About Traits

climat · Jul 25, 2010

Some ideas for traits.
These changes might be OPed or not useful. I'd welcome any suggestions/ideas.
I don't know whether these changes can be done without SDK or not.
So, changes which need SDK may not be realized and its possibility is highly up to Afforess. (Afforess, will you continue cIV modding before ciV comes? )

Spiritual
+1 happiness from Monastery, +25% faster construction of Monastery, +10% faster construction of Cathedral
+10% stability with State Religion

Nomad
additional +1 :food:

from camp
+1 happiness with horse, fur
Recon Units start with Speed

Seafaring
+25% faster construction of Work Boat, Modern Work Boat (since construction ship get +25% with Expansive)

Humanitarian
Recon Units start with Medic I

Creative
+1 happiness with Library, Museum
100% faster construction of Artist Guild, Opera House, Movie Theatre, Virtual Reality Theatre, Broadcast Tower, Communication Tower

jacktannery · Jul 25, 2010

I agree. And also

<b>Imperialistic<b/>
Commander unitclass start with Morale1 and Operations1 (this will only affect great generals who are used as commanders).

Afforess · Jul 25, 2010

Interesting Ideas. The changes would break saves... so little chance for inclusion in a 1.74 patch; but keep the idea afloat. There may be a AND 1.75 (for RoM 3.0 compatibility), and I'll throw stuff like this in.

generalstaff · Jul 25, 2010

climat said:
Spiritual
Go back to "No Anarchy"
+1 happiness from Monastery, +25% faster construction of Monastery
+10% stability with State Religion

To issue with "No Anarchy" is that it is too powerful at slow game speeds, which is what AND RoM is designed to be played. Other than that, I like the changes you suggested.

Nomad
additional +1 from camp
+1 happiness with horse, fur
Recon Units start with Morale

I like these suggested changes, but I would changed the Morale Promotion to Mobility

Seafaring
additional +1 from ocean tiles, sea resources
Naval units doesn't got damage from Storms.
+25% faster construction of Work Boat

The +1 Commerce is too powerful. Also, the free Amphibious Promotion gives +10% Combat Strength (at least the last time I checked, I do not know if someone changed that), which changed Seafaring from weak to a powerful trait. I do like the faster construction of Work Boat idea.

Humanitarian
Recon Units start with Medic I

I find that Humanitarian is already a powerful promotion, the free Medic I Promotion might overpower it.

Supercheese · Jul 25, 2010

generalstaff said:
I find that Humanitarian is already a powerful promotion, the free Medic I Promotion might overpower it.

Climat's suggestion was for only Recon units to get free Medic 1, surely that wouldn't be too OP, eh?

generalstaff · Jul 25, 2010

Supercheese said:
Climat's suggestion was for only Recon units to get free Medic 1, surely that wouldn't be too OP, eh?

The more I think about it, the more that I think you and Climat are right. When I posted that, I forgot that Medic II required Anatomy, and by that time, access to the Medic is not far away. Not to mention using Warlords and Nobles to build up super medics easily at that time.

climat · Jul 26, 2010

I should've posted a poll like "which one is not useful enough (or lack of flavor

)" first.
I thought that Spiritual is weakest, so I suggested many benefits for it.
About Anarchy turn with Spiritual idea, I honestly have no idea regarding what is the best. Fixed 2 turns seems to be not that useful (at least for me).
Anarchy time are in scale with gamespeed, aren't it?

generalstaff said:
I like these suggested changes, but I would changed the Morale Promotion to Mobility.

But Recon Units can't get Mobility.

I can't restrict free Morale to Recon Units because Nomad alredy gave free promotions to Animal, Mounted, Recon, Wheeled Units.
Module doesn't override original xml, so it gives Morale to Animal, Mounted, Recon, Wheeled Units.
I can't solve this with Forceoverride tags, either..

Arakhor · Jul 26, 2010

Maybe we could kidnap Afforess and force him to give us elections and improved vassalage in 1.75

generalstaff · Jul 27, 2010

climat said:
But Recon Units can't get Mobility.

I did not know that, the only units I modded are the ones included with Modular Civics Buildings.

climat · Jul 27, 2010

Since Explorer and Adventurer ignore terrain movement cost (Mobility reduce 1 terrain movement cost), free Mobility is useful only before Writing even if I make Mobility available to Recon units.
Is it enough or should I go for Morale..?

generalstaff · Jul 27, 2010

climat said:
Since Explorer and Adventurer ignore terrain movement cost (Mobility reduce 1 terrain movement cost), free Mobility is useful only before Writing even if I make Mobility available to Recon units.
Is it enough or should I go for Morale..?

Morale works, although it makes the Confucian Shrine very slightly less useful. I think there is a promotion called "Speed" which is similar to Morale. Judging by the XML, it requires Flanking 3 normally. If Speed turns out to have a flaw like Mobility, Morale is fine, it is just that Morale does not have to same flavor as other promotions and is associated with the Confucian Shrine and Led by Warlord. Ultimately, all that matters is that Recon Units get a movement bonus.

climat · Jul 27, 2010

I found Speed, too. I'll go for it.
I should solve this problem first..

climat said:
I can't restrict free Morale to Recon Units because Nomad alredy gave free promotions to Animal, Mounted, Recon, Wheeled Units.
Module doesn't override original xml, so it gives Morale to Animal, Mounted, Recon, Wheeled Units.
I can't solve this with Forceoverride tags, either..

EDIT: Ok, Anarchy time isn't in scale with gamespeed. So, 2 turns of anarchy seems very powerful, then.

climat · Aug 6, 2010

OP updated.
Creative seems pretty weak (especially in later ages) but I can't come up with good idea for it.
Any suggestions?

jamotide · Aug 7, 2010

climat said:
OP updated.
Creative seems pretty weak (especially in later ages) but I can't come up with good idea for it.
Any suggestions?

Maybe +5% reasearch? It would fit the word creative...

generalstaff · Aug 7, 2010

EDIT: Saw OP edit date.

I like the new idea for Creative.

Iceciro · Aug 7, 2010

jamotide said:
Maybe +5% reasearch? It would fit the word creative...

I wasn't aware Creative was equal to 1/2 Scientific. (The +1 beaker per city is pretty useless around the Medieval era.)

climat · Aug 8, 2010

Scientific is.. quite difficult to change. Any change with it is highly likely to mess balance.

Sonereal · Aug 8, 2010

climat said:
EDIT: Ok, Anarchy time isn't in scale with gamespeed. So, 2 turns of anarchy seems very powerful, then.

Oh boy is it. On Eternity advanced starts starting in anything other than Ancient, spiritual saves you 30 turns. I easily had 38 turns of anarchy switching several civics at once and Spiritual is a life-saver.

Also, wooden ships not receiving damage in storms is OP'd just a smidge with storms enabled and useless with storms disabled. How about half damage?

climat · Aug 9, 2010

It may be better to drop that. Seafaring is powerful already.

climat · Aug 22, 2010

Ok. Scientific becomes almost non-factor after certain time(early classical?).
Creative also becomes weaker and weaker, but at least we have Realistic Cultural Spread option.
So, is there any idea about boosting Scientific?
Since it is the last chance for SDK request, the hurrier, the better.

My idea is giving some bonus to scientist specialist (maybe +1 commerce?) after Renaissance or Industrial. What do you think?

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