Empire-wide agriculture

Aeon, I am familiar with the EU model as I was on board with the first game. But as you alluded to, it is an acquired taste. I could not tolerate not knowing what effect an action would lead to - thus, not knowing how to make good decisions. I would work to build something or obtain something but for what end? I didn't know, it just did something abstractly. I wanted to know that my decision to build an improvement would lead to an X% increase, because that would be just one of many small decisions I could take but chose that particular one. That was why I rejected the EU model or your example as achieving a "fine fettle" as meaningless and utterly unplayable, imo. Just two very different style of playing 4X games and certainly an issue that has been debated for decades. I just hope that Civ5 doesn't trend that way, which may or may not despite battles becoming more micromanaged.

Anybody has played Master of magic?

Yes, it's pretty old. Even though, it was the first time strategic resources appeared (known as mithril and adamantium and giving units bonus to their weaponry) and they were only available to the nearest city.

On the other part, city growth was based upon race and available space. Food was only to support current population and any extra was counted towards empire's granary in order to feed the troops. Even you got a message when some of them were going to starve...

I'm not sure this will ever fit Civilization, but certainly i liked that feature on the game.

Apparently not or as Civ5 is closing this matter is not that important

While food distribution sounds interesting and more realistic (to some degree with lots of variance over time), Civ is ultimately a game, and the current food > population growth/limits model has been around forever and works pretty well.

Part of the glory of civ the game is building an empire, and part of that is picking city sites, and part of that is ensuring a mix of food and other resources. Stripping out the importance of settling near food (or knowing you'll be limited without and settling anyways) would take out some of the strategy of city placement and empire growth.

If this is not in, a mod that adds this feature is the first thing I install. Ofc it should only come at industrial/modern times, and gradually at that. Maybe there could be a wonder to simulate Roman imports, in the early period (since it was a fairly unique phenomenon on the scale that Rome and Constantinople did it).

Why do I want this? For the reasons already mentioned, and because I've always wanted to create a city with nothing but food or production in it... It's mini-maxing at its finest! This way I can play on the world map as Russia (renamed USSR ofc) and have Ukraine's breadbasket supporting my Siberian Naukograds and Atomgrads in the Urals and beyond... Stretching all the way to the barren horizon. And if Ukraine doesn't have enough food, it's time to go on a little European bread excursion; after all as we Soviets know, dependency on foreign trade is a form of sickness that is not tolerated in the Empire, ahem, Union of Soviet Socialist Republics.

You people are funny with your arguments from tradition and word definition. Civ has moved on (it should, in this way too); why don't you try it too? The early game could still be nearly the same as before. And remember: that's when you found most of your cities! This creates yet another slew of new decisions: how to balance city placement so that it's optimal for both ancient and modern eras, with their different distribution mechanics? (Likely to be a tricky affair and leave something to be desired in both eras.) Do I beeline for the redistribution techs, stalling development in other areas (leaving my new breadbaskets militarily vulnerable)? Do I leave some areas empty to fill with future food cities? (Likely to be a bad option, but still) Do I place my own cities as ancient needs request and take my rightful inheritance by the sword later on, from those pesky neighbouring kings, to complent this now-suboptimal core with pristine grain and production centers? Etc etc etc.
It's win/win, you can't fight progress people!

i want to make a small compilation of ideas i liked

food distribution screen:


* food transportation costs gold. value depends on techs and city location (inland or coastal).
* a city can either export or import food. player can adjust import value. if you choose export - all surplus food is exported.
* you can sell food abroad/buy it.
* food reserves decay by, say, 2% per turn

minimal micromanagement included.

exactly the same screen could be introduced for production distribution (costs gold, can be exported etc).

We could use a very simple system like that used for . Basically if you have less food production in you empire than needed to support your empire, the city's that aren't producing any food begin to starve followed by those not producing enough and so on and so forth.

Me said:

We could use a very simple system like that used for . Basically if you have less food production in you empire than needed to support your empire, the city's that aren't producing any food begin to starve followed by those not producing enough and so on and so forth.

Click to expand...

with this approach, how to determine growth speed for different cities? each will have the same? and thus city size will depend only on a year of foundation?

I put the idea forward because it's simple and requires very little work on the players part.

Another simple idea might be to bring back the old caravan unit but now as a food distribution unit. It takes x food and y hammers to make. It can be moved anywhere or sold to another civ and then cashed in for x-5 food at that location.

not too much micro and new tools needed

Prof_longhair said:

Another simple idea might be to bring back the old caravan unit but now as a food distribution unit. It takes x food and y hammers to make. It can be moved anywhere or sold to another civ and then cashed in for x-5 food at that location.

not too much micro and new tools needed

Click to expand...

i believe caravan was removed because of micro..

just an another variant of food distribution mechanic: espionage-like. you adjust a weight values to particular cities and food surplus is distributed according to them.
player sees:

he can click on +/- buttons to change weights.

underlying calculations:


transportation cost depends on distances, techs etc.

I do not agree with one point of Kllemplease idea. In general Trade earns money, if it doesn't - there is no trade So I would make the system that the cities that actually sell the food earn more money so there is more taxes.

Remember - we are the government, people pay us money whatever they do