Who will be the leader of Spain?

I'd like someone other than Isabel I in as Spain's leader.

I will be extremely disappointed.

I bet it's Isabella but might like Filip II

It will be Isabella, most likely:

- She was the founder of Spain
- Female leader
- She was a major influence in major world history events: Columbus voyage, the reconquista, the institution of the Inquisition, the Laws of Indies, and much, much more
- Extremely strong personality (see also Isabella's TV series to catch a glimpse of the type of women she was. Hint: None of us would have been able to handle her )

As for a possible competitor for an alternative Spain's leader, I would suggest what is possible one of our best (and more underrated) leaders: Charles III

Major archievements:

- Granted and expanded rights for traditionally opressed minorities such as gypsies and indians
- Directly supported the US against the British in their war for independence
- Initiated the first mass vaccination campaign in the American continent
- Leaded hundred of scientific expeditions, preserving much of the botanical and medicinal knowledge of native American Civilizations
- Funded several scientific institutions both in Spain and the Indies
- Went into massive urbanizaztion / sanitation / modernization projects in Madrid and the main cities of the Spanish empire

Speaking about novelties, how about putting a royal couple at the helm of Spain, the Christian Monarchs Isabella and Ferdinand II(V)? Like it was? As I understand, Spain as a unified country emerged from the union of Castile and Aragon. Both monarchs shared power. The Reconquest was completed under them both, they both gave Columbus the ships to go westwards. And the announced Conquistador unit suits the time period perfectly. Besides, what better opportunity you could find to achieve perfect gender equality ?

Well Isabella has been the Spanish ruler in every iteration of Civilization so far (Philip II merely included in Civ II because they needed a male option) so if I were a gambling man I'd go all in on her.

Charles or Philip could be fun I suppose; giving us a different view on Spain than we've seen represented so far

Ikael said:

It will be Isabella, most likely:

- She was the founder of Spain
- Female leader
- She was a major influence in major world history events: Columbus voyage, the reconquista, the institution of the Inquisition, the Laws of Indies, and much, much more
- Extremely strong personality (see also Isabella's TV series to catch a glimpse of the type of women she was. Hint: None of us would have been able to handle her )

As for a possible competitor for an alternative Spain's leader, I would suggest what is possible one of our best (and more underrated) leaders: Charles III

Major archievements:

- Granted and expanded rights for traditionally opressed minorities such as gypsies and indians
- Directly supported the US against the British in their war for independence
- Initiated the first mass vaccination campaign in the American continent
- Leaded hundred of scientific expeditions, preserving much of the botanical and medicinal knowledge of native American Civilizations
- Funded several scientific institutions both in Spain and the Indies
- Went into massive urbanizaztion / sanitation / modernization projects in Madrid and the main cities of the Spanish empire

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I could get behind Charles III. He seems like an enlightened ruler. That would make for a Spain of an entirely different character. And being all skinny with a big nose, he's all set for looking cartoony.

It be cool if Ferdinand and Isabella were co-regents in the game. It'd be extra work for the animators, but definitely something different than usual.

Yeah, I've been harping on the co-regents thing for weeks now. I hope they do that, but I highly doubt it.

Felipe II would be neat.

MrRadar said:

Speaking about novelties, how about putting a royal couple at the helm of Spain, the Christian Monarchs Isabella and Ferdinand II(V)? Like it was? As I understand, Spain as a unified country emerged from the union of Castile and Aragon. Both monarchs shared power. The Reconquest was completed under them both, they both gave Columbus the ships to go westwards. And the announced Conquistador unit suits the time period perfectly. Besides, what better opportunity you could find to achieve perfect gender equality ?

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Because Ferdinand could have died moments after his marriage to Isabella and no one would have noticed or missed him?

I personally hope for Isabella. She was a strong ruler and an interesting person, and she reigned at just the point when my interest in history begins to fade rapidly. They could really shake things up and have Abd al-Rahman III as Spain's leader. >_>

Antonio Banderas.

Zaarin said:

Because Ferdinand could have died moments after his marriage to Isabella and no one would have noticed or missed him?

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Well, except for he was the one actively ending the reconquista and annexing Navarre, plus probably a major player behind the marital alliances that eventually would lead to the Hausgburgs (in order to help the fights Aragon had with France regarding the italian possesions). And well, he actually fought Philip I afterwards to retain possesion of Aragon... Yes, he would have gone unnoticed.

As for the rulers, I voted others... I'm imagining they can go wild and put someone as Sagasta, which was the president of spain at the time of the war with Teddy... Just a big, very unprobable guess... But hey, who knows?

Considering people's outcry against Cleopa tra and similar civs in the past, I doubt your argument against a Carlos is valid in relation to Firaxis. That shouldn't be the thrust of your argument against a specific leader. It's clear they value gameplay, personality and marketability over all else in leaders.

I didn't choose I'm completely ignorant of Spanish history but I wanted to point out that flaw in the argument based on people's perception of Cleo...

Could someone throw example of Agendas that Filip II or Charles V could have? Also who was in charge during the 30 years war? Mr Beach is a big fan of that era..

Haig said:

Could someone throw example of Agendas that Filip II or Charles V could have? Also who was in charge during the 30 years war? Mr Beach is a big fan of that era..

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For the 30 years war, it was already Philip III and Philip IV in charge, but in that case, you might actually want this man as a leader.

And Richelieu for France... these two were the two main heads playing chess with Europe at that time.


Charles V agenda would be probably to be the biggest civ in its own continent - disliking and battling the competing player for the major spot, and trying to ally with smaller civs and explore/expand in overseas lands. He would not be strictly religión-focused)

Philip II agenda will be more religión focused, probably. He was more involved than its father. He will not be a fanatical religión spreader, but probably dislike anyone who changes its state religión (as a defiance of authority). He should be probably resource-hungry as well, trying to settle resource-rich spots in free continents, and won't shy out of maintainging a bit (peacekeeping) military, despite its costs.

I know people may be a bit tired of Isabella, but I do think she is the strongest choice for Spanish leader. In her role as queen, she presided over (and it is generally agreed that she was far more influential than her husband) three events which dramatically reshaped Spanish history: the unification of Spain, the discovery of the New World, and the expulsion of religious minorities. She was really the one who brought Spain into the European community--but at the same time left it with a legacy of religious intolerance. And her indirect impact on the New World was of course even more significant. I don't think any other Spanish leaders can compare.

In Civ terms, she's an interesting and distinctive leader, probably with bonuses to exploration and a fanatical personality. And her gender has to be important to Firaxis. The developers have stated numerous times that they want to include female leaders, and Isabella is one who is also extremely important to her nation's history.

The inclusion of Hojo Tokimune as leader of Japan gives me hope to see constant repeating leaders given a well deserved rest, and Isabella is one of them.

I'm rooting for Felipe II, it could get interesting flavour as in expansive colonization and building a huge naval force.

Or they could go completely left field, and go with Juana I (Joanna the Mad), at least animation wise, would be really interesting.

Where's the option for the real leader? Angela Merkel.

ehecatzin said:

I'm rooting for Felipe II, it could get interesting flavour as in expansive colonization and building a huge naval force.:

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They could certainly do well with Philip II and making Spain the naval civ that England is in Civ V. Then, England in Civ VI could either become a culture civ under Elizabeth or an industry/science civ under Vicky (or military under Richard the Lionheart, for something completely new - but I don't expect they'd switch out two, prime, female candidates for rulers).

Haig said:

Could someone throw example of Agendas that Filip II or Charles V could have? Also who was in charge during the 30 years war? Mr Beach is a big fan of that era..

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Philiph II's agenda: Damn you England, damn you to hell!

Now talking seriously:

Philiph II's agenda: Defender of the faith

Very simple: Everyone that will share his religion will be a friend and possibly an ally too, while everyone who doesn't will be his sworn enemy, with the final goal of unifying his own continent under a single faith. Also, he will have a penchant for defending every single territory under his control, he doesn't have a concept of an "expendable" colony nor ally, which might end up be counter productive to his interests, but really good for you if you share his faith.

Charles V agenda: Universal monarchy

The ultimate REX-er, Charles V's empire will try to cover every single unclaimed tiny piece of the map, with a heavy focus in exploration in order to find said pieces of land (he was the patron of Magaellan's voyage, afterall). He will expand like a madman, but will try to do it peacefully, though. He will also try to ally every single CS that borders his empire, and will seek alliances with neighbours. If the peaceful method for expansion doesn't works, however, there will be more, hum, expeditive ones. In short, he will be a wonderful ally, but a huge pain in the ass to have as a neighbour.

Eagle Pursuit said:

I could get behind Charles III. He seems like an enlightened ruler. That would make for a Spain of an entirely different character. And being all skinny with a big nose, he's all set for looking cartoony.

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Yay, another Charles III fan! welcome to the club!

He was indeed the very model of an enlightened monarch, up to the point that French revolutionaries wrote that would have the French king would have been like Charles III, there wouldn't have been necessary a revolution in the first place. As for what I would dream this leader to be:

Charles III
Malaespina Expedition
Every discovered goodie hut, natural wonder and archeological expedition will yield a scalable amount of science, depending on its distance to your capital and your era

Unique ability: Our best Major, the King!
Your cities will be able to have 1 district more than their popullation would allow

Unique building: Military ordinance
Replaces military academy
Units will get additional XP according to the cultural output of your city


Agenda: Kingmaker

Just as it happened in the real life, Charles III will have a standing army and fleet ready to ally with the weaker rival in order to keep in check the more powerful one: The real Charles III mantained a land army "big enough to defeat the French, if allied with Britain" and a navy "big enough to defeat the British, if allied with France".