Windows 8

SiLL said:

It makes me glad you say that But see that is what IMO is subconsciously at work here. Even if people don't articulate it as nuanced and rather go with "RAAAARAGH". What RAAARAGH carries is the emotion that Windows 8 takes a piss on what desktop users need for the sake of metro which means for sake of trying to squeeze more money out of people in the vein Apple successfully does. Which means Apps and a coherent virtual environment for tablet, PC and phone (and mp3/small-video-player in the case of apple).
You have people complaining that metro is the default start-screen. That is exactly what I describe. Which is Microsoft's effort to enforce Metro onto them for the sake of profit hopes. And fully rightfully, desktop users reject this try as not tailored to their actual consumer wishes. As a symbol of taking a piss at their consumer wishes. Does it matter if that piss is a piss in comparison to Windows 7 or what Windows 8 could have been? It is a piss and recognized as such.

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I don't think that stance is really compatible with RAAAARAGH, even if you think Metro is worthless, and you don't care for a single desktop improvement, at the very worst you're left with an OS that's pretty much identical to Windows 7.

Hating a product that's no worse than an older product simply because it's not better for your specific use cases is kind of nuts, it's like having a raging hatred of a 2008 model Ford Focus because they added Bluetooth and more comfortable seats instead of increasing the horsepower and fuel efficiency over the 2007 model.

I'm not sure how much the claim that MS neglected the desktop mode even stands up, if you're looking at actual features rather than just assuming they could have thrown all the man-hours from Metro into the desktop for more improvements. The Windows 8 desktop is more of an improvement over the Windows 7 desktop than the Windows 7 desktop was over the Windows Vista desktop, and it's not like Windows is missing vital features compared to competing operating systems.

SiLL said:

That is rather easy, actually. In Windows 7, through the start-button, you have easy access to all relevant system configurations. In Windows 8, you need to open metro and there search for the demanded system configuration. The default system configuration is also in metro and is exceedingly dumped-down.
Sure, you can get the job done with a little effort, but Windows 7 offers a far more comfortable way to do so. Why does Windows 8 not? To get you to use Metro...

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I'm not really sure what you mean.

In Windows 7 you push the windows key, type the setting you want, or "contr" if you don't know the name, and hit enter.

In Windows 8 you push the windows key (+W), type the setting you want, or "contr" if you don't know the name, and hit enter.

Splitting up unified search into Q/W/F is probably the Win8 change I have the weakest retort for (though it's unrelated to Metro, so I won't accept the absence of unified search as a criticism of Metro); I find it works fine after you get used to it.

In general I find both the start menu and start screen to be roughly comparably bad, Quicksilver is my favorite launcher.

Zelig said:

These are either crazy people or people who don't understand Windows.

Please explain a single thing that the Metro UI prevents you from doing as well in Windows 8 as you're able to do in Windows 7.

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Thank you for your irreverent opinion!

Tommy Vercetti said:

Thank you for your irreverent opinion!

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You're welcome. All my opinions are irreverent, I care about objective truths, not about making people who require education feel justified about their ignorance and mistaken beliefs.

Zelig said:

You're welcome. All my opinions are irreverent, I care about objective truths, not about making people who require education feel justified about their ignorance and mistaken beliefs.

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I sure as hell am not ignorant, I just hate Windows 8.


Another user with a valid point.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AX1h3QqJsGg

Tommy Vercetti said:

I sure as hell am no ignorant, I just hate Windows 8.

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But you still haven't provided anything that Windows 8 does worse than Windows 7.

Tommy Vercetti said:

I sure as hell am no ignorant, I just hate Windows 8.


Another user with a valid point.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AX1h3QqJsGg

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You do realize anecdotal evidence doesn't really count for much in an argument, right? In what way is that youtuber representative of the whole of the monumentally large pc user body? Also how does this one amateur upend the already submitted positive articles from 3 of the most well-respected (professional) tech websites on the internet?

Owen Glyndwr said:

You do realize anecdotal evidence doesn't really count for much in an argument, right? In what way is that youtuber representative of the whole of the monumentally large pc user body? Also how does this one amateur upend the already submitted positive articles from 3 of the most well-respected (professional) tech websites on the internet?

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That is just one example of many on YouTube. A LOT of Anti Windows 8 stuff out there I will provide another example of anti Windows 8 stuff.

Tommy Vercetti said:

That is just one example of many on YouTube. A LOT of Anti Windows 8 stuff out there I will provide another example of anti Windows 8 stuff.

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I'm not opening your links, provide your own examples here. So far you've provided zero examples.

Zelig said:

I'm not opening your links, provide your own examples here. So far you've provided zero examples.

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I don't NEED to. That simple

Tommy Vercetti said:

I don't NEED to. That simple

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No, you CAN'T, because there isn't anything that Windows 8 does worse than Windows 7.

Tommy Vercetti said:

That is just one example of many on YouTube. A LOT of Anti Windows 8 stuff out there I will provide another example of anti Windows 8 stuff.

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This is the worst application of a "meme" I have ever seen in my life. And I frequent the Funniest Pictures and gifs threads.

Zelig: the Windows 8 UI is bad. And ugly. People don't need to go into details related to functionality.

Seems familiar?

Iranon said:

Zelig: the Windows 8 UI is bad. And ugly. People don't need to go into details related to functionality.

Seems familiar?

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Metro, or the desktop UI?

Because Metro is completely ignorable, I think people who think the desktop UI is bad simply have no eye for design and were probably the same people who liked the XP Fisher-Price look.

Honestly, it seems like people who are vehemently criticizing Metro are mixing up Windows 8 and Windows RT.

Iranon said:

Zelig: the Windows 8 UI is bad. And ugly. People don't need to go into details related to functionality.

Seems familiar?

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You make a very good point when the very basic user interface in annoying as hell it can kill any good that an OS has going for it when you can't use it that well.

Tommy Vercetti said:

You make a very good point when the very basic user interface in annoying as hell it can kill any good that an OS has going for it when you can't use it that well.

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What's a specific part of the UI which you can't use as well as Windows 7?

Zelig said:

What's a specific part of the UI which you can't use as well as Windows 7?

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The whole UI is just ANNOYING to use. So many things you can't do in Metro, multitasking for example SUCKS in Metro. That was a strong point of Windows for YEARS and now its a WEAKNESS. Does that not seem like a fundamental flaw to you or are you too much of a fanboy of whats new to not realize this. Game devlopers hate Windows 8, Valve and Blizzard have both spoken out against it.

You don't need to use Metro for anything.

Tommy Vercetti said:

The whole UI is just ANNOYING to use. So many things you can't do in Metro, multitasking for example SUCKS in Metro. That was a strong point of Windows for YEARS and now its a WEAKNESS. Does that not seem like a fundamental flaw to you or are you too much of a fanboy of whats new to not realize this.

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Multitasking works exactly the same as Windows 7 on the desktop, click windows, their icons on the system tray, or use alt+tab to switch between them.

Multitasking is actually better than Windows 7 on the desktop for power users, since you can now have separate taskbars on each monitor for that monitor's windows.

Try again, you failed with that example.

I've told you before, my primary desktop OS is Mac OS, I'm hardly a Windows fanboy.

Let's see if we can get you to produce an actual argument:
Why does multitasking suck? What feature does Win7 have that Win8 doesn't have that makes multitasking not suck?

Zelig said:

Iranon said:

Zelig: the Windows 8 UI is bad. And ugly. People don't need to go into details related to functionality.

Seems familiar?

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Metro, or the desktop UI?

Because Metro is completely ignorable, I think people who think the desktop UI is bad simply have no eye for design and were probably the same people who liked the XP Fisher-Price look.

Honestly, it seems like people who are vehemently criticizing Metro are mixing up Windows 8 and Windows RT.

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In case you didn't realise, that was a direct echo to your take on every "Linux UI". Either personal taste is enough to dismiss a GUI or it isn't and one should point out what doesn't work in actual use.
To answer your question: Desktop.

Stylistically out of place fondleslab UI elements (start screen, charms bar)
Ergonomically out of place fondleslab UI elements (same)
Leftover bling on the desktop that clashes with the new aesthetic
Even more duplication in settings screens.
Weird locations for basic functions like shutting down.

If a failure to clean up existing inconsistencies counts, there is more.
Icons: Every historic Windows UI style is represented.
Settings layout: You can enable feature x here, but to disable it you have to go somewhere else.
Settings hierarchy: Click on something completely unrelated on the way (at least searching usually works now)
Font rendering (harsh and distorted too, but that's justifiable for sharpness' sake. Inconsistent rendering between different formats isn't)

Nice ad hominem by the way. My reactions to default Windows UIs:
Win95 is functional and honest enough to be inoffensive even today, XP was beyond tacky, Vista tried too hard to be pretty and sacrificed comfort, Seven was a fair evolution of its predecessor and borrowed useful UI quirks from other OSes in a fresh way.

There are some really good ideas in the Windows 8 UI, both aesthetically and functionally.
Signage is familiar to everyone, easy to pull off, already has conventions that are good UI practice.
Improved keyboard interaction alone makes earlier Windows versions hard to accept now.

The things that have most people up in arms aren't blunders so much as compromises necessitated by conflicting goals:
Make something that works on different form factors, without totally redesigning the familiar desktop, while keeping duplicated functionality somewhat in check and making the whole beast feel somewhat coherent.