King of the World #19: Lincoln

Assume Neal settles 1W.

Worker first is 9 turns working deer/forest tile with no growth. Then 4-5 turns for camp upgrade (I forget which, includes 1 move minimum into forest tile). End result is 13-14 turns for a 5:food:1:hammers: tile and city population of 1 with 12-15/22 growth, and 2 turns to pop 2 either way.

Work boat is 10 turns working grassland forest hills. Then 1 turn for clam upgrade. End result is 11 turns for a 4:food:2:commerce: tile and city growth of 11/22, with 3 turns to pop 2.

By turn 14 the work boat first strategy is putting out 7:food:1:hammers:2:commerce: a turn working both the fishing boat clams & forest deer, with a pop of 2. If you wait 'til pop growth to build a worker, you get a worker by turn 20 with bronze working, which comes quicker with the extra 2:commerce:. Going Mining -> Bronze Working first would also get the Iron 2N hooked up quicker.

By turn 15-16 the worker first strategy is putting out 7:food:1:hammers:2:commerce: with camp deer and unworked clams. Worker first also has the disadvantage of a worker who can only build two grassland farms after turn 13-14, and therefore would require a tech to not be idle, most likely wheel, which would have to come before Mining -> Bronze Working.

Worker first is a good strategy, but work boat first is usually just a little better.

Game speed is epic, your calculations are for normal speed

Food is more important than anything else early, the best food tile is the deer so it has priority

By the time the worker is done with the camp, mining will be in and there's one grass hill for him to mine, no farming needed to keep him busy
after that, worker could be idle for a few turns waiting on BW, no biggie

EDIT: I tried it out, worker first gets the first settler out turn 49 (no chops), WB first got me a settler turn 54 (1 forest chopped)
Details & SS in spoiler

Spoiler :

I tried the mod but it bugged on me, so I used the 18civ instead

In both cases I started on the settler the turn the cap hit 3 pop

Build order: Worker>WB>Settler
Tech: Hunting>Mining>BW
I was able to beat Monty to the corn/silver/spice in mexico on turn 52, he won't have much room to expand. I did have time farm to the marble and a grassland waiting on BW tho. The next settler will be faster as well.
civ4screenshot0007c.jpg


Build order: WB>archer (until pop 2)>worker>archer (continued until size 3)>settler
Tech order:Mining>BW>Hunting
Turn 54 is too late to settle in Texas, Monty is there first
civ4screenshot0008a.jpg


 
I did dotmaps for 1W and 1NE. 1NE seems to allow one or two more cities than 1W. The site below the plains hill in the Rockies is the Native American capitol, or else it would be on the hill. I also tried mapping the west coast, but I got two different dotmaps (both are on the attached files), both of which I'm unhappy with. The maps were done on the Earth 18 map (same terrain, but I had BUG dotmap capabilities), which is why SB's units don't exist.

Feel free to comment on changes you would make.
 

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Game speed is epic, your calculations are for normal speed

Food is more important than anything else early, the best food tile is the deer so it has priority

By the time the worker is done with the camp, mining will be in and there's one grass hill for him to mine, no farming needed to keep him busy
after that, worker could be idle for a few turns waiting on BW, no biggie

EDIT: I tried it out, worker first gets the first settler out turn 49 (no chops), WB first got me a settler turn 54 (1 forest chopped)
Details & SS in spoiler

Spoiler :

I tried the mod but it bugged on me, so I used the 18civ instead

In both cases I started on the settler the turn the cap hit 3 pop

Build order: Worker>WB>Settler
Tech: Hunting>Mining>BW
I was able to beat Monty to the corn/silver/spice in mexico on turn 52, he won't have much room to expand. I did have time farm to the marble and a grassland waiting on BW tho. The next settler will be faster as well.
civ4screenshot0007c.jpg


Build order: WB>archer (until pop 2)>worker>archer (continued until size 3)>settler
Tech order:Mining>BW>Hunting
Turn 54 is too late to settle in Texas, Monty is there first
civ4screenshot0008a.jpg



Ah, you're right.

My calculations were off not only because Neal's playing Epic speed, but because when you move the Settler 1W it takes an extra turn for the clams to get online.

I tried it out myself, and with worker first got the first settler out by turn 45 w/o chops, and with Work Boat first got the first Settler out by turn 50 w/1 forest chopped. My details also after spoiler.

Spoiler :

I also didn't do the mod, because this was just a test. Immortal w/Earth18.

Unlike you, I did the first Settler at pop 2. In a game this packed, I feel early expansion is key. It's possible I'd wait for pop 3 to do the second Settler in the Worker first strategy, as I'd have a Work Boat for the Clams in 8 turns. Then again, that's 8 turns that the clams would barely make up for putting out Settler #2. At any rate, not part of this test.

Build order: Worker -> Work Boat 'til pop 2 -> Settler
Tech: Hunting -> Mining -> BW
Pop 2 @ turn 27
Worker @ turn 18
Settler @ turn 45
Pop 3 @ turn 50
Mining, BW, & Hunting @ turn 52
GameTest2.jpg



Build order: Work Boat -> Anything 'til pop 2 -> Worker -> Settler
Tech: Mining -> BW -> Hunting
Pop 2 @ turn 20
Worker @ turn 33
Settler @ turn 50
Pop 3 @ turn 57
Mining, BW, & Hunting @ turn 48
GameTest1.jpg



The only advantage of Work Boat first is a 4 turn tech lead. My bad. I also like your idea to farm Marble. I'm not sure if that would have occurred to me if I didn't see you do it. I'd like to think so, but there's no way to know.

Interestingly enough, in one of the tests, India was destroyed by 3000BC. It was all around a weird message log update.

WierdLog.jpg


EDIT: I'm also not overly sure that blocking off Monty like that is a good idea. When he can't expand, he's going to start pumping out units. We can hope he'll go after Pacal, but there's no guarantee. Better to settle New Orleans or double corn with the first settler, if possible IMHO.
 
I agree with UWhabs and I would also settle 1W.BTW the thread title says KotW 19# not 18#
 
I kinda like the 1W then Dubuque/New Orleans blockers for easy east coast settling. Relegates SB to the plains/mountains/tundra and hopefully into close contact with Monty.

Hopefully Pacal or Monty spawn a religion... both are good news for you.

Also... lol @ the marble farm. Dunno why I never thought of that :p
 
Farming marble doesn't provide the resource, does it? Even if it doesn't I can still see the point of farming it.
 
Am I the first to point out that the title says "King of the World #19"? Isn't this #18?

Typo in the title, it's marked 18 in the Throne Room link.
 
Farming marble doesn't provide the resource, does it? Even if it doesn't I can still see the point of farming it.

Right. But having the hammer (pre-masonry) and extra commerce from being next to the river make it a comparatively valuable tile to use. Better than just a grassland/plains forest for certain.
 
I give this a shot at immortal/marathon.

Spoiler :

Settled 1W

Second settler New Orleans 2SW, 1W of Wash

Third settler 5N 1E to block Bull from expanding to the east coast.


Then developped peacefully. Once I had bronze working, I looked to slingshot.

I was to end the research of Priesthood when someone built the oracle, switched to Aestetic and Litterature.

In the meantime Monty attacked Bull TWICE and nothing changed except one city in the Rocky Mts razed.

Then when I was expanding up to newfoundaland and building TGLibrary monty attacked with a 25 jags/axes/spears SoD.

I had 6 archers and walls in New Orleans, wiped out with very few casualty for him.


Chewed up my desk and reloaded. Build 4 axes and 4 more archers. This time I won and after a while got 8 axes and 2 archers left. Monty NEVER asked for peace and refused to talk for the most of the time.

I was starting to pack an army to counterattack when Bull got all WEEHORN and started massing catapults. I got the game a try and continued since the two hated eachother, but Bull attacked me instead of Monty, game over.


Insight: rush might not be viable, but DO NOT procrastinate the war too much or Monty will become a productive powerhouse and Bull apparently WILL backstab at pleased. Also, this might partially be due to the fact that it was Marathon.

Never played in the americas myself, so I now understand why when I discover the new world usually the americans are dead. East coast low on production, high on science, bad against Monty.
 
It appears some have BUG working with this mod...how'd you do that?
 
Lincoln twisted and turned in his sleep. He dreamt of flames, of hard-working American boys being stretched backward over Sacrificial Altars, of offering his entire treasury to the Europeans for Code of Laws as they laughed from their iron ships. He dreamt of a subjugated United States being forced to watch as the fate of the world was decided overseas. Lincoln awoke with a start. These dreams must not be allowed to come to pass.

He rounded up the nomadic American tribes, pushing westward and and founding Washington on the rich grasslands of the Eastern Seaboard:

Civ4ScreenShot0003.jpg


Workers were trained to pacify and beautify the surrounding wilderness, and wise men were ordered to learn the ways of the skittish Deer.

American braves headed west in search of conquest, but encountering a strong and organized Native presence, they opted instead to go northeast, to gain what loot they could from the barbarians that our settlers had reported seeing there:

Civ4ScreenShot0004.jpg


The subsistence farmers were a sad, pathetic lot. Lincoln knew that his enemies, if they found this minor tribe, would surely subjugate them and grow powerful off the fruits of their labors. There was no choice but to scatter the farmers and bring the 40 gold they had scavenged back to fill American coffers.

News of Islam's founding reached us in 3650 B.C., and Christianity appeared shortly thereafter. More importantly, by 3025, we found that Montezuma, bolstered by the blessings of his alien gods, had beaten us to the Texan promised land:

Civ4ScreenShot0008.jpg


This was grave news, indeed, but, honestly, inevitable news. The Aztecs' advantages were too great. To expect a fully-funded Settlement party to not only be outfitted but to reach the Rio Grande before 3000 B.C. seemed ludicrous.

Yes, advantages of our own would be needed. And, sometimes, advantages would have to be pursued even when the consequences were dire:

Civ4ScreenShot0009.jpg


There were casualties in the experiments. A full half of Washington's population suffered and died when exposed to the root. But those that survived were... stronger than before. They were no longer precisely human, but they were able to shrug off disease and hardship with preternatural ease. Lincoln, too, underwent the treatments, and found his mind opened. America, especially after exposure to the root, would never be fully welcomed into the community of nations. Surely Lincoln's fever dreams would come to pass unless the tables were turned. Yes, the only only way to avoid conquest was to conquer. The only way to avoid subjugation would be to subjugate!

As the American people were decimated by Lincoln's mad experiments, and as their warlord's mind turned red with rage, the Native Americans, under Sitting Bull, pressed up against Washington's border:

Civ4ScreenShot0011.jpg


... Ack.

So, here we stand. We have a Settler out, good and early, but apparently not early enough. The loss of population from the herbal treatment event only cost us a turn on the Settler, so we still wouldn't have beaten the Natives to Poverty Point. So, I guess the question is, with both the Great Plains and the Rio Grande denied to us, where do we go? Do we slouch northward into the Canadian tundra, where we will surely stagnate and perish? That seems to be the only option I see, short of claiming Jacksonville for the sake of claiming it. Or maybe throw dotmaps to the wolves and settle on the Mississippi delta. I think we're in a tight spot. No wonder America sucks so bad on this map.

Anyway, here's the save:
 
yikes, that's a pretty brutal start.

I find the boston-y/quebec-y area is a great site for a unit pump - if SB and Monty are going to settle up all the space maybe the best opening would be to start massing troops from the off for an early headstomp?
 
The conversation between Emperor Peter and Legio Corvus seemed to indicate that Worker first was quicker, due to the sheer power of that Deer tile. Regardless, the round has been played. So I guess the question is, what's next?
 
I'll ask this again...how do you get this to work with BUG?
 
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