shyuhe
Deity
Both Izzy and Mehmed have dyes already, so if we can make them happy we should be able to trade for it from at least one of them. So I'm fine going with gold over dye.
SGOTM 11 - One Short Straw
- Thread starter AlanH
- Start date
I'm for gold, too. Wouldn't wanna get beaten to dye, given how much of an investment it is.
@Mutineer,
What is the proposed GS - Paper -civic switch schedule now? 8t for GS, after growth, seems good to me.
@Mutineer,
What is the proposed GS - Paper -civic switch schedule now? 8t for GS, after growth, seems good to me.
LowtherCastle
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I agree completely that we want maps. I was simply analyzing the reality of map trading. The reality is that Toku won't trade them (we have to be above Friendly
). Izzy will only trade them at Friendly, which is not possible now. So the only maps you can gain by NSR is with Saladin. What do we expect to get from his maps, since he has closed borders with Toku? Anything we don't get from Justy's maps, we can explore, if we have to. Does that make sense?
The really important maps are:
1. Zara to reveal what's around the SE island.
2. Justy to reveal the far west and all of that landmass, including Toku's lands and Sal's lands.
3. Mehmed to reveal the rst of his landmass.
All three of those can can get without NSR. All three of those we can get if we are in Confucianism. My point is that NSR is not needed. So you are free to plan your turnset differently, if you can find a better way. Does that make sense?
LowtherCastle
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Even if we get Hunting, we can always trade Zara our copper and make warriors in any city. Zara will probably never have his own copper.
LowtherCastle
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Do what you think is best and you're most comfortable with.
Pacifism does us no good without Confucianism and may cost us military unit cost if we're above the free limit.
If we switch to Confucianism 5 turns before poprushing, we only lose a few hammers. 2hpt in Delhi. 1 hpt in Rice. 1 hpt in Two Fish if working the cows. Oasis depends on build and tiles worked.
The hurry is that the only resources we have to trade to Toku are fish and clams. Those are common resources that either he or Justy might get soon. If Toku gets them, we're screwed anyway. But Justy is still REXing and if he trades them to Toku we're screwed but didn't need to be. Delaying resrouce trades is always risky. Let's not forget that unlike humans, AIs evaluate their trade possibilities every turn.
LowtherCastle
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deleted....
OK played 5 turns,
Traded alphabet to zara for gold+hunting.
GS (hopefully, 90% chance) scheduled in 7 turns from original.
I am alt tab to ask opinions from anyone who is around.
Isa demanded gold.
I think we should give it to her, cheap +1.
Traded alphabet to zara for gold+hunting.
GS (hopefully, 90% chance) scheduled in 7 turns from original.
I am alt tab to ask opinions from anyone who is around.
Isa demanded gold.
I think we should give it to her, cheap +1.
Spoiler :
LowtherCastle
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Ok by me . A good reason to keep our cash reserves relatively low is to minimize the amounts when they make their demands.
shyuhe
Deity
Yeah we should pay it. It's expensive but free and easy diplo.
OK, I uploaded a new save.
here is session log.
OK, this is final update
But only one thin, I screw up a bit.
Toky demand to go to war.
I took screen shot and was intend to tab out but miss-click and press escape, cause refusing of demand. That screw up our diplomacy with Toky against our intentions.
Other note, when I was going to revolt to non state Mexmed come with demand to switch to Buddhism, to which I agree as we have no chance to trade with toky.
Trades not in order
Barbarian galley show in force. I had to rely on chance, we got lucky.
Silk - barbarian city near Mexmed
Dyes cite avalible.
As maps, we got all available land map, barbarian galley block further exploration (There is island Visible)
It seems to Buddist got all 3 resources, missing Fur.
Our other exploring WB leading barbarian galey to pillage stuff.
WB exploration finished, now we need 2 Triremes in order to continue exploration.
Other short summary, we got Taoism, HG and build a lot of infrastructure in supporting cities (most of them have Granaries/Lighthouses now for fastest grow. All Sea food boated and we have 1 spare WB which got around Buddist continent.
here is session log.
Spoiler :
OK, this is final update
But only one thin, I screw up a bit.
Toky demand to go to war.
Spoiler :
I took screen shot and was intend to tab out but miss-click and press escape, cause refusing of demand. That screw up our diplomacy with Toky against our intentions.
Other note, when I was going to revolt to non state Mexmed come with demand to switch to Buddhism, to which I agree as we have no chance to trade with toky.
Spoiler :
Trades not in order
Spoiler :
Spoiler :
Spoiler :
Spoiler :
Spoiler :
Barbarian galley show in force. I had to rely on chance, we got lucky.
Spoiler :
Silk - barbarian city near Mexmed
Spoiler :
Dyes cite avalible.
Spoiler :
As maps, we got all available land map, barbarian galley block further exploration (There is island Visible)
It seems to Buddist got all 3 resources, missing Fur.
Our other exploring WB leading barbarian galey to pillage stuff.
WB exploration finished, now we need 2 Triremes in order to continue exploration.
Other short summary, we got Taoism, HG and build a lot of infrastructure in supporting cities (most of them have Granaries/Lighthouses now for fastest grow. All Sea food boated and we have 1 spare WB which got around Buddist continent.
shyuhe
Deity
Rejecting Toku's demand is fine - if we had declared on Saladin, we would have lost our very lucrative trade routes with Justinian. It just means that we should butter up the Buddhist block now.
How could we even have considered DoWing Saladin? Using one of our precious two DoW rights at this point would be beyond foolish IMO.
I think we should aim to grab both the Dye and Silk (well, at least the Silk). I don't like relying on Dye trades from Izzy/Mehmed since if they start warring they might grab our import Dye and might not trade it to us afterwards. Sending a convoy to grab the Silk will be costly though but IMO we should at least seriously consider it. The spot is costly but at least it has mass food. Not sure what our chances are to reach it before Mehmed takes it, though.
Great turnset, Muti, as usual.
I think we should aim to grab both the Dye and Silk (well, at least the Silk). I don't like relying on Dye trades from Izzy/Mehmed since if they start warring they might grab our import Dye and might not trade it to us afterwards. Sending a convoy to grab the Silk will be costly though but IMO we should at least seriously consider it. The spot is costly but at least it has mass food. Not sure what our chances are to reach it before Mehmed takes it, though.
Great turnset, Muti, as usual.
shyuhe
Deity
Do we want to consider warring against Mehmed in the long-term? We can get two of our necessary resources if we vassal him. The only problem is that he's a bit of a unit spammer, but he tends to field outdated units. Alternatively, it should be pretty easy to butter him up with religion and trade so we should be able to get our necessary resources from that block.
I doubt Izzy will adopt Christianity - she's more likely to stay in Buddhism since it's fully spammed. Still no sight of fur though? I guess that means we need astronomy to pick it up.
Everything looks like it's going according to plan though Mysty, you're up!
edit: as an aside, it's looking from the graphs like this might be a three team race right now between us, the ducks, and xteam.
I doubt Izzy will adopt Christianity - she's more likely to stay in Buddhism since it's fully spammed. Still no sight of fur though? I guess that means we need astronomy to pick it up.
Everything looks like it's going according to plan though
Mysty, you're up!edit: as an aside, it's looking from the graphs like this might be a three team race right now between us, the ducks, and xteam.
LowtherCastle
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This game is nothing but a race to the UN.
The odds are the Apostolic religion will be BUddhist. We have every good reason to spread Buddhism as our SR rather than Confucianism. Currently, that only means 4 extra missionaries (in cities with Confucianism already).
World barb population is 20. Less pop4 in Hsung-Nu means Fur City may be pop16 now.
We need 2 more tiles to circumnavigate. We mustn't trade our maps yet. Especially not to Toku. There are at least 4 ways to circumnavigate:
1) Justy defogs those two tiles and gives us his map.
2) Our sea vessel defogs the two tiles. (Our wb can hide in Justy's coastal cities, right?)
3) A mounted unit with sentry goes to that far western penisula.
4) Any unit goes to that far western penisula after we have optics.
Justy is trading for marble from Sal. That means it's half cheaper for him to build MoM.
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Why are we building a lh instead of a galley (or library) in Oasis?
The odds are the Apostolic religion will be BUddhist. We have every good reason to spread Buddhism as our SR rather than Confucianism. Currently, that only means 4 extra missionaries (in cities with Confucianism already).
World barb population is 20. Less pop4 in Hsung-Nu means Fur City may be pop16 now.
We need 2 more tiles to circumnavigate. We mustn't trade our maps yet. Especially not to Toku. There are at least 4 ways to circumnavigate:
1) Justy defogs those two tiles and gives us his map.
2) Our sea vessel defogs the two tiles. (Our wb can hide in Justy's coastal cities, right?)
3) A mounted unit with sentry goes to that far western penisula.
4) Any unit goes to that far western penisula after we have optics.
Justy is trading for marble from Sal. That means it's half cheaper for him to build MoM.
----------
Why are we building a lh instead of a galley (or library) in Oasis?
Yep.
Am I up now? I guess this set is about getting Oxford asap...
Edit: nvm. I somehow totally missed the barb mega-city thing.
Am I up now? I guess this set is about getting Oxford asap...
shyuhe
Deity
Yes sorry, you're up bbp :suicide:
