Warmonger looking for advice

JunglistGuy

Chieftain
Joined
Sep 16, 2015
Messages
13
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Canada
Hey all, been reading these forums for 4-5 years, decided to join finally lol. Anyways, the way I like to play Civ is by waging war, I currently play on warlord(I'm not very good player) and have a win rate of about 25-30%, looking to better myself and move onto higher difficulties before trying multiplayer...I mostly played Warlords but now play BTS since a friend finally got it :p

I play as Washington, almost always on a huge continental map, epic speed, conquest victory and no city flipping from culture(it pissed me off too much in one game lol)

Since I play conquest only I find one of the most important things to me is research, as a general rule of thumb I try to never let it go below 80%, having it at 70% for a little while, if I run 60% or below for too long I usually quit.

The way I tech up once I get past the opening (the first few techs you research is pretty straight forward depending on city placement) is going straight for important military tech, and once hitting a couple milestones I have set I go back and grab some key economic ones to help boost the economy. I tend to wage a war shortly after hitting certain points in military tech as I have no problem out teching the AI up until 17-1900AD.

The way I build my empire is pretty standard I feel, found cities near resources and try to found on tiles where it is easier to specialize...all mines around you for hammers, plains with a gold coin for gold and then some food towns. I generally build a cottage on every tile except ones where I can have a farm produce a full loaf of bread(this excludes my first city as I build 2-3 farms to help population growth)

The civics I usually take are Universal Suffrage (cottage spam plus extra hammer I find is nice...usually get pyramid wonder to unlock this right away or I take Hereditary until then), Nationhood(usually take no civic until this due to high upkeep), Slavery(never changes), Free Markets(usually don't take a diff civic until I can get this) and Organized Religion(which usually never changes since I mostly end up founding Christianity or spread my nations religion I adopt)

I try and trade with everyone I can until people start getting upset about it and this helps me stay in the green. I always try and make at least 1-2 friends for war allies(I usually play with 11-12 AIs)

One thing I do do that I haven't seen mentioned in the forums yet (perhaps one of my weaknesses) is I usually keep almost all the cities I capture. I find this helps expand my economy(even though you take a hit when you first capture a city, I typically am busy rolling through others, growing the coffers enough to withstand the negative impact until either the war ends or it starts making me more gold) I find this also helps me pump out units really well as I almost always end up in 1-3 wars of pure attrition. Also this prevents the AIs taking over the land and I find it is far easier to monitor a continents entire coast line in the mid-late game preventing amphibious attacks on the homeland...

One thing I am really bad at in this game is building wonders...most of my wonders end up not completing and I get gold. I always try and read what resource helps speed production if any do.

I also have a habit of building a road on a tile after the improvement is made...is this bad? Do roads increase the commerce generated? Do people play conquest only multiplayer?

Any points would help.
 
Some things to consider:
1. Don't worry about the percentage allocated to research. If you only build one city you'll be able to keep the slider at 100%, but likely won't be generating nearly as much research as a civ with 8 cities at, say, 50%. Instead, worry about the total beakers generated per turn. A good target is 200/turn by 1 AD. This can be generated by specialists, as well as from the percentage slider. If you have lots of cities and are losing money, you can build wealth (once you learn Currency) to keep afloat.

2. Not quite sure what you mean by specializing cities. Production cities need mines and farms. Science cities need cottages on green tiles, rivers, and enough food to work all the cottages. You should only need 1 or 2 'food cities' to generate great people (and possibly for drafting). These cities would be all farms. If you're putting cottages around all cities, you're doing it wrong.

3. You only need roads to connect cities and non-riverside resources.

4. Using Pyramids to run Representation is usually better than Universal Suffrage; you won't have Towns by the time Pyramids are built.

5. If you trade with everyone, it's harder to make friends, and you usually end up with everyone being indifferent to you. You're better off making friends with one group (say, a religious bloc in your religion) and exploiting them for gifts, war alliances, etc, and ignoring all others, as opposed to trying to keep everyone happy.
 
Usually I am not losing money, and I never go totally bankrupt. Is it better to build wealth after say you've built a bank and other buildings that have similar effects? Is it possible to stop building wealth after telling a city to do so?

By specialize I mean I will build a city surrounded by mines and click the hammer button, I guess that is emphasizing lol. 1-2 'food cities' is a general rule I play by, although I don't usually spawn many great people...any idea why that is? I don't put cottages around all cities, but most cities have many cottages as I try to have a few cities focused on production to get units out quickly, the couple food cities and the rest are trying to make bank...

Ok, I usually end up with a road, and then railroad on every tile lol

Alright, but it is wise to go to Suffrage when you have towns, correct?

I'll keep that in mind since most of my trading now is done based on who can give me the most gold per turn lol...

Thanks man
 
Go to the S&T forum and post a learning game--you'll get lots of advice if you play the learning game slowly enough.

Recommended settings for a learning game: Standard game speed/normal sized map/no huts/no events/default number of AIs.

Post a screen shot of your starting location and the 4000BC save. Wait for comments. Play a few (10 or so) turns. Post screen shot(s) and save. Wait for comments. Repeat.

You can play a separate game for fun while doing the learning game, but make sure you play the learning game very slowly to allow others on the forum to give you advice.
 
Regarding civics, Slavery is extremely powerful and is generally the strongest choice. I only drop it to run Caste System during a Golden Age, or when everyone's adopting Emancipation and the :( is unmanageable. (By now, I've usually mostly electrified, so the whip isn't quite as useful.)

The Legal civics are well worth the upkeep. A satellite city can produce Wealth to pay for Bureaucracy's upkeep; this in turn means your heavily cottaged Capital produces beakers almost as if it had two free observatories, and manufactures as if it had two free forges. I often beeline CS and stay in it all game. Add Oxford University and an Academy, and it's incredible :)

If you'e conquering, wonders are often best left to victims to build. I've had many a decent conquest game where a neighbour invested in the Great Wall or Stonehenge and my half dozen sentry axemen immediately converged on the piñata they've made for me. If there's a wonder you really want for yourself, there's a need for commitment - try to get the tech before the AI, and have a city with plenty of production to put into the project (and plenty of population to whip at the first opportunity!).

That gold you've found yourself getting after losing a race to build a wonder? That's a powerful source of income. If you have a wonder's complimentary resource, building it and stopping short to deliberately fail is like building Wealth with a heavy multiplier.

As a conqueror, are you making good use of Heroic Epic? Even in peaceful games, I place a high priority on a coastal (for Drydock) riverside (for levee) city and enough food to feed at least three mines that spends almost all game producing units. 'Speak softly, and carry a big stick'.
 
Hey all, been reading these forums for 4-5 years, decided to join finally lol. Anyways, the way I like to play Civ is by waging war, I currently play on warlord(I'm not very good player) and have a win rate of about 25-30%, looking to better myself and move onto higher difficulties before trying multiplayer...I mostly played Warlords but now play BTS since a friend finally got it :p

Welcome :band: [party] :band:
See we aren't that scary after all. :assimilate:
I play as Washington, almost always on a huge continental map, epic speed, conquest victory and no city flipping from culture(it pissed me off too much in one game lol)
Washington Expansive and charismatic with SEALS if things go that far.
Washington is not considered one of the top leaders for warmongering. Expansive is good for spreading your empire and charismatic helps you get a level four and five unit for the heroic epic and Westpoint sooner.
But you would be better to select a Culture that has a good early unique unit like the Persians with Immortals or Egyptians with their war chariots or Rome with its Huge 8 strength Prateorians. If you wanted to war slightly later there are a bunch of Civs with very strong Unique horse archer units and if you want to wait untill gunpowder Napoleon with Musketeers and cavalry can make very speedy advances.

Since I play conquest only I find one of the most important things to me is research, as a general rule of thumb I try to never let it go below 80%, having it at 70% for a little while, if I run 60% or below for too long I usually quit.

If you are just playing conquest at a certain point a lot of players turn down the research to 0% usually just after teching Millitary Tradition and gaining Cuirassiers

The way I tech up once I get past the opening (the first few techs you research is pretty straight forward depending on city placement) is going straight for important military tech, and once hitting a couple milestones I have set I go back and grab some key economic ones to help boost the economy. I tend to wage a war shortly after hitting certain points in military tech as I have no problem out teching the AI up until 17-1900AD.

As you have noticed wars of conquest come after tech mile stones
First a warrior rush at your nearest rival then waiting for bronze Working to implement slavery and whip out lots of axemen for your next target then waiting for Construction and catapults to crush the foes Higher cultural deference bowmen defended cities. Then Iron Working and swordsmen to assault cities with walls

This is where a strong early Unique Unit comes in giving you another wave of conquest
The way I build my empire is pretty standard I feel, found cities near resources and try to found on tiles where it is easier to specialize...all mines around you for hammers, plains with a gold coin for gold and then some food towns. I generally build a cottage on every tile except ones where I can have a farm produce a full loaf of bread(this excludes my first city as I build 2-3 farms to help population growth)
Yeah as Lennier says this is sub optimal and something I still make mistakes around each city has a size that it will be best to grow too. That is dependent on food mainly we should only grow our cities to a size that they are working good tiles and whip away population above that. it is best to only cottage riverside tiles floodplains and grasslands untill late in the game when certain civics or Biology boosted farming comes along, which will soon be about when you pass the conquest limit and win.

The civics I usually take are Universal Suffrage (cottage spam plus extra hammer I find is nice...usually get pyramid wonder to unlock this right away or I take Hereditary until then), Nationhood(usually take no civic until this due to high upkeep), Slavery(never changes), Free Markets(usually don't take a diff civic until I can get this) and Organized Religion(which usually never changes since I mostly end up founding Christianity or spread my nations religion I adopt)
Most people who build the pyramids switch to representation rather than US the thinking is the extra +3 :beakers: from specialists adding to research is better than the few :hammers: from US. You have to have a lot of towns to capitalize on US so it is better later on in the game.
Organized Religion is good when you are building or racing to a wonder but for Waring from the time you tech Feudalism untill you tech Bureaucracy you must consider going Vassalage and theocracy for the +4 (+6 with barracks) troops you can produce (the extra free support also helps in the higher levels).



I try and trade with everyone I can until people start getting upset about it and this helps me stay in the green. I always try and make at least 1-2 friends for war allies(I usually play with 11-12 AIs)

Thinking ahead diplomatically pays big dividends it is quite hard to see how much animosity you generate with your early trades in the standard interface but signing on to and trading with a religious block is typically the way to go.

One thing I do do that I haven't seen mentioned in the forums yet (perhaps one of my weaknesses) is I usually keep almost all the cities I capture. I find this helps expand my economy(even though you take a hit when you first capture a city, I typically am busy rolling through others, growing the coffers enough to withstand the negative impact until either the war ends or it starts making me more gold) I find this also helps me pump out units really well as I almost always end up in 1-3 wars of pure attrition. Also this prevents the AIs taking over the land and I find it is far easier to monitor a continents entire coast line in the mid-late game preventing amphibious attacks on the homeland...

Most people keep a lot of their captures but the AI is really bad at picking city sites so always open the city and have a good look at what you will be getting. A poorly sited city with no buildings will be a drain on the coffers for hundreds of years whereas razing it and then whipping a settler to found a better city will only cost the whipping city the lost opportunity cost of not whipping a pricey military unit instead.
Razing the city and founding a better one will probably be a better way of expanding your empire.
Don't worry about your rivals infilling a crap city inside your boundaries unlike in reallife your citizens dont care and if it is a weak city it will take forever to become a threat and if it ever does they have just built and improved a city for you
One thing I am really bad at in this game is building wonders...most of my wonders end up not completing and I get gold. I always try and read what resource helps speed production if any do.

Don't worry in the higher levels most wonders are built to get the fail-gold to buy and/or upgrade troops anyway
If you stick with Washington consider building Stonehenge the extra +1 happiness per city from the free monuments on top of the the +1 Happy you already get From being Charismatic is a good payoff from the cheapest wonder
  • I also have a habit of building a road on a tile after the improvement is made...is this bad?
  • Do roads increase the commerce generated?
  • Do people play conquest only multiplayer?
  • Any points would help
.

[*]You only need roads to connect a resource to your trade network. Only build the roads you absolutely need. Too hook up copper, horses or a happiness resource you need in the early game. The exception to this may be a military road to speed your troops to the enemy faster.Later on you can hook up the health resources and generally build roads. Early on worker turns are very valuable that is one of the advantages of your expansive trait don't squander it building unnecessary things.
[*]Roads do not generate commerce in CivIV it is one of the things done away with from Civ's 2 and 3.
[*] That is the way it works out. Even that rabid dog Montezuma pales in aggressiveness compared to the typical human player.

Usually I am not losing money, and I never go totally bankrupt. Is it better to build wealth after say you've built a bank and other buildings that have similar effects? Is it possible to stop building wealth after telling a city to do so?

Yes it is generally better to have a bank before building wealth Banks provide the better bonus % compared to their building cost over the market and grocer that are primarily built for their other effects.
in some cities with low Production you are better to build wealth strait away as the cost of building the bank first will not be amortized by the time you win.
As all ways in Civ some sooner is better than more later.
To stop building wealth (or research, culture) just put something else in the build que If you just want to build a couple of things and then revert to wealth use [CTRL] to put then in the front of Wealth in the cue and it will revert once they are built.

By specialize I mean I will build a city surrounded by mines and click the hammer button, I guess that is emphasizing lol. 1-2 'food cities' is a general rule I play by, although I don't usually spawn many great people...any idea why that is?
Your civilization is not philosophical so if you want a lot of GP you will have to work at it! By building the National Epic in a good city and running lots of specialists there.
You will often want 2 great people farms in addition to your capital one of them gets the National epic often the other goes for The Great Library to get the free scientists or the Pyramids or hanging gardens (both early in your tech path) to get Great Engineer slots
I don't put cottages around all cities, but most cities have many cottages as I try to have a few cities focused on production to get units out quickly, the couple food cities and the rest are trying to make bank...

  • Ok, I usually end up with a road, and then railroad on every tile lol
  • Alright, but it is wise to go to Suffrage when you have towns, correct?
  • I'll keep that in mind since most of my trading now is done based on who can give me the most gold per turn lol...
Thanks man

Ps Be seeing you over in the S&T forum
 
Yes it is generally better to have a bank before building wealth
This is not true in most cases. The purpose with building wealth is to be able to keep science slider at a higher rate. The higher the slider, the less benefit you get from a bank. If you have slider at 100%, which is possible most of the time in the late game thanks to other sources of gold, a bank does nothing for you at all. Let's say you are slightly worse off and average slider at 80% and have a city with 20 base commerce. On normal speed the bank costs 200:hammers: and gives an average return of 0,2*20*0,5 = 2:gold:/turn. That's 100 turns before it has payed back the building cost compared to building wealth instead. And by building wealth, you get those 200:gold: 100 turns earlier to get the benefit earlier, which is a lot more valuable. Even if the city had triple the base commerce and the payback time was 33 turns, I'd still easily prefer wealth (or actually rather military units) in a conquest game. Banks are only really worth it in cities that have sources of :gold: income that are independent of slider position, like shrines or corporate headquarters.
 
Thanks Testhero, a lot of info there man! In a game I am playing with a friend I have built the national and heroic epics in different cities, that game is going alright...Sitting Bull is a bit challenging for my noob ass.


elitetroops - so you're saying it is pretty wise to build wealth early on to keep a high slider?

I am starting to see in my games why people say conquest victories should come before the modern age lol
 
elitetroops - so you're saying it is pretty wise to build wealth early on to keep a high slider?
Pretty wise is relative... I'm saying building wealth is more wise than many of the other options you have available to you.

If you always end up in the modern era before winning, one of the main reasons is probably that you value future gain too much over immediate gain. There are a lot of buildings that seem good, because they add a benefit that seems to make your empire stronger. However, most of these are actually only slowing you down. You get caught in a building cycle where you see available buildings that would be good to have everywhere to make you stronger, and while building those more buildings become available and so on, and before you notice you are in the modern era and have done nothing to win the game.

The good player looks at the situation, thinks what do I need to win this and starts aiming for the win immediately, skipping everything that won't help with the win. In conquest games this usually means reaching a certain military tech that allows you to kill everyone. A science/gold boosting building that won't pay back the hammer cost until you've reached this target tech is not worth building. On difficulties up to immortal Military Tradition and cuirassiers is usually a quite safe bet to win the game. Normally you would get there before you have banking, so banks should not play any part in such games. On lower levels, like warlord, a lot less than cuirs will do. As long as you build enough units and don't waste hammers on buildings that are slowing you down.

Also, don't know if you do it, but saying it because so many players stuck at the lower levels make this mistake.. don't build unnecessary units for defense. Most cities will never need anything more than a single warrior to avoid "we fear for our safety" unhappiness. If you have 2 longbows in every city, you have wasted a huge amount of hammers.
 
@JunglistGuy- I have a request for you. Open the civilopedia to the buildings section, and write down the hammers needed to construct every non wonder building that can built constructed in a single city. Add up all those hammers, then divide by the number of hammers that is needed to build an elephant, or horse archer, or praetorian, or cuirs, or rifleman. See how many military units you can produce instead of buildings in a single city. Then consider that in regards to how many cities you have. You cannot conquer other civs with buildings. But all those units that are produced instead of buildings can win you the game between 1000ad - 1500ad.
 
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