I liked to play as the Celts in C4 Warlords and C5 G+K. I recently installed BNW via steam, updating C5 without G+K (lost serial key). If I were to buy G+K from Steam and install to my account would this make the G+K civs playable in BNW or am I limited to the set BNW civs? Thanks in advance to anyone who can advise.
Celts and BNW
- Thread starter Seabhac
- Start date
troublmaker
Warlord
You get all the civs from G+K in BNW as well as all DLC ones you purchase. Should be noted however that the balance of them changes in BNW. The Celts for example are particularly underpowered in a world in which religion doesn't matter much.
bonafide11
Worker
I disagree with the "religion doesn't matter much" thing a lot. Celts are actually quite powerful in BNW I believe. Their UU isn't too useful anymore though since early wars are non-existent, but you'll get some extra faith from fighting barbarians at least.
troublmaker
Warlord
You gave no good reason why religion is good except for the fact that you can get some "extra religion" from barbarians. That doesn't mean religion is good it means you get religion from barbarians which would only be good if religion was good.
Religion (faith) is very flexible resource, crucial for culture win, especially on higher difficulty level. The way that the new piety tree in BNW means either a very powerful religion or minimal religion investment. Celts should be played with a very powerful religion in mind.
And you gave no reasons as to why it wasn't good =)
It swings both ways, if you don't give any reasoning for why you feel it's bad, why should other people give it because they disagree with you ?
Religion is not bad:
Tithe could score additional 50GPT. Maybe it is not important for pro players. But for all lesser folks being able to buy one more factory or research labs is decent enought.
Pagodas are just overcomplicated colosseums, however being able to get it instantly (without hammers) and even get some faith back as well as culture is nice.
When playing for VC cathedrals and religious art are both nice.
From the other side:
Higher difficulties are front loaded, which also undermine chances to get desired religion.
Piety branch is not good starter. And is not important as getting faith giving pantheon.
Early wars are undermine, so having early UU is less useful. Honor is a bad tree. Diplomacy hit for wars is harsh.
For every good belief there is one with just half the power.
Tithe could score additional 50GPT. Maybe it is not important for pro players. But for all lesser folks being able to buy one more factory or research labs is decent enought.
Pagodas are just overcomplicated colosseums, however being able to get it instantly (without hammers) and even get some faith back as well as culture is nice.
When playing for VC cathedrals and religious art are both nice.
From the other side:
Higher difficulties are front loaded, which also undermine chances to get desired religion.
Piety branch is not good starter. And is not important as getting faith giving pantheon.
Early wars are undermine, so having early UU is less useful. Honor is a bad tree. Diplomacy hit for wars is harsh.
For every good belief there is one with just half the power.
I think Religion is way better in BNW than it was in G&K... The reformation beliefs are great... It's always OP to get the Jesuit education... It's an instant boost to science when you get to education... And you can go to Oxford right away (if you planned ahead).
The other ones are cool too, and you can use anyone of them to get a good advantage in the game.
I think the Celts are a great civ in BNW, but the opener must be some combination of Tradition + Piety.
The other ones are cool too, and you can use anyone of them to get a good advantage in the game.
I think the Celts are a great civ in BNW, but the opener must be some combination of Tradition + Piety.
Do keep in mind (at least to my knowledge) jesuit education also grants its boon to other civs, so it might not be a good idea to spread your religion too aggressively when you get that reformation belief.
Arachnofiend
Perturbed Pugilist
- Joined
- Oct 5, 2012
- Messages
- 1,950
Here's why religion is good: purchasing great people with faith is a massively powerful tool no matter what you're doing. The Celts can get a lot more faith than most other civs by going wide, which requires a lot of happiness, and religion is the best way to get a lot of extra happiness pre-ideologies.
bonafide11
Worker
That wasn't a reason why religion was good, that was a reason why the Celts UU kind of sucks now (because it's only useful against barbarians).
The reason why religion is good is because it provides you with a large amount of benefits in various aspects of the game. No matter what type of victory you're going for, having a religion can help you with gold, happiness, great people, military, etc. There's a ton of bonuses you can get from religion that are not available without it.
Gyra Solune
King
- Joined
- Jul 1, 2013
- Messages
- 942
Religion is less of a vital yield and more of a long-scale tool to be used. It's flexible and very powerful if invested in right, but it's not critical, and pushing it too much may be a bad idea if you can't get good benefits from it. The Celts though are religious powerhouses, basically guaranteed to get the first pantheon, and, in the early game, will be crushing the religion game with barely any effort, provided there's lots of forest territory. They're easily a civ that benefits most from a Piety start, mostly because they start with a Faith output from turn 1. And with that Piety start, kicking off an early Pict-fueled war is very possible, mostly because of Theocracy, one of two Ancient-era policies that give Gold (Monarchy is the other, and might give less, as it only applies to the capital, and up until, say, Civil Service, it'll likely only give maybe 4 GPT at most, whereas Theocracy can increase gold output in every city provided they have a Temple), alongside the numerous Gold-boosting Founder beliefs a Religion gives. Celidh Hall helps manage a bigger empire if you've acquired one by that point, but honestly it should come earlier and be an Amphitheater replacement, Renaissance is a touch late and unfitting for the Celts (same with Persia, Satrap court should replace Market).
They're definitely a fun and potent civ, viewed mostly as weak because of the fact that Faith doesn't provide much up-front, and has more fixed, specific ways to use it.
They're definitely a fun and potent civ, viewed mostly as weak because of the fact that Faith doesn't provide much up-front, and has more fixed, specific ways to use it.
