoletes. You are supposed to lose the hammer bonus in all your cities now. However, what actually happens is the game simply subtracts 2 :hammers: everywhere so Thebes goes from +4 back down to +2 while everywhere else goes from +2 to zero.

So, thanks to this, I now know where the problem of unreliable AP hammer bonus comes from; I'm guessing this is also the cause of some people seeing "disappearing" hammer bonuses. The big question is whether or not I can find a decent way to fix it. ;)

The current mechanic makes sense in that it would preserve any event-related :hammers: bonuses but in this situation, Thebes had hammers only from the AP. I think what I need to try and do is check for the presence of AP defiance when a city is acquired and then force the newly-captured city into defiance too, but it'll take some work. :sad:
 
Now that's just sloppy code. Doesn't sound too hard to fix unless all the code around it is just as sloppy. Until then, I have a new exploit to use. :evil:
 
Well, I overstated the details of the bug slightly since I was going on behavior at the time before delving into the code. They do at least *try* to undo the hammer bonus when you capture a city... they just don't to it right. :p
 
are you guys playing the unpatched game by any chance?

I encountered smth similar, maybe even exactly the same, don't recall, but the point is that I had +4 in captured cities and +2 in my own
this was a long time ago, I even made a bug thread about it, and later it was fixed, at least according to the change logs

this might be smth different, or maybe both of you play the unpatched game by some weird coincidence
 
My testing was done under 3.17; if they tried to fix it in one of the patches, they were not successful. Note that in this case defiance is important. If Magma had not defied the resolution before capturing Thebes, the extra 2 :hammers: would not have shown up.
 
Good job, Dresden. I went poring over the Random Events thinking it was in there somewhere; guess I got frustrated for nothing. :)
 
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