New Victory Condition ideas

What other victory conditions would you like to see in a new civ game or expansion pack?

How about:
Wonderful victory: Control 30 world wonders or build 20 world wonders.
Religious victory - Your religion is adopted by the majority of cities in every civilisation in the world.
victory in blood - destroy 1000 enemy units. (maybe 500, or somewhere in between, would have to play to find out)
victory of greatness - Expend 30 great people (maybe 40?)
Awesome city - Have a city with 50 pop, 50 faith, 200 science, 200 culture, 200 hammers, 200 gold.
golden victory - generate 200,000 gold over the course of the game, or be in a golden age for 150 turns over the course of the game.

I'd like to see a religious victory but I think with that we'd have basically all of the focuses covered.

I'd like to see a change to the current diplo victory, giving actual civs more power and CS's less.

Then there would be room for an economic victory, but it would have to be planned very carefully so that the AI bonuses wouldn't just hand it to them every game past Prince.

Religious victory would be nice as a part of a religion overhaul. There is an issue when religion stops being the focus of faith at any point, and right now that happens pretty early.

The absence of religious victory condition is baffling. Surely a religion that controls 75% of the world population, or 75% of its cash flow or something should be good enough to have "won" the game.

Yep, religious victory.

Seabastian Civ said:

The absence of religious victory condition is baffling. Surely a religion that controls 75% of the world population, or 75% of its cash flow or something should be good enough to have "won" the game.

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I think the idea was that religion was supposed to be a means to help you to your other victory rather than a condition in itself. One can agree or disagree with that I suppose. I think most bases are covered with current conditions. I wouldn't mind a religious victory myself, having your religion dominate in all capitals could work.

Diplomatic victory needs tweaking like someone mentioned above. One shouldn't get a vote from each allied city state (allied on the last turn to make it worse), that makes it too easy to buy out majority of votes and just DoW everybody one turn before voting. Making CS votes need to go to the civ they've been allied to for the longest has been suggested, but that will make it very hard to change votes in late game. Another possibility would be to make it so that CS not give a vote each, but that the person with most CS allies get perhaps 2 votes, the person with next-most get 1 vote (the number of positions could depend on map size, on larger maps there could be 3-2-1, on smaller maps only 1), this would make votes from other civs relatively more important.

I also think that Cultural victory needs tweaking. I find that CV is very hard to achieve compared to Diplomatic/Science, even if I focus strictly on it right from beginning of game, I frequently find I either lose to AI or reach one of the other VC before I get CV.

kaspergm said:

I think the idea was that religion was supposed to be a means to help you to your other victory rather than a condition in itself. One can agree or disagree with that I suppose. I think most bases are covered with current conditions. I wouldn't mind a religious victory myself, having your religion dominate in all capitals could work.

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I guess faith is like science (no irony intended). You can use it to get a militaristic edge and buildings, but that doesn't mean your going for a science victory. I think you should have two options for faith, too. Leverage, or glory.

Money rules the world in its own right, so I'm for an economic victory, too.
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Stupid truth always resisting simplicity.
-John Green

Like most people here have suggested since GnK has been released.

Religious Victory

- Your Religion is adopted by 75% of all foreign Cities in the world.

- Allows you to commission a Unification Council. Similar build times to Utopia Project, requires a Great Prophet to begin.

I'd like to see a 'complete domination" requirement, as opposed to the current capital cities only. With this it would be nice to have the possibility of switching capital cities like in Civ IV, so many times I want to move my capital to a better city but can't. Also, having to take all cities other than just capitals would make domination a lot more fun and challenging - also historically accurate, how often does a nation simply give up just because their capital has been taken? unless they're french..

woodshadows said:

I'd like to see a 'complete domination" requirement, as opposed to the current capital cities only. With this it would be nice to have the possibility of switching capital cities like in Civ IV, so many times I want to move my capital to a better city but can't. Also, having to take all cities other than just capitals would make domination a lot more fun and challenging - also historically accurate, how often does a nation simply give up just because their capital has been taken? unless they're french..

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There is a "complete kill" option if I'm not mistaken, which will require you to take not only capital but all cities to win domination. But you still can't change capital, obviously.

kaspergm said:

Making CS votes need to go to the civ they've been allied to for the longest has been suggested, but that will make it very hard to change votes in late game.

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If you play without a target, going to space can be out of the question by the time you reach the modern era, and you may be out of the game for cultural by the medieval era.

I don't particularly like the idea myself, but an idea that would be hard to reach if not playing for it by late game doesn't bother me at all, if the proper solution forced you to think about it from early on.

Economic Victory - Control 66% of the available resources of at least 3 different strategic resources on the planet (Example: 2/3rds the world's Horses, Coal and Aluminum) You can't wage war on a country if you need to purchase resources from it right?

Religious Victory - 2/3 of the cities or world's population follows your religion. Build "World Church" building = victory. Unlocked via "radio" technology.

Rooftrellen said:

If you play without a target, going to space can be out of the question by the time you reach the modern era, and you may be out of the game for cultural by the medieval era.

I don't particularly like the idea myself, but an idea that would be hard to reach if not playing for it by late game doesn't bother me at all, if the proper solution forced you to think about it from early on.

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That is a good point.

Conquest victory - Where you have to control a certain percentage of the map to win.

Capture the capital - If a civs capital is captured it is out of the game.

adsin15 said:

Economic Victory - Control 66% of the available resources of at least 3 different strategic resources on the planet (Example: 2/3rds the world's Horses, Coal and Aluminum) You can't wage war on a country if you need to purchase resources from it right?

Religious Victory - 2/3 of the cities or world's population follows your religion. Build "World Church" building = victory. Unlocked via "radio" technology.

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Some good points here.

I've hinted in several other threads that religion is, as it stands, a means but not an end. Some of the suggestions for the conditions seem to make it too easy. I fear it will become the next diplomatic victory, a back-door that's always open (provided you found a religion.) Perhaps if they lowered the number of religions that can be founded from, say, roughly 60% of total civs (5 religions for 8 civs) to roughly 40% (3 religions for 8 civs, and included the condition of needing to control all holy cities. This would make religions more competitive to attain, make it a viable option to found more than 1 religion (at least at lower levels) and the focus of belief choices may shift from what they are now (almost exclusively happiness and gold with a side order of culture) to more diversity. Would make religious focus games more bloody, but um.... check your history books.

Also strongly in favor of economic victory but acknowledge that I apparently don't represent the average sample set. Some of my most fun experiences with TBS games were SMAC games as Morgan cornering the energy market, but as Sid's games haven't included this option since then, I can only assume that it wasn't popular with the majority.

In any case, I'd like more balancing in the difficulty of attaining and the score generated from the current and newly proposed victory conditions.

...Wouldn't fewer religions actually make things more peaceful? You'd have more civs without their own religion, areas that you can spread to and get a diplomatic bonus for sharing a religion.

Crafty Bison said:

Wonderful victory: Control 30 world wonders or build 20 world wonders.

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I'm not sure when building a ton of wonders would be counted as a major victory. If anything, building wonders is in pursuit of a victory, not a victory itself.

Religious victory - Your religion is adopted by the majority of cities in every civilisation in the world.

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Yes.

victory in blood - destroy 1000 enemy units. (maybe 500, or somewhere in between, would have to play to find out)

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Maybe in CivIV a 1000 units would be feasible. Not in CivV. Not that this is a good idea for a victory since it basically demands constant warring without going for a victory.

victory of greatness - Expend 30 great people (maybe 40?)
Awesome city - Have a city with 50 pop, 50 faith, 200 science, 200 culture, 200 hammers, 200 gold.
golden victory - generate 200,000 gold over the course of the game, or be in a golden age for 150 turns over the course of the game.

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Eh, I have the same problems with these as I do with with the first one. If you generate 200k gold over the course of the game, you won a diplo victory. If you have a city with 50 pop/faith, whatever, you probably could swing for any victory you want. 30 great people? Used to go for another victory.

The reason I like the religious one is that it feels like a victory, not a path to a victory.

Ya I was just spamming a load of ideas and the exact numbers could all easily be changed (especially as very little thought went into them). I do quite like the idea of the wonder one though, provides an alternative to the same old culture game. Plus I can't imagine the conditions I set would make it an easy get out vc. Plus if you wonder hoard more civ's resent you and will DoW (especially if you've not had time to build big military).

My Idea for a religious victory:

66% of the world's cities follow your religion (10 turns).
66% of the world's population follow your religion (10 turns).
No other religion is followed by more than 10% of the world's population (10 turns).
At least 2 other religions have existed for 1000 years.

The first two are not automatically alike. I've had games where I converted a huge amount of population in different cities without pushing it to the majority for diplomatic reasons, and it's also possible to have a lot of cities that are 51% your religion, giving you almost all the cities with just over half the population.

For religious unity, it might be a good idea if no other religion were so powerful either. If a third of the world is another religion, that religion likely has enough power to resist becoming your followers still, so the other religions must be a major minority.

The last requirement makes sure you don't get an auto win on a duel map for going with the Celts, and also ensures that everyone has a fighting chance against someone that goes totally crazy on religion from the start.

I still think for this to work, religion would need to be changed, however. Even with a VC, religion would generally be quite ignorable for most of the game, with how it is currently set up to die out. In fact, going for a religious victory would favor someone without much science, which just isn't right, so religion would really need to change with the times, rather than fade away.

As I've said before, in other threads, however, I'm at a total loss for why it fades away anyway (game play first, historical accuracy second, but...it's both inaccurate AND takes away something that could add to game play) but it would need to be changed to develop though the ages, so more advanced people could still go for the victory as well as less advanced neighbors.