Thank you Alan for your quick response (no, there's no sarcasm, I do mean it).
Also, many thanks for this SGOTM once again (and to you Erkon!!).
SGOTM 12 - Plastic Ducks
- Thread starter AlanH
- Start date
Thank you Alan for your quick response (no, there's no sarcasm, I do mean it).
Also, many thanks for this SGOTM once again (and to you Erkon!!).
Thanks a lot, AlanH and Erkon! I'll try my best to repeat the move.
The tricky city is SP, Sushi will be founded before Kremlin if we beeline to Medicine, so the spreading of Sushi will be delayed.
Anyway, I am going to play a short set to T208 so that we can think about the civic change carefully. I guess I will continue to complete Grocer in SP.
Techwise, going to stop at 0% on SM, need to save some cash for 100% research to Medicine. Most other cities will continue on their original build.
Anything else, I feel that it's good to stop every 5 turns for better performance.
Anyway, I am going to play a short set to T208 so that we can think about the civic change carefully. I guess I will continue to complete Grocer in SP.
Techwise, going to stop at 0% on SM, need to save some cash for 100% research to Medicine. Most other cities will continue on their original build.
Anything else, I feel that it's good to stop every 5 turns for better performance.
Actually, a CH would be worth more gold in SP, it'll reduce the cost from 40 ish to 20 ish gpt. (after corporation)
Whipping executives is relatively cheap, doing a few of them is not bad at all since the payback is huge compared to Factories.
Whipping executives is relatively cheap, doing a few of them is not bad at all since the payback is huge compared to Factories.
Game Log
Game Report
Little info deserves mentioned in these 3 turns, so I just uploaded the save for you to take a look.
3 SODs are approaching Chicago, Washington and Original Chengdu respectively.
Several cities are unhappy due to WW, whipping angers, and motherhood issue.
The only coal is in Mur and connected.
Issues to be determined for next (probably another 5 turns)
1. Civics
2. City build
3. Tech path
I'll think about tomorrow night, but your suggestions ahead are welcome.
Spoiler :
Game Report
Little info deserves mentioned in these 3 turns, so I just uploaded the save for you to take a look.
3 SODs are approaching Chicago, Washington and Original Chengdu respectively.
Several cities are unhappy due to WW, whipping angers, and motherhood issue.
The only coal is in Mur and connected.
Issues to be determined for next (probably another 5 turns)
1. Civics
2. City build
3. Tech path
I'll think about tomorrow night, but your suggestions ahead are welcome.
Well played!
1 Civics - we do not have much choice, those unhappy citizens must go away. Serfdom -> Slavery
We may want to stick to Pacifism right now though... getting 2 GPs (+1 GE) for the last GA (free GS at Physics) is kinda important, more so than a few lost hammers here and there. But I'd probably go OR as well for 5 turns.
2 Cities
Some are working unimproved tiles.
Happy when needing>lib>Forge>Factory>CP>Health>Obs>University
There is a Whale up for grabs that would help with happiness. (wb from SP is fastest)
SP needs WS next so some banks need to be whipped.
Confu: still worth spreading.
3 Tech path
After Medicine, the next research boost is Electricity for windmills and watermills... marginal but it's there. Final boost is Superconductors: 2 free scientists+25% research... that's at least 25 beakers per city and it's not far after Medicine+Electricity.
Military: Rifling and Steel will let us deal with Churchill easily - several of his cities will be great additions to our empire. If you can find the time to gift him a crappy ice city so we can take all his other cities for easier SF it could be nice. Steel is on the way to Railroads also in case we ever get that elusive GE (of which Gandhi got like 5).
Space race: thinking too far ahead right now.
SM>Bio>Medicine>Rifling>Steel>Astro>Physics>Electricity>Refreg>SuperConductors
I think.
Other: we have way more enough EP than we need on Mao. Switch to Churchill so we see his research/demo. We already see Gandhi's so not much point in getting more from him unless we can find a way to steal Astronomy from him?
War with Roose: probably grab a Cease Fire after taking the 3 cities with current stacks. Send few units to deal with his last mainland cities, they'll probably be culture nuisance. We'll need to DoW him again later to get his island... another crap city up north.
War with Churchill: upgrade GGs and the better Maces. We can go with 2 stacks to make it faster. 5 lvl3 cannons will bring down any defense, 1 suicide will give great odds all around. After his SoD goes down it should be just as easy as with the others.
These are rather general comments, we will have to look very carefully at how to move ahead as we can easily waste 5+ turns due to poor decisions.
1 Civics - we do not have much choice, those unhappy citizens must go away. Serfdom -> Slavery
We may want to stick to Pacifism right now though... getting 2 GPs (+1 GE) for the last GA (free GS at Physics) is kinda important, more so than a few lost hammers here and there. But I'd probably go OR as well for 5 turns.
2 Cities
Some are working unimproved tiles.
Happy when needing>lib>Forge>Factory>CP>Health>Obs>University
There is a Whale up for grabs that would help with happiness. (wb from SP is fastest)
SP needs WS next so some banks need to be whipped.
Confu: still worth spreading.
3 Tech path
After Medicine, the next research boost is Electricity for windmills and watermills... marginal but it's there. Final boost is Superconductors: 2 free scientists+25% research... that's at least 25 beakers per city and it's not far after Medicine+Electricity.
Military: Rifling and Steel will let us deal with Churchill easily - several of his cities will be great additions to our empire. If you can find the time to gift him a crappy ice city so we can take all his other cities for easier SF it could be nice. Steel is on the way to Railroads also in case we ever get that elusive GE (of which Gandhi got like 5).
Space race: thinking too far ahead right now.
SM>Bio>Medicine>Rifling>Steel>Astro>Physics>Electricity>Refreg>SuperConductors
I think.
Other: we have way more enough EP than we need on Mao. Switch to Churchill so we see his research/demo. We already see Gandhi's so not much point in getting more from him unless we can find a way to steal Astronomy from him?
War with Roose: probably grab a Cease Fire after taking the 3 cities with current stacks. Send few units to deal with his last mainland cities, they'll probably be culture nuisance. We'll need to DoW him again later to get his island... another crap city up north.
War with Churchill: upgrade GGs and the better Maces. We can go with 2 stacks to make it faster. 5 lvl3 cannons will bring down any defense, 1 suicide will give great odds all around. After his SoD goes down it should be just as easy as with the others.
These are rather general comments, we will have to look very carefully at how to move ahead as we can easily waste 5+ turns due to poor decisions.
1. Civic -- I'm still not very sure. Slavery + OR increase cost ~120g. The only city that has 3 unhappiness is Chel, which will be solved by the nearby knight. So it might be better to stay in Serf and Pac or Serf + FR, which will probably add a couple hundred beakers.
2. Cities -- Good point about the whale, I totally forgot it. I'll check with other city build later, probably Moscow pump a settler this turn
3. Tech path -- I'll schedule the completion of SM with the stealing of Communism and then to Medicine
4. EP -- right, will switch to Churchill and then to Gandhi or stays on Churchill depending on who will go for MT.
5. War with Roose, yes, will cease fire after 3 cities captured.
For issues after 5 turns, will think about next. There will be some subtle issues I will neglect, especially the optimal city build. So do look at the game carefully and point out my mistakes. The reason why I'd like to play short set. I usually play rather crappy in the late stage of the game.
2. Cities -- Good point about the whale, I totally forgot it. I'll check with other city build later, probably Moscow pump a settler this turn
3. Tech path -- I'll schedule the completion of SM with the stealing of Communism and then to Medicine
4. EP -- right, will switch to Churchill and then to Gandhi or stays on Churchill depending on who will go for MT.
5. War with Roose, yes, will cease fire after 3 cities captured.
For issues after 5 turns, will think about next. There will be some subtle issues I will neglect, especially the optimal city build. So do look at the game carefully and point out my mistakes. The reason why I'd like to play short set. I usually play rather crappy in the late stage of the game.
I've changed my mind about civics.
With Whales and Notre-Dame from Washington next turn, happy problems will be solved. FR would be good in the meantime for extra happy. Serfdom or Caste... Serfdom I guess.
I will need more time to look over individual cities.
With Whales and Notre-Dame from Washington next turn, happy problems will be solved. FR would be good in the meantime for extra happy. Serfdom or Caste... Serfdom I guess.
I will need more time to look over individual cities.
General idea... CMs, executives and troops should be added in there somewhere.
Moscow - settler>Recycling Center>CP>Aqueduct if unhealthy (lose hammers to OF and food otherwise)
SP - wb>CH>WS>couple Executives>WS>factory
Nov - probably whip executives here.
Ros - Factory>CP>Grocer
Yaro - Bank>health
Yek - bank>health
Yak - dunno, maybe whip a few boats?
Vlad - give fish to Novos, Factory+CP (should have decent production)
Smo - Factory+CP
Oren - bank-harbor-Factory+CP-grocer
Kras - harbor-Factory-CP
Rh - fact+CP-health
Kha - happy/health-fact+CP
Bry-health. I wouldn't whip this place due to slow growth
Tv - health-fact+CP
Tours - CMs-LH
Novos - health/happy
Mag - health/happy
Xian - Fact+CP
Mur - Fact+CP
Nanjing - scientist>spy, probably stays a commerce city
Irk - fact+CP
Chita - fact+CP
Shanghai - fact+CP
Beijing - lib-levee+fact+CP
Samara - levee-fact-CP
Lyons - fact+CP
Paris-happy-fact+CP
Chey - fact+CP
Tobol - fact+CP
Volo - happy-lib-commerce
Orleans - happy-fact+CP
Astra - CH-happy-commerce
Guangzhou - fact+CP
Kursk - prod
Boston - culture-food-prod
NY - culture-food
Seattle - prod
All in all, mostly production cities. Not many commerce but a few will be better off to grow, whip unhappy/unhealthy and work specialists.
Civics: after these 5 turns, we could consider a short 5 turns boost of drafting to get 15 infantry rather than paying ~2000 gold to upgrade.
Moscow - settler>Recycling Center>CP>Aqueduct if unhealthy (lose hammers to OF and food otherwise)
SP - wb>CH>WS>couple Executives>WS>factory
Nov - probably whip executives here.
Ros - Factory>CP>Grocer
Yaro - Bank>health
Yek - bank>health
Yak - dunno, maybe whip a few boats?
Vlad - give fish to Novos, Factory+CP (should have decent production)
Smo - Factory+CP
Oren - bank-harbor-Factory+CP-grocer
Kras - harbor-Factory-CP
Rh - fact+CP-health
Kha - happy/health-fact+CP
Bry-health. I wouldn't whip this place due to slow growth
Tv - health-fact+CP
Tours - CMs-LH
Novos - health/happy
Mag - health/happy
Xian - Fact+CP
Mur - Fact+CP
Nanjing - scientist>spy, probably stays a commerce city
Irk - fact+CP
Chita - fact+CP
Shanghai - fact+CP
Beijing - lib-levee+fact+CP
Samara - levee-fact-CP
Lyons - fact+CP
Paris-happy-fact+CP
Chey - fact+CP
Tobol - fact+CP
Volo - happy-lib-commerce
Orleans - happy-fact+CP
Astra - CH-happy-commerce
Guangzhou - fact+CP
Kursk - prod
Boston - culture-food-prod
NY - culture-food
Seattle - prod
All in all, mostly production cities. Not many commerce but a few will be better off to grow, whip unhappy/unhealthy and work specialists.
Civics: after these 5 turns, we could consider a short 5 turns boost of drafting to get 15 infantry rather than paying ~2000 gold to upgrade.
Plan to the completion of Kremlin.
Civic -- stays as FR costs us the religious bonus of spy mission
EP on Churchill and probably on Gandhi later
Spy mission -- Trojan city settled on T209 and gifted on T210, at the same time SM completed, communism stolen, Mosocw starts Kremlin
Diplomacy -- Gift Col to stalin and demand 1gpt
Tech -- R 100% IBT to Medicine
Tiles -- 2F3C > 3F farm > 1F4C > specialist
City build -- In general, Culture>Gra>LH (if not enough land tiles to work)>CH>Forge>Factory (Whip)>CP>Science building > happiness and health buildings. However, I'd like to whip factory in many cities so factory will only be started 1 turn before the completion of Kremlin, especially for cities with high food plus but low production.
Moscow -- Settler->CP->Kremlin
SP -- CH (otherwise lose OF) Edit: WB is considered as military units
->WB ->CH->Factory
Tours and Rh exchange hill tile with 3F farm
Civic -- stays as FR costs us the religious bonus of spy mission
EP on Churchill and probably on Gandhi later
Spy mission -- Trojan city settled on T209 and gifted on T210, at the same time SM completed, communism stolen, Mosocw starts Kremlin
Diplomacy -- Gift Col to stalin and demand 1gpt
Tech -- R 100% IBT to Medicine
Tiles -- 2F3C > 3F farm > 1F4C > specialist
City build -- In general, Culture>Gra>LH (if not enough land tiles to work)>CH>Forge>Factory (Whip)>CP>Science building > happiness and health buildings. However, I'd like to whip factory in many cities so factory will only be started 1 turn before the completion of Kremlin, especially for cities with high food plus but low production.
Moscow -- Settler->CP->Kremlin
SP -- CH (otherwise lose OF) Edit: WB is considered as military units
->WB ->CH->FactoryTours and Rh exchange hill tile with 3F farm
Comments on your suggestions.
Will play tomorrow night.
We need Galleons and Bombers anyway for the war with Stalin later since we have to capture Stalingrad in the 1st turn of the war, otherwise anything will be gone under the those 7 tactical nukes. I have assumed that Stalingrad is in land, which will make the war very costly. Apparently Erkon was not too evil.
We need Galleons and Bombers anyway for the war with Stalin later since we have to capture Stalingrad in the 1st turn of the war, otherwise anything will be gone under the those 7 tactical nukes. I have assumed that Stalingrad is in land, which will make the war very costly. Apparently Erkon was not too evil.
Yes we will need a mini-fleet to go after Stalin.
To me it's been clear for a while that Stalin was coastal from the single tile we could see of his city.
An amphibious attack would work just as well to take out Stalingrad... might lose more units but avoids researching Flight.
To me it's been clear for a while that Stalin was coastal from the single tile we could see of his city.
An amphibious attack would work just as well to take out Stalingrad... might lose more units but avoids researching Flight.
I mean that I have thought in the beginning that the only AI's non-coastal capital should be Stalingrad, it turned out everyone is coastal.
We need either Flight or Artillery for Rocketry, Flight is a little more expensive, but more convenience for warfare.
We need either Flight or Artillery for Rocketry, Flight is a little more expensive, but more convenience for warfare.
Game Log
Game Report
I Ended this session 1 turn before the original plan, because I faced some choices -- whether to switch to Slavery + OR this turn and what to research next? On the other side, this is one of the best set you'll be glad to see.
T209 -- This war contributed half of the WW, after this, only Vlad has 1 unhappy citizen.
Chicago was captured without any loss, but it lost most of the buildings.
T210 -- We lost 2 spies at 70% odd, fortunately the last one succeeded. My luck stood at the critical moment.
Our capital becomes a monstrous productive city.
T211 -- Washington's defense is not impressive, and we captured it without any loss.
I'll leave yourself to find out what are inside.
Also got a nice worker, Atlanta is lightly defended but also on hill
T212 -- The new land, we are close to circumvent.
We failed the spread of Confu to Rh.
And the last surprise.
Things to be determined next:
1. Civic -- Slavery + OR seems obvious (cost ~120g more), the question is this turn or next turn
2. Tech path -- With the GE, obviously RR gets high priority, Sushi or Mine, which goes ahead?
3. City build -- The major question is which cities need to whip factory and when?
4. War -- I did not cease fire since the WW is not very severe after peace with DG and we can whip next.
5. When to start the next GA and which GP to be used?
6. Feel free to bring more.
If we can reach an agreement quickly enough, I could play another short set in Thursday night and then hand the game over to you since I won't have time during this weekend.
Spoiler :
Game Report
I Ended this session 1 turn before the original plan, because I faced some choices -- whether to switch to Slavery + OR this turn and what to research next? On the other side, this is one of the best set you'll be glad to see.
T209 -- This war contributed half of the WW, after this, only Vlad has 1 unhappy citizen.
Spoiler :
Chicago was captured without any loss, but it lost most of the buildings.
Spoiler :
T210 -- We lost 2 spies at 70% odd, fortunately the last one succeeded. My luck stood at the critical moment.
Spoiler :
Our capital becomes a monstrous productive city.
Spoiler :
T211 -- Washington's defense is not impressive, and we captured it without any loss.
Spoiler :
Spoiler :
Also got a nice worker, Atlanta is lightly defended but also on hill
Spoiler :
T212 -- The new land, we are close to circumvent.
Spoiler :
We failed the spread of Confu to Rh.
And the last surprise.
Spoiler :
Things to be determined next:
1. Civic -- Slavery + OR seems obvious (cost ~120g more), the question is this turn or next turn
2. Tech path -- With the GE, obviously RR gets high priority, Sushi or Mine, which goes ahead?
3. City build -- The major question is which cities need to whip factory and when?
4. War -- I did not cease fire since the WW is not very severe after peace with DG and we can whip next.
5. When to start the next GA and which GP to be used?
6. Feel free to bring more.
If we can reach an agreement quickly enough, I could play another short set in Thursday night and then hand the game over to you since I won't have time during this weekend.
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