SGOTM 11 - One Short Straw

babybluepants said:
The golden age is out. I was talking about maxing specialists, potentially building research and running FR. Not sure it can quite result in 10t research... Buddhist spread to our cities for FR benefit may bottleneck it, as well.
Click to expand...

Right, forgot about that GA thing. Right now, Delhi will be the only city producing missionaries since the other two slots will be occupied by the two missionaries sailing to barb island. So we might have a slight bottleneck with missionaries but we can just build wealth/research while we wait for missionaries to travel.


I'm liking the missionary rush-buy idea even more now. If we can complete research in 10t, we could have approximately 600g left over from: current cash + Zhou capture + currently available cash trades. That doesn't even account for further cash trades we may get. After the research is done, we could set all cities to build wealth and probably achieve something like 150-180gpt for the remainder. That gives us somewhere around 12-15 missionary rushes by the turn before victory. The logistics get simpler, as we could just buy them next to the target city. If we gift Gold, then the only ferrying required is one for Devil's Gate and one for Sugar. Devil's Gate could have 2-3 attempts at Zhou in case of failure, and we could do the same in Marble for Sugar with a dedicated galley.
Click to expand...
The galley near gold city should stay on that side of our continent for ferrying purposes. Adopting US after we finish research is a good idea since it adds a few extra hammers to Delhi as well. We can counter any unhappiness using the culture slider too.

This might let us just build research for 10t everywhere, after sending the missionary to barb land and spreading the upcoming Delhi one to Bombay.
Click to expand...
Is there enough cash to let us do all research? Also, we will probably want to shift to theocracy one turn before the victory vote - it's an easy +1 diplo and will be a good safety margin.
 
Yeah, we should switch to Theocracy for at least 1t before the vote. If nothing unexpected happens diplomatically, it may be a moot point.

Cash shouldn't be an issue. We'll need to make a few trades, though.
 
Had a closer look. We can definitely get research done in 10t, and get near max overflow from the Delhi market. The required micro:
Spoiler :

T+00
Bulb Electricity
Adopt FR
Delhi: Eng > Scientist; GH mine > grass cottage
Bombay: build research; plains farm, PH mine & GH mine > Scientists
Two Fish: build research; lake > Scientist
Oasis: PH mine, iron & oasis > Scientists
Rice: build research; grass farm > Scientist
Ivory: 4 coasts > Scientists
Marble: nothing
Sugar: Eng, 3 GH mines & coast > Scientists
Gold: build research; 2 coasts > Scientists
Varanasi: build research; 2 grass farms > Scientists
Incense: build research; grass farm > Scientist

T+01
Delhi: build research
Ivory: build research
Marble: build research

T+05:
Spread Buddhism to Oasis
Devil's Gate: anarchy over; work pig, corn, 2 cottages, GH mine, 4 scientists; build research
Delhi: build market

T+08
Oasis: Scientist >oasis (to avoid starving)
Delhi: grass cottage > plains cottage make sure to not complete market

T+09
Delhi: shop conversion, finish market

10t Total = 9639b / 9502b required - gives a bit of leeway, we can adjust late on.

Some things could probably be adjusted. Let's just hope that someone techs Guilds. ;)
 
I agree with trading away our surplus resources. I can't see how we can get to mass media any quicker than we can with Babybluepant's plan, so shall we go with that?
 
Yes, my total is pre-20% discount.

Note:
By T+9 Delhi is supposed to grow to 16 and get to near max overflow with market. I think I may be 2-3f short of growth in my plan, which would mean firing the scientist towards the end, in favour of another cottage. We can take away the silver, alternatively, if we need to slow down the build.

Can we even convert to workshops on this schedule? I haven't looked at that.
 
If we switch one of the plains cottages to the grass cottage then the capital will grow on size 16 on T+10, which is O.K. as we would not need to use the engineer until T+11.

By my estimation we have exactly the right number of worker turns to complete 7 workshops in time, this is just about enough to build the U.N. in 2 turns without guilds.
 
We just need to grow it before any workshops, as it'll starve after that. I was already switching to the grass cottage for the whole set, but we can grow in 9t if we need to by firing either Sci or Silver for another plains cottage for 2t (7t @ 4fpt + 2t @ 5fpt = 38).
 
I've checked and we can still do the research in 10T if we fire the scientist in favour of the plains cottager, so we may as well do this.
 
MM date is a good stopping point. You could probably just go ahead and finish the UN build, but it doesn't matter too much. Hopefully this leaves us with only the easiest TS ever. ;)
 
I've played. We have reached mass media on schedule. For part of the turnset it looked like we might actually be able to get it a turn early due to Zhou, so I starved our cities more than planned, unfortunately we were barely short of getting the required No of beakers. Building a market would have not worked for the overflow plan if we got it 1T early, so the mace got built instead. (We might have made it if an AP resolution hadn't cost us our Saladin trade routes. We voted against but were outvoted)

We have revolted to O.R. and U.S. Unfortunately due to a MM error in the plan which I did not notice until too late we will get the U.N. 1 turn later than expected. (I forgot we needed a double overflow, not just a single overflow). We might be able to correct this error if we can somehow get 1368 gold by next turn in which case we can rush buy it to correct this error.

We currently have 1006 gold, and we are making +198 gold/turn, so we might make it work, if we can somehow get an additional 164 gold from somewhere.

Devils Gate was taken with no losses. There are no barb units left on the island.

Buddishm has been spread to sugar, Zhou and Devils Gate. We have Oasis, deer, incense, and gold city left which should be no problem with U.S. and O.R.

A connecting fort has been built on the barb island to help with logistics. A road has also been built on this tile, and the furs. We have 4 captured workers in total, and the borders of Devils Gate are due to pop in 2 turns.

1 GP and 2 warriors are currently on the fur. 2 warriors and 1 GP are also on the barb island with orders to go to the fur. 1 More GP is loaded on a galleon in Zara's capital, the other is due to be born in 2 fish next turn. We are in position to send the last 2 GP's to the brab island via a galleon chain.

We have traded for Mehmed, Izzys, Zara's and Justins maps this turn. Most of Japans cities have been scouted in the last turn or 2 by our units. We can't currently talk to Saladin, so our info on his cities is a few turns out of date. Our best pop estimate is:

Us: 117
Zara: 28
Izzy: 47
Justin: 86
Saladin: 46
Mehmed: 91
Togawa: 104
Total: 519

So it looks like we will be all right as long as we don't lose Justins vote, otherwise we will have to grow a lot in order to win.
 
Sounds good mdy. Nothing to say until I get my hands on the save :p

Something that we didn't discuss that much was zara's will to vassalize. Would we get penalties with anyone we care about if we took it? It would be good to cap him, if only after the vote, to get the scorebonus. We can gift him all our techs we can towards the end - his score counts half as ours, and score is tiebreaker if we finish the game on the same turn as another team.
 
Sounds great, mdy. :goodjob:
I'd also like to see the save. ;)

@mysty,
Don't think we care about score, as I believe there are no tie-breakers in SGOTM's.
 
The save has now been uploaded.

Spoiler :
Turn 227, 805 AD: Gandhi adopts Free Religion!
Turn 227, 805 AD: You have trained Buddhist Missionary in Delhi. Work has now begun on a Maceman.
Turn 227, 805 AD: Justinian I has completed The Hagia Sophia!
Turn 227, 805 AD: Zara Yaqob adopts Bureaucracy!

Turn 228, 820 AD: You have discovered Electricity!

Turn 229, 835 AD: Gandhi is the first to discover Liberalism!
Turn 229, 835 AD: You have discovered Liberalism!
Turn 229, 835 AD: Barbarian's Axeman (5.50) vs Gandhi's Maceman 1 (Sugar) (10.00)
Turn 229, 835 AD: Combat Odds: 1.3%
Turn 229, 835 AD: (Extra Combat: -10%)
Turn 229, 835 AD: (Plot Defense: +25%)
Turn 229, 835 AD: (Combat: -50%)
Turn 229, 835 AD: (Combat: +50%)
Turn 229, 835 AD: Barbarian's Axeman is hit for 26 (74/100HP)
Turn 229, 835 AD: Barbarian's Axeman is hit for 26 (48/100HP)
Turn 229, 835 AD: Barbarian's Axeman is hit for 26 (22/100HP)
Turn 229, 835 AD: Barbarian's Axeman is hit for 26 (0/100HP)
Turn 229, 835 AD: Gandhi's Maceman 1 (Sugar) has defeated Barbarian's Axeman!
Turn 229, 835 AD: Barbarian's Axeman (5.00) vs Gandhi's Maceman 1 (Sugar) (10.00)
Turn 229, 835 AD: Combat Odds: 0.9%
Turn 229, 835 AD: (Plot Defense: +25%)
Turn 229, 835 AD: (Combat: -50%)
Turn 229, 835 AD: (Combat: +50%)
Turn 229, 835 AD: Gandhi's Maceman 1 (Sugar) is hit for 14 (86/100HP)
Turn 229, 835 AD: Barbarian's Axeman is hit for 28 (72/100HP)
Turn 229, 835 AD: Gandhi's Maceman 1 (Sugar) is hit for 14 (72/100HP)
Turn 229, 835 AD: Barbarian's Axeman is hit for 28 (44/100HP)
Turn 229, 835 AD: Barbarian's Axeman is hit for 28 (16/100HP)
Turn 229, 835 AD: Gandhi's Maceman 1 (Sugar) is hit for 14 (58/100HP)
Turn 229, 835 AD: Barbarian's Axeman is hit for 28 (0/100HP)
Turn 229, 835 AD: Gandhi's Maceman 1 (Sugar) has defeated Barbarian's Axeman!
Turn 229, 835 AD: Barbarian's Axeman (5.00) vs Gandhi's Maceman 6 (Sugar) (10.00)
Turn 229, 835 AD: Combat Odds: 0.9%
Turn 229, 835 AD: (Plot Defense: +25%)
Turn 229, 835 AD: (Combat: -50%)
Turn 229, 835 AD: (Combat: +50%)
Turn 229, 835 AD: Barbarian's Axeman is hit for 28 (72/100HP)
Turn 229, 835 AD: Barbarian's Axeman is hit for 28 (44/100HP)
Turn 229, 835 AD: Barbarian's Axeman is hit for 28 (16/100HP)
Turn 229, 835 AD: Barbarian's Axeman is hit for 28 (0/100HP)
Turn 229, 835 AD: Gandhi's Maceman 6 (Sugar) has defeated Barbarian's Axeman!
Turn 229, 835 AD: Barbarian's Archer (3.30) vs Gandhi's Maceman 6 (Sugar) (10.00)
Turn 229, 835 AD: Combat Odds: 0.0%
Turn 229, 835 AD: (Extra Combat: -10%)
Turn 229, 835 AD: (Plot Defense: +25%)
Turn 229, 835 AD: Barbarian's Archer is hit for 33 (67/100HP)
Turn 229, 835 AD: Barbarian's Archer is hit for 33 (34/100HP)
Turn 229, 835 AD: Gandhi's Maceman 6 (Sugar) is hit for 11 (89/100HP)
Turn 229, 835 AD: Barbarian's Archer is hit for 33 (1/100HP)
Turn 229, 835 AD: Barbarian's Archer is hit for 33 (0/100HP)
Turn 229, 835 AD: Gandhi's Maceman 6 (Sugar) has defeated Barbarian's Archer!
Turn 229, 835 AD: Barbarian's Spearman (4.40) vs Gandhi's Maceman 2 (Ivory) (14.00)
Turn 229, 835 AD: Combat Odds: 0.0%
Turn 229, 835 AD: (Extra Combat: -10%)
Turn 229, 835 AD: (Plot Defense: +25%)
Turn 229, 835 AD: (Combat: +50%)
Turn 229, 835 AD: Barbarian's Spearman is hit for 34 (66/100HP)
Turn 229, 835 AD: Gandhi's Maceman 2 (Ivory) is hit for 11 (89/100HP)
Turn 229, 835 AD: Barbarian's Spearman is hit for 34 (32/100HP)
Turn 229, 835 AD: Gandhi's Maceman 2 (Ivory) is hit for 11 (78/100HP)
Turn 229, 835 AD: Gandhi's Maceman 2 (Ivory) is hit for 11 (67/100HP)
Turn 229, 835 AD: Barbarian's Spearman is hit for 34 (0/100HP)
Turn 229, 835 AD: Gandhi's Maceman 2 (Ivory) has defeated Barbarian's Spearman!

Turn 230, 850 AD: You have discovered Radio!
Turn 230, 850 AD: Buddhism has spread in Sugar.
Turn 230, 850 AD: Judaism has spread in DevilsGate.

Turn 231, 860 AD: Gandhi's Maceman 4 (Oasis) (8.00) vs Barbarian's Axeman (6.25)
Turn 231, 860 AD: Combat Odds: 76.3%
Turn 231, 860 AD: (Fortify: +25%)
Turn 231, 860 AD: (Combat: -50%)
Turn 231, 860 AD: (Combat: +50%)
Turn 231, 860 AD: Gandhi's Maceman 4 (Oasis) is hit for 17 (83/100HP)
Turn 231, 860 AD: Gandhi's Maceman 4 (Oasis) is hit for 17 (66/100HP)
Turn 231, 860 AD: Gandhi's Maceman 4 (Oasis) is hit for 17 (49/100HP)
Turn 231, 860 AD: Barbarian's Axeman is hit for 22 (78/100HP)
Turn 231, 860 AD: Barbarian's Axeman is hit for 22 (56/100HP)
Turn 231, 860 AD: Barbarian's Axeman is hit for 22 (34/100HP)
Turn 231, 860 AD: Barbarian's Axeman is hit for 22 (12/100HP)
Turn 231, 860 AD: Barbarian's Axeman is hit for 22 (0/100HP)
Turn 231, 860 AD: Gandhi's Maceman 4 (Oasis) has defeated Barbarian's Axeman!
Turn 231, 860 AD: Gandhi's Maceman 9 (Oasis) (8.00) vs Barbarian's Archer (5.25)
Turn 231, 860 AD: Combat Odds: 88.0%
Turn 231, 860 AD: (Fortify: +25%)
Turn 231, 860 AD: (City Defense: +50%)
Turn 231, 860 AD: Gandhi's Maceman 9 (Oasis) is hit for 16 (84/100HP)
Turn 231, 860 AD: Gandhi's Maceman 9 (Oasis) is hit for 16 (68/100HP)
Turn 231, 860 AD: Barbarian's Archer is hit for 24 (76/100HP)
Turn 231, 860 AD: Gandhi's Maceman 9 (Oasis) is hit for 16 (52/100HP)
Turn 231, 860 AD: Barbarian's Archer is hit for 24 (52/100HP)
Turn 231, 860 AD: Barbarian's Archer is hit for 24 (28/100HP)
Turn 231, 860 AD: Gandhi's Maceman 9 (Oasis) is hit for 16 (36/100HP)
Turn 231, 860 AD: Gandhi's Maceman 9 (Oasis) is hit for 16 (20/100HP)
Turn 231, 860 AD: Barbarian's Archer is hit for 24 (4/100HP)
Turn 231, 860 AD: Gandhi's Maceman 9 (Oasis) is hit for 16 (4/100HP)
Turn 231, 860 AD: Barbarian's Archer is hit for 24 (0/100HP)
Turn 231, 860 AD: Gandhi's Maceman 9 (Oasis) has defeated Barbarian's Archer!
Turn 231, 860 AD: You have captured Zhou!!!
Turn 231, 860 AD: The Apostolic Palace voting members have announced their decision: Stop trading with Saladin (Requires 238 of 385 Total Votes)

Turn 232, 870 AD: Buddhism has spread in DevilsGate.
Turn 232, 870 AD: The borders of Two Fish have expanded!
Turn 232, 870 AD: John Dalton (Great Scientist) has been born in Rice (Gandhi)!
Turn 232, 870 AD: The borders of DevilsGate have expanded!
Turn 232, 870 AD: Justinian I has completed The Spiral Minaret!

Turn 233, 880 AD: Buddhism has spread in Zhou.

Turn 235, 900 AD: Delhi has grown to size 16.
Turn 235, 900 AD: Varanasi will shrink to size 3 on the next turn.
Turn 235, 900 AD: Tokugawa adopts Mercantilism!

Turn 236, 910 AD: Zhou will be pacified on the next turn.
Turn 236, 910 AD: Mehmed II has 90 gold available for trade.
Turn 236, 910 AD: You have discovered Mass Media!
Turn 236, 910 AD: You have trained a Maceman in Delhi. Work has now begun on a Market.

Turn 237, 920 AD: Zhou has been pacified.
Turn 237, 920 AD: Isabella has 60 gold available for trade.
Turn 237, 920 AD: Zara Yaqob has 50 gold available for trade.
Turn 237, 920 AD: Gandhi adopts Universal Suffrage!
Turn 237, 920 AD: Gandhi adopts Organized Religion!
 
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